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Old 05-24-2020, 09:44 PM #2332
Big Papa Pink
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The LV 1.6 does shoot stupid good ... but they shoot the same as all LVs I have shot. Smooth, quiet, with the bonus of a user serviceable solenoid. I just prefer single tube markers, but the 1.6 is still on the list to pick up.

Also played today ... shot a CS2 all day. Not a big crowd, tried a new field to me ... probably will not go back. So far, Nitro is still in the lead here in Georgia.
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Old 05-24-2020, 10:47 PM #2333
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That LV1.6 looks cool. Been daydreaming of getting one and shooting it at stock settings, no dialing it in. My tuning is seemingly like a curse for guns that use an LPR. Blackrain, do you know if that 1.6 had been tuned any? Iím currently still waiting for my Geo 4 to arrive.

So bout dem Clones... swapped the XTSís Infinity Drive into my Clone 5. Outcome? 90 percent amazing, 10 percent possible problem. It now has a nasty fsdo and would shoot two balls as a result leading to a break. Turning off the eyes to cycle a shot without paint led to a problem, Iíd get this question mark instead of the eyes registering a ball, and Millennium Ramp felt more like 8 bps. I did this to get past the fsdo and breaking paint issue but it ended up messing things up...

Anyways I played like that most of the day, even after using the DSR and XTS, because it shot so good. It was like if I was giving an inch to shoot someone it was nailing those shots, and that accuracy was reproducible all day. Gaining dominance was a numerous occurrence as well, Iíd snap out and my paint was putting my guy in. Lanes off break were weak though due to the compromised ROF. Imped and I have talked about this before, the Clone just has this knack for shooting paint that science canít explain. My only plausible theory is the hand placement, both hands are near the same horizontal line, whereas some guns might have a hand placed higher or lower then the other... Hope that makes sense?

Clone Infinity cont.
GI Sportz Field paint vs APX. GI takes it. Iím going to give APX another shot next week. Today though the GI Sportz field paint was shooting great, accurate and wasnít breaking. Barrel being used was a .688 Dye UL-s back with a 16Ē front. The Infinity Drive in the Clone body, set to a low dwell of 10 ( guess Dwell is inconsequential to the Infinity Drive ), the fantastic shot character, good paint, just made for a superb tack driver of a gun. Handing it over to my teammate to show him how good it was, he was blown away by how accurate it shot. Iíd say with confidence this is one of the best shooting guns Iíve ever had, even with the problems- and thatís why I kept using it.

Field One Force
I got to hold and shoot one today. Kind of hard to process the impression. It reminded me of an older shooting gun.. the shot feel is very subtle thus making it a smooth shooter, it is quiet, it does feel very solid. It did break a ball while I shot it.. I donít know. Not enough time to give it a proper review.

Prime XTS
I had the Clone 5s Drive in it and well... it was not good. Broke a lot of paint and reached for the DSR and then back to the Clone Infinity. Apparently the Prime with C5s Drive needs higher Dwell to cycle properly. Iíll swap back to the Infinity Drive, I want to dial in the XTS once and for all and leave it alone. Still going to be a toss up between the Clone and Prime, which says a lot of how good the Clone still is.
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Old 05-24-2020, 11:24 PM #2334
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Originally Posted by Big Papa Pink View Post
The LV 1.6 does shoot stupid good ... but they shoot the same as all LVs I have shot. Smooth, quiet, with the bonus of a user serviceable solenoid. I just prefer single tube markers, but the 1.6 is still on the list to pick up.
Totally agree, I think the fact that it was new and exciting helped.

I shot a friends lv1.5 that was well tuned, and shot like the 1.6. I do think the one I shot today was pretty much out of the box. But I didn’t get to shoot more than a hopper out of it. If I have the opposite check into it.

I’m a big LV fan, so seeing the 1.6 was fun today. An early LV1 I had was setup poorly at first before I set it up to how a LV should shoot with the super smooth shot.

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Old 05-24-2020, 11:57 PM #2335
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Finally played Saturday with my fully complete Emek and man, I feel like it is almost too good now. The new sleek lightweight body makes it feel super light, sleek and nimble and the hAir 45/Fang trigger combo is just crazy fast.

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Old 05-25-2020, 07:33 AM #2336
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Nice Mr. Stealthy.

That Deadlywind HAir Valve certainly does shorten the Trigger pull a lot and allow for a few extra BPS in my experiences.

If I really get on the trigger I can probably shoot at least 12-13 bps*! Definitely too much for recball.

*While walking the trigger. Yes, I can walk my EMEK’s single trigger now with 2 fingers lol.
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Old 05-25-2020, 05:10 PM #2337
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Nice Mr. Stealthy.

That Deadlywind HAir Valve certainly does shorten the Trigger pull a lot and allow for a few extra BPS in my experiences.

