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Old 12-26-2019, 05:46 PM #169
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just curious as to why paint manufactures wont chime in on any of this? as paintball evolves paint generally seems to be getting worse. markers are 1000% better than ever before, and the opposite is happening with paint.
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Old 12-26-2019, 05:51 PM #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul77 View Post
just curious as to why paint manufactures wont chime in on any of this? as paintball evolves paint generally seems to be getting worse. markers are 1000% better than ever before, and the opposite is happening with paint.
You know why they won't talk about it. We'll eat them alive, and then go to our FPO fields, and be forced to buy it anyhow. It doesn't matter how bad paint is, because there's hardly competition between the brands.
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Old 12-27-2019, 12:56 AM #171
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It’s cost cutting and saving money...

When they can get GI for $20 a case and sell it for $50 why would anyone buy other more expensive paint?

I know I would but most regular people wouldn’t pay extra for better paint.

I’ve even had multiple people at my field try to convince the owner to stop getting GI paint or at least get something better than Custom Blend and he won’t...


Quote:
Originally Posted by WillyW0nka View Post
I’ve had the exact opposite experience with GI/Empire paint. Empire Custom blend and GI 3-Star have been my go-to for local/rec play for the last couple years. Outside of one bad batch of 5-star that was hard as a rock, the only “bad” paint I’ve used was the absolute bottom of the barrel cheap field paint. Everything else was at the worst, mediocre.

Paint as a whole has been getting smaller industry-wide, but the largest bore paint I’ve used recently has been GI 5-star. It was sticking in a .687, to the point where a .689 was required. Practically unheard of these days. But outside of that, Evil has been consistently .684-.687 and I’d shoot it over pretty much anything.

GI paint is fine, especially compared to everything else on the market. The paint being damaged, dimpled, etc. is probably due to how people are storing it and how old the batch is.
No.

As said, it is stored properly and comes in that way: with extra oil, fuzz, and broken paint.

Here I’ve had to use my .692 all last summer because it was boring so large and was so brittle.

Seems like you are the only one getting good GI paint...
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Old 12-27-2019, 03:34 AM #172
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My paint has been 676-685, varying dramatically ball to ball in the same bag. I haven't seen a large bore ball from gi in years.


Speaks to their consistancy I guess.

I'm so tired of cleaning the white fuzz stuff off the inside of my loader/pods but then local fields are FPO GI paint. I've asked and bought fresh paint the same day as delivery and it was still oily.
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Old 12-27-2019, 10:15 AM #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul77 View Post
just curious as to why paint manufactures wont chime in on any of this? as paintball evolves paint generally seems to be getting worse. markers are 1000% better than ever before, and the opposite is happening with paint.
What would you like them, GI, to chime in on? I'll try and put something together for anyone with good, direct, no-nonsense questions.
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Old 12-27-2019, 10:29 AM #174
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Seems like you are the only one getting good GI paint...
well, I don't think that's true. It's just that people how have good experiences tend to talk (type) less than those that have bad experiences.

As for the GI paint - you get what you pay for. As players if you demand cheap paint at your field then that's exactly what you get. If you're willing to pay a little more or perhaps the field is committed to creating a great experience then perhaps you'll shoot a better grade of paint.

I know that at my field we are FPO but our field paint is a 3-star and we also offer 4 and 5 star most weekends too. Out belief is that by offering a better grade of field paint our customer will have a better experience and are more likely to come back. That's not to say every bag is perfect or every skids of issue free, but overall I feel the paint as been much better the past several years (with the exception of the fuzz that builds up in various places.
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Old 12-27-2019, 10:30 AM #175
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Originally Posted by 4leaf4life View Post
What would you like them, GI, to chime in on? I'll try and put something together for anyone with good, direct, no-nonsense questions.
The only question I have is "what is being done about the fuzz?" This seems like a very solvable issue.
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Old 12-27-2019, 10:36 AM #176
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I would just like a good answer on why paint over time is getting so small?
We have been playing .67 caliber for about the last ~12 years it seems.
Even if the answer is simply "smaller balls = we can make more paint with the same amount of materials to maximize yield".

EDIT: To clarify, this isn't just a G.I. question either, this is all paint manufacturers. I first really started to notice this with Marbs even before the formula/shell was changed well prior to G.I. buying out KEE.

Last edited by Kazer : 12-27-2019 at 10:39 AM.
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Old 12-27-2019, 11:02 AM #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dualimpact View Post
My paint has been 676-685, varying dramatically ball to ball in the same bag. I haven't seen a large bore ball from gi in years.


