[rluna]

Information to be taken from various posts will either be copied in here or linked to from here.

About the LPR / reseting the regs - Jack's reply to people asking questions about the LPR

There is a zone where the Deception shoots best. Because the Rammer weighs so little and the surface area of rammer is smaller than other rammer guns "riding the line" on lowest LPR isn't necessary, or best.

To reset the regs. check to make sure the Dwell is high enough. 8 is high enough.

Turn the front screw out so 3 or 4 threads show. Turn out the bottom reg so one or two threads show.

Air up the gun (put the bottle in and point the lever straight back) and air will release but bolt will still be loose.

Now, set the gun with almost no threads showing in the bottom of the front grip (the LPR). Looking at the gun from the front, you see just a little of the screw - most all the threads gone.

Next screw in the bottom reg until the gun shoots at the desired speed.

Now turn out the LPR until the ball speed drops - a lot. The gun stores a lot of air so take a couple of shots between turns or air can turn off completely and double feed balls.

OK. now you have the gun shooting, but not at full speed - almost there.

There is a range between full speed, and increased kick - a kind of a safety zone. A playable area.

Now note how much you have to turn the front screw in until the gun seems to shoot full speed, the start of the playable zone, and how much more until it become noticeably kicky.
Find the middle of that range. In the middle somewhere is where you want the gun.
Because most Rammer guns are so sensitive to LPR pressure, players have been taught to use the very lowest LPR setting. With the Deception you will get the best results by kind of stepping back and shooting 30 or so shots and finding where the the performance starts to drop off and where the kick starts.

Most all of what feels like kick is recoil form the ball leaving the barrel. That will be there no matter how low the LPR is set. Lowering the LPR just drops the ball speed. But a little higher LPR pressure adds consistency and improves shot quality. So again don't try to ride the line. Find the zone and set the gun somewhere in the middle of it. The Deception will be very smooth and very consistent.

After this you can try lowering the dwell until consistency or ball speed drops and then raise it until both are back.

Now don't adjust LPR or Dwell again - just change speed with bottle reg.

Tank Output Pressure

The gun doesn't like 850 input pressure
450 is good, but SLP tanks are definitely best.

If you have an 850 bottle (few players that have premium markers do) and check the owners manual to see how low the bottle's output can be set.

(about supporting higher output tanks) We'll look into it. A stronger spring should be all that is needed, but that takes away from consistency. The gun may need a separate spring and piston for 850 tanks.

~ Alien

[rluna]

Reserved

[brian_s30z]

Thanks. Needed this.

[SringleShrot]

Seconded! Thanks for the write-up, love this marker.

[imped4now]

I got my hands on another Deception and while giving it a full rebuild decided to measure/record factory seal sizes, as well as note alternate sizes (red font) that I feel improve over certain factory sizes. I know this has been requested in the past, so here you go.

Note: Assume buna-nitrile (durometer 70) unless otherwise specified.

Bolt
Port seals (x2): 013 -->014 or 2x10

Note: The factory seals seem to be a 013 and make virtually no contact on the body bore. Bumping up one size to a 014 or to a 2x10 allow the seals to actually seal against their bore. Obviously, you're dealing with several tolerances in this location so results may vary. Choose a seal that provides a positive bore seal without excessively dragging.

Ram
Switch: 010 --> 2x5mm
Housing ID front: 011 --> 011 X Ring
Cap front (friction): 010 --> 2x7mm
Cap rear (friction): 010 --> 1.5x7mm
Ram housing OD (x4): 013

Note: The two friction seals are about useless from the factory. The alternate sizes do their job much better. As for the housing ID front seal, an X Ring makes a lot of sense there due to its lube holding ability, durability and improved support. For the ram switch, I felt that the 010 had too loose of a fit in the housing bore, which can allow blow-by and require higher LPR pressure to reach the same results.

Regulators
HPR Piston: 012
LPR Piston: 010

Air transfer
Valve chamber (the big oblong one): TBD
LPR transfer seal (tiny one in very front): 1x2mm
2x seals in front of solenoid: 1x3mm

Valve
Front spool seal: 011 --> 011 X Ring (for the same reason as ram housing)
Rear spool seal: 011 urethane (buna will work but urethane resists nibbling better)
Cap (friction): 012 --> 2x8mm
Housing OD: 1x12mm (the thin one) and 012 urethane (the thick one)

Update 1/26/2021:

HPR Component Order:

Front: Cap --> Brass washer --> spring --> piston (seal end forward)

Believe it or not, I've now seen one installed in the reverse order.

Regulator valve cores:

HPR: M10

LPR: M8

These are commonly found at auto parts stores, Amazon, eBay, etc. I also recommend the proper removal/installation tool.

[Big Papa Pink]

Wow, thanks for the info! This is awesome!