If I really get on the trigger I can probably shoot at least 12-13 bps*! Definitely too much for recball.

*While walking the trigger. Yes, I can walk my EMEKís single trigger now with 2 fingers lol.
I cant really walk mine comfortably, but it shoots as fast as I can twitch my finger. It feels really no different than shooting an electro with one finger.
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Old 05-25-2020, 05:43 PM #2338
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Yeah, I agree that it feels pretty much just like an electronic trigger.

In fact, after I had set mine up and was getting ready to test it, I didn’t have the safety on (no Paintballs loaded either, thank Jeebus) and just bumped my PAL EMEK and it went off, bumped it again and it went off again!

Super light trigger pull!
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Old 05-25-2020, 09:00 PM #2339
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My Geo 4 came in the mail over the weekend, was able to get to the field yesterday and play finally!!! First impressions right out of the box were just how comfortable it felt in my hands and how nicely it pointed. The combination of the CS1 styled fore grip with the CS2 styled grip frame is just perfect for me. I hated how uncomfortably bulky the CS1-1.5 were, really turned me off to the platform for a while.

On the field the GEO shot great all day no issues, only thing I did was turn the SFR all the way down. First couple ropes I put thru it I knew I was shooting a GEO, that famous geo puff was music to my ears. Shot wise in the beginning I thought it was a little rough for a GEO, granted this is brand new right out of the box. But I pulled the bolt and reg out and it looked light on grease, so I re-greased everything which definitely helped smooth it out a bit. Towards the end of the day I let my friends and a lot of the other curious local players shoot it quite a bit. Most of the feedback I got from them was all the same.... shoots and sounds just like a GEO should, but finally has the ergonomics to bring the package all together perfectly. Some said it’s more appealing to them now that the AT pipe is gone, feels and looks more natural.

After about 3 cases on the first outing it didn’t skip a beat, can’t wait to see how its shot feels in a couple more cases when I can start dwell tuning after the orings break in a bit. Was planning on doing a proper efficiency test sometime this week, wondering if bore matched and using quality paint I could get 12 pods or more on a 80/4500 fill? Overall so far I’m quite impressed with the GEO 4, never thought I’d say it but looks like my ICE and 3.5 will be taking a backseat this season.
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Old 05-25-2020, 10:04 PM #2340
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Quote:
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My Geo 4 came in the mail over the weekend, was able to get to the field yesterday and play finally!!! First impressions right out of the box were just how comfortable it felt in my hands and how nicely it pointed. The combination of the CS1 styled fore grip with the CS2 styled grip frame is just perfect for me. I hated how uncomfortably bulky the CS1-1.5 were, really turned me off to the platform for a while.

On the field the GEO shot great all day no issues, only thing I did was turn the SFR all the way down. First couple ropes I put thru it I knew I was shooting a GEO, that famous geo puff was music to my ears. Shot wise in the beginning I thought it was a little rough for a GEO, granted this is brand new right out of the box. But I pulled the bolt and reg out and it looked light on grease, so I re-greased everything which definitely helped smooth it out a bit. Towards the end of the day I let my friends and a lot of the other curious local players shoot it quite a bit. Most of the feedback I got from them was all the same.... shoots and sounds just like a GEO should, but finally has the ergonomics to bring the package all together perfectly. Some said itís more appealing to them now that the AT pipe is gone, feels and looks more natural.

After about 3 cases on the first outing it didnít skip a beat, canít wait to see how its shot feels in a couple more cases when I can start dwell tuning after the orings break in a bit. Was planning on doing a proper efficiency test sometime this week, wondering if bore matched and using quality paint I could get 12 pods or more on a 80/4500 fill? Overall so far Iím quite impressed with the GEO 4, never thought Iíd say it but looks like my ICE and 3.5 will be taking a backseat this season.
I wouldnít fuss with the dwell. It is not going to impact performance and you are more likely to get it out of its proper regime. The bore match/underbore should help some with efficiency.
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Old 05-26-2020, 02:48 AM #2341
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I think itís safe to say already that the Geo 4 is going to climb the heap and relegate a lot of playerís ďgo toĒ markers to BST pages or back up status. Add another strong contender in the minimum fuss with field of markers, Ice, CS2, DSR, etc. If my Geo 4 doesnít end up being my main, I might end up selling it. If what Iím hearing is true, you donít want your PE guns sitting idle too long because the solenoids really thrive on regular use. Use it or lose it.