Speaks to their consistancy I guess.

I'm so tired of cleaning the white fuzz stuff off the inside of my loader/pods but then local fields are FPO GI paint. I've asked and bought fresh paint the same day as delivery and it was still oily.
this times 100.
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Old 12-27-2019, 04:04 PM #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox4paintball View Post
The only question I have is "what is being done about the fuzz?" This seems like a very solvable issue.
Completely agreed. The local field I play at most in central Illinois uses 4 star for tournaments and 3 star or custom blend for practice days/rec play. Iíd say 90% of the time or better Iím happy with the paint, aside from having to clean the fuzz out of my gun and loader about every 2 cases. Iíve personally experienced and heard many complaints from guys having gun issues midway through xball tournaments because of the fuzz buildup causing bolt stick issues and issues with the eyes in their guns.
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Old 12-27-2019, 04:07 PM #179
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What would you like them, GI, to chime in on? I'll try and put something together for anyone with good, direct, no-nonsense questions.
As stated by some users already

1. Oil or no oil in the paint bag? I know Nelson does this, just curious as to why? My WPN, Pro-Shar doesnít do this.

2. Why is the paint of now so small compared to 15 years ago? Is it a way to save a few tenths of a cent on each ball from less material being used?

3. Kaser asked what the fuzz on the GI paint is from?

4. Why canít Gi make Marbs and premium in the same formulation as it was in the late 90ís when it was rp scherer? Instead of making it like the gi paints.

5. Is all gi paint made in Quebec? Or is any of it from overseas.

6 why is field sometimes a more like 3 star? Is this because there was an overrun of 3 star so it gets boxed as field? This has been an issue for us fields as it doesnít work well in 98ís.
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Old 12-27-2019, 04:37 PM #180
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This...

The valken graffiti I shot last month was dry, round and packaged well. I’m just glad I have a field I can go to that offers both.
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Old 12-28-2019, 11:52 PM #181
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Finished off the case of Graffiti I was running today and bought a case of the fields "premium" paint which was a box of Empire. Upon opening the box, it was El Tigre. I filled the hopper and five pods with the new paint and went out to the field. At somewhere between 50-100 shots in, I had one break in the barrel. Ambient temps were 60-62į while we were on field today. I'd forgot to bring the barrel swab on field so I walked off to clean things up.

I waited for the match to end and refilled the loader. My buddy was out of paint so we refilled his loader and 2.5 pods with my paint. I fired another 50-100 rounds without issue before I was hit but he went considerably longer but had three more breaks. We're both shooting 170Rs and havent had an issue in 2.5 cases Graffiti between us. Until today, we were shooting in 37-42į temps with the Graffiti without issue. The only other thing I observed was that our pods were covered in oil and we didn't have any of this prior to the "Empire" paint.

The El Tigre took more effort to break throwing by hand than the Graffiti (if I held the Graffiti over my head and dropped it, most of them broke but none of the El Tigre did). I didnt measure the El Tigre but I was shooting the stock .689 of the 170R and my buddy was shooting with a .685 back. Wish I'd checked that but it's a variable I don't know now.

Are there any issues playing at these temps with this paint (I cant imagine that is the case)? Is the paint considerably larger than what we were using for barrels that may have been an issue? Why is it so oily? Our pods, loaders, and barrels are covered in it. Why? The field charged $70 for the case and I gave 1200-1300 rounds away because I refused to shoot any more of it through my gun. Total waste of money. I wont use it again and the likelihood of me using a GI product again over Valken is extremely unlikely.
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Old 12-30-2019, 09:08 PM #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4leaf4life View Post
What would you like them, GI, to chime in on? I'll try and put something together for anyone with good, direct, no-nonsense questions.
Why so much oil in the bags?

Why is it inconsistent box to box from batch to batch? Do they aim for different specs? (I'm not being an ***, just asking). Same bag of paint can have huge difference in size, rendering is impossible to shoot pump or cocker and then the next box the sizing is dead on. It's almost like they bagged paint from different machines and the tolerances led to the sizing discrepancy.


Orange fill for draxxus gold and custom fill 4/5 star is the ****. Love the pink but holy hell it stains the skin, luckily not clothes.
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Old 12-31-2019, 10:32 AM #183
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Lately the GI SPORTZ field paint has been really good. Flies straight, consistently round, doesn’t break in the marker, hits are visible. I used premium on Sunday and it was close to graffiti I thought. I haven’t had to be too picky lately so that’s a good sign imo. In the past it was inconsistent but this year was definitely an improvement.
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Old 01-02-2020, 03:07 PM #184
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I hate the fuzz the most. Prevents my orings from making 100% seals.