This makes me wonder how PE will up the ante with the CS line, and the gamma pro core.
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Old 05-26-2020, 06:39 AM #2342
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I wouldnít fuss with the dwell. It is not going to impact performance and you are more likely to get it out of its proper regime. The bore match/underbore should help some with efficiency.
It's actually got a decently wide dwell window, but it's a function of where you've got the SFR set. The more open the SFR, the lower the dwell can be ran. With that said, lowering the dwell won't do anything for efficiency since the breech-sensing valve isolates the chamber from flowing regardless of dwell time. Personally, I lower the dwell to sharpen up the shot response, in conjunction with running the SFR open. With an underbore and SFR open, the Geo 4 (or any CS1) should be able to get 12 pods from an 80ci but it'll be close. I've done 10x 165 round Virtue pods and a Spire 3 from an 88ci tank.
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If what Iím hearing is true, you donít want your PE guns sitting idle too long because the solenoids really thrive on regular use. Use it or lose it.
That only applies to the old MAC solenoids used in the LV and pre-CS Geos. The SMC solenoids used in the CS1+ are bulletproof and don't care.
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Old 05-26-2020, 06:47 AM #2343
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Clarification on Clone

Imped has been messaging me about my lengthy post on the Clone 5s and Infinity Drive, and I had made some mistakes and wrote some misinformation. Also got a PM asking a Clone 5s question and figured I would sort of make a clean up and more accurate post about the Clone. Please excuse any lazy writing, and further mistakes ( which Iíll go back and fix haha ) Iíve been up a while.

-Clone 5s Drive can operate at a lower dwell but when breaking in new seals, up the Dwell, it will be more reliable. Once seals are worn in you can start playing with the Dwell setting and lowering it. In my case, I bet I would eliminate my fsdo with a higher Dwell setting, ( but at a Dwell of 10 itís so smooth, hardly any kick). Imped suggested running the Dwell at 15ms till the seals are broken in.

-Infinity Drive is Dwell sensitive. But it can run at a low Dwell setting. Maybe Imped can comment further on this.

-I ordered a Clone 5s last week and in hindsight shouldíve ordered the Clone Infinity. Luckily Ryan Podesta said it will come with both drives. Iíll most likely run the Infinity Drive, now that I know it shoots so good.

-ďWhy not just use my XTS?Ē I know right? For some reason the Clone 5 ergos always let me be very accurate and I want to explore this more. Who knows? Maybe Iíll end up liking the results with the C5 better then the XTS. And I think I said to myself that if this gun shoots this good for how cheap they are, get another one, and in black like you always wanted. So I let my teammates know to grab one before they become somewhat scarce, Iíll order as much spare parts and stuff to keep em humming for as long as can be.

And thatís that for now.

Coming soon for me... revisiting the Dye M3. From one love affair to the next...
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Old 05-26-2020, 08:40 AM #2344
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Like we've discussed, I don't see any reason to run the C5 drive *unless you need the added efficiency that it offers.* The cycling reliability improvements made to the Infinity make it the better choice for the masses and while the C5 drive reliability can be improved, it won't be quite at the same point as the Infinity. With that said, you know I like the C5 drive but I've got to look at things from perspectives other than my own when I make recommendations.

Dwell recommendations, regardless of what body either drive are in:

Infinity: 10-12ms
C5: 12-15ms

And yes, I do think you should continue to use the M3. It's a sexual machine.
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Old 05-26-2020, 09:39 AM #2345
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I have no idea why anyone would want to tune their Dwell down?

It’s not like it’s going to save much (if any) air.

It’s more likely to cause inconsistency and you might need to raise the HPR pressure in order to shoot at the same velocity - which would make the marker a little bit harder on Paint.

No advantages to tuning Dwell down in my opinion and experiences.
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Old 05-26-2020, 11:27 AM #2346
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I have no idea why anyone would want to tune their Dwell down?

It’s not like it’s going to save much (if any) air.

It’s more likely to cause inconsistency and you might need to raise the HPR pressure in order to shoot at the same velocity - which would make the marker a little bit harder on Paint.

No advantages to tuning Dwell down in my opinion and experiences.
What marker are you referring to?

You'll only need to compensate with higher pressure if you lower the dwell below the system's critical threshold. PE, for example, dials in a pretty large safety margin into their designs. The IV Core critical-dwells at around 15ms and the factory default dwell setting is almost double that. That's one big reason PE markers are so reliable and why they "always work." Shift time.

High dwell and a decoupled design that allows you to run high dwell without wasting gas and low/controlled bolt speed to be gentle on paint. PE figured that out around 7 years ago and they've stuck to it.

Personally, I run 20ms (and SFR wide open) in my IV Core markers because I prefer how it feels.

The Infinity Drive is dwell-sensitive, FYI. The critical dwell point is at 8-9ms from what I've found. Setting it to 10ms is a good spot for efficiency, reliability and consistency. If you don't care about efficiency, bump it up. The C5 drive tends to prefer a little more dwell and, IMO, shouldn't be squeezed too hard otherwise it'll cycle poorly. My dwell recommendations of 12-15ms reflect that. I run mine on the high end of that scale.