Their 5 year old video doesn't really show any part of the paintball making process that would introduce the fuzz. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbuwu51kdw4

Edit: actually there's a lot of towels and paper towels around the encapsulation machines. @2:24 with clip holding it to the rail. @2:40 @3:13 towels everywhere. @3:35 probably leaving fibers that rotate on the drum on to the outside of the shell sheet. @3:42 @3:56 on the rotating drum again. @4:05 @4:09 @4:31 @4:40 @4:46
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Old 01-02-2020, 03:18 PM #185
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I hate the fuzz the most. Prevents my orings from making 100% seals.

Their 5 year old video doesn't really show any part of the paintball making process that would introduce the fuzz. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbuwu51kdw4
I believe it comes from the mats used in the drying process.
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Old 01-28-2020, 11:50 AM #186
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Answer to questions about Paintballs.

These questions are being answered by Dave 'Opie' Thomas, John Rathbun, and Nick Slowiak.

1. Oil or no oil in the paint bag? Why do we sometimes see 'oil' in a bag of paint?

The oil usually is residue from the oil used to lubricate the gel during the manufacturing process.


2. Why is the paint of now so small compared to 15 years ago? Is it a way to save a few tenths of a cent on each ball from less material being used?

To explain sizing a little; The Poles are always smaller than the seam. The sizing can only be controlled within a range of no less than 6 thou. (Seam Sizing For Ex: .684 to .690 and pole sizing .655 to .665). The Procaps/GI Sportz factory has historically made slightly smaller balls because a small ball will always make it out of a gun whereas a big one can break in the barrel or bolt system causing a larger problem. In the last year we have pushed our sizing up to a larger range.

The competitive market continued to shrink the size of paint for costing reasons and went as far as manufacturers making small barrels to compensate. Today, the recreational player doesn’t carry a barrel kit and has a hard time supporting a larger bore paintball. We have attempted this in numerous waves over the years and every time we are held to the resistance that the paint is now “too big”. That causes returns and continued loss of margin, the industry as whole needs to agree to go back that direction.


3. What is the fuzz on the GI paint, what is it from?

The fuzz is from the rags used to absorb the process oil from the outside of the balls during the drying process. We are currently working on lessening the lint. We're working on reducing the oil from the machines thus reducing the rags needed.


4. Why can’t GI make Marbs and Premium in the same formulation as it was in the late 90’s when it was RP Scherer?


First, all paintballs today are made differently than in those times for a variety of reasons. One most influential reason is the constant demand for cheaper priced paintballs combined with higher expectations of quality and service. We are the only industry that constantly reduces sell price while the rest of the world is charging more now than ever.

Marbs is made the same way, it's the agitating of the gel that made the swirl that's different. Beyond that the fill/formulation is the same.


5. Is all GI paint made in Quebec? Or is any of it from overseas?

All GI Paint is made in Quebec.


6. Why are Field boxes sometimes a more like 3 star ball? Is this because there was an overrun of 3 star so it gets boxed as Field?

We make custom formulated balls that are placed in 3 different boxes based on the requested performance and price point demanded by the market. GI Field, GI Custom and Empire Custom Blend. You can find anything from a 1 Star formulated ball to a 5 star formulated ball in these boxes. Generally the GI Field is usually 1 to 3 star formulated and the Custom Blend and GI Custom can be anything from 2 star to 5 star. This is all based on your local fields request for the type of paint they want to be used at their park for the customer base.

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Old 01-28-2020, 01:54 PM #187
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These questions are being answered by Dave 'Opie' Thomas, John Rathbun, and Nick Slowiak.
thank you for that, our gi 1 star shot decent this past weekend.
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Old 01-28-2020, 01:55 PM #188
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3. What is the fuzz on the GI paint, what is it from?

The fuzz is from the rags used to absorb the process oil from the outside of the balls during the drying process. We are currently working on lessening the lint. We're working on reducing the oil from the machines thus reducing the rags needed.



LIES you're using Canadian Goose down to gently caress the oil off the paint...that's the fuzz.
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Old 01-28-2020, 04:04 PM #189
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Yeah ill be honest. The field paint at my local field is shooting well. They went from a GI field custom to a 3 star. Great choice.
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