Don't worry, Charles....I wouldn't allow poor cycling reliability, inconsistency, poor paint handling or any other negative characteristics to creep into my gear. But, I don't like a laggy shot and I like to shoot a lot of paint. I setup my stuff accordingly.
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Old 05-26-2020, 11:36 AM #2347
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I turn the dwell down for shot smoothness. Was able to drop the dwell on my 3.5 once it was broken in a couple seconds and made it even smoother. I remember a while back watching Cnoddings on YouTube dwell tune his GEO 3. Just curious if this GEO4 can somehow shoot even smoother than it does already. If not, can easily put it right back to stock.
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Old 05-26-2020, 11:48 AM #2348
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I turn the dwell down for shot smoothness. Was able to drop the dwell on my 3.5 once it was broken in a couple seconds and made it even smoother. I remember a while back watching Cnoddings on YouTube dwell tune his GEO 3. Just curious if this GEO4 can somehow shoot even smoother than it does already. If not, can easily put it right back to stock.
I don't care much about smoothness, but to some people a snappier, shorter cycle is smoother, while to others a longer more drawn out cycle is smoother. The Geo 4 (and all Geos) can be setup either way. High dwell/low SFR, reduced dwell/high SFR or anywhere in between.
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Old 05-29-2020, 05:24 AM #2349
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Personally, I run 20ms (and SFR wide open) in my IV Core markers because I prefer how it feels.
And when you say "wide open" on that IV Core SFR, you mean the vertical (12 o'clock) SFR setting for max exhaust flow, correct?
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Old 05-29-2020, 07:52 AM #2350
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And when you say "wide open" on that IV Core SFR, you mean the vertical (12 o'clock) SFR setting for max exhaust flow, correct?
That's correct. Open = no restriction.
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Old 06-01-2020, 10:01 PM #2351
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Quick Update

No rain, mid 60ís temp, high humidity as always.
APX Basic paint, seemed to bore close to or under .684, shot two cases.
= No breaks all day.

Markers Used:

-Prime XTS
Still need to tweak a setting to get it into ramp at the proper speed. Iíve got it set to 10.3 bps but it shoots more like 9 bps. Still a great shooter and still one of my favorites.

-M3+s
Installed the M3s manifold and it shoots real nice. Also replaced the board due to the Microswitch going out. I think it was from the nasty crash it went through last year. Something about the overall design of the gun gives it an unbelievably consistent and accurate lane/ramp. Will test this one out more.

-CS2PRO
Got a secret new component Iím testing in here I canít reveal yet, but so far since itís been installed I havenít broken one ball and Iím quit happy about that. I tightened up the shot group of the gun by going with a .684 Dye UL-s back, making it much more accurate imo. Still not as accurate with it, my eyes see my ball heading straight towards the lens of a mask but then it drops below right before, hitting the bunker instead. This was very frustrating and I ended up losing all my 1 v 1ís at the end of the day. Otherwise I do really enjoy using this marker, itís very easy to shoot a lot of paint with, and very comfortable in the hands- hardly any fatigue over a long day- and yes I ended up using this most of the day.

-Clone Infinity
Got this new one just in time. The trigger needs to be adjusted and debounce set properly- Iíd get it into ramp and it would get stuck into ramp ( full auto ) unless I pushed the trigger forward and kept it there. Funny enough though I ended up getting two kills on the snake side a little bit easier because of this. Yes it caught me by surprise but I just adapted, I ended up just feeding pod after pod and that constant paint being laid down really does make a difference. After that point I stopped using it knowing I needed to adjust it and make it ďlegalĒ. Itís not as comfortable as my modified ( single trigger frame ) Clone 5 or Prime XTS- the knob on the asa can be felt and it makes it uncomfortable. But the Infinity Drive is legit, it ranks among the smooth shooters fairly easy. Iíd like to make another single trigger frame out of this one if I choose to keep it, but I think Iíll probably sell it... just realizing that the XTS is all thatís needed when it comes to owning an Infinity Drive based marker.

Down The Pike
Still waiting for my Geo 4 to arrive. Kind of have my eye on that LV1.6.
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2020 Setup:
-Prime XTS, Powerhouse Haymkr Reg, HK 80/4500 Tank, Spire 3 Loader, and Dye UL-s barrel. [ speedball ]
-Gtek M170R, Powerhouse Haymkr Reg, HK 80/4500 Tank, Dye R2 Loader, and Dye UL-s barrel. [ woodsball ]
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Old 06-02-2020, 02:16 PM #2352
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-CS2PRO
Got a secret new component Iím testing in here I canít reveal yet, but so far since itís been installed I havenít broken one ball and Iím quit happy about that.

Interesting....
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