could an aardy tech PLEASE explain the bolt kit? - PbNation
Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

 
Archived Thread - Cannot Edit  
Old 03-28-2002, 10:34 AM #1
morpheusZ
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: burbs, new york
morpheusZ is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
could an aardy tech PLEASE explain the bolt kit?

i think its been long enough into this product's run that you can finaly tell us exactly what its doing. no one here wants to steal your design. anyone with the power to do so and actually market it would have just bought one of yours and figured out the differences. most of us here tho don't have enough money to just buy a bolt kit to cross section so we can see how it works. for the love of god, just explain it to us so we can understand a little better. there are 4 trillion versions of your kit, plus the tmc one. you say the tmc works different? enlighten us, how so? let us know what the difference is between your kits and a stock kit, so we can finaly get this.
morpheusZ is offline  
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 03-28-2002, 02:08 PM #2
salmanilla2000
 
 
salmanilla2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bay Area California
 has been a member for 10 years
That's a good question.

Wish I had a great answer.
__________________
Is it Friday yet?
salmanilla2000 is offline  
Old 03-28-2002, 04:42 PM #3
elTwitcho
***** ***** *****
 
elTwitcho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Toronto Canada
 has been a member for 10 years
You'll apologize if I'm not an aardvark tech, but basically it transfers air more effiicienty. To quote fatty, the valve opens with more "pop". This results in increased efficiency. I'm sure the actual area that opens up when gas is transfered to the breech (ie, when the gun fires) has larger passages or transfers or whatever. That's my understanding into efficiency at least, I could be wrong, and then I could be right
__________________
ST:Photo - Trust me, you made a wrong turn

A Haiku about Life - By Secret Asian Man
twitch slaps me around
he likes to make me his *****
Because of small cock
elTwitcho is offline  
Old 03-29-2002, 01:55 AM #4
Gabe
SuperPimp
 
Gabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Toronto, Canada
 has been a member for 10 years
You're probably wrong
Gabe is offline  
Old 03-29-2002, 07:16 PM #5
SIGG
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Saint John NB
 has been a member for 10 years
could it be the back wall being make wide enough to work properly?
SIGG is offline  
Old 03-29-2002, 09:18 PM #6
DuMb-KiD-dReW
ACPP Forever
 
DuMb-KiD-dReW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Waterloo, Ont
DuMb-KiD-dReW is a founding member
Sorry boys we wont be realsing that info any time soon. If this info was given out any company could copy our designs or improve others ie tmc/air tech indastries. So thats just plain out stupid of us to releash vital info like that. Your welcome to compare blue to red to red/ blue to red/blue/grey kits cause some thing are easy to spot and other you would not know we changed .


DKD
DuMb-KiD-dReW is offline  
Old 03-29-2002, 09:22 PM #7
Spectre123
 
 
Spectre123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
 has been a member for 10 years
ahh you're no fun DKD
Spectre123 is offline  
Old 04-10-2002, 03:20 PM #8
CRUCIATUS
nothing
 
CRUCIATUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dirty Souff!!
CRUCIATUS is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
so what is the difference in all the colors,,i am about to buy a matrix,,but dont know the diff in color. Some say its just a color change,,some say there is a performance change. Also,,if i get a matrix now, when can i buy a bolt from aardvarck,,my understanding is that they are closed?
CRUCIATUS is offline  
Old 04-10-2002, 03:31 PM #9
CRUCIATUS
nothing
 
CRUCIATUS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Dirty Souff!!
CRUCIATUS is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
so what is the difference in all the colors,,i am about to buy a matrix,,but dont know the diff in color. Some say its just a color change,,some say there is a performance change. Also,,if i get a matrix now, when can i buy a bolt from aardvarck,,my understanding is that they are closed?
CRUCIATUS is offline  
Old 04-10-2002, 05:03 PM #10
Xx_One$hot_xX
AnGeLKiLLa
 
Xx_One$hot_xX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Queens, NY
Xx_One$hot_xX is a Supporting Member
Xx_One$hot_xX is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
LOL...ok enough of the "I SPY". JEEZ!!! Well put it like this...jus take your old bolt kit measure the tolerences. Then take the bolt kit and measure the tolerences. Take the Avg from both and you have another bolt kit! Also, it is NO secret about how the bolt actually works. Check this out...

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...l&RS=paintball

Above link is the patent info for the matrix...very detailed drawings (What the hell is that!!...you'll see) and explanations on how it works.

Hope this helps!!
__________________
Just couldn't stay away!

STUPID DOG! You're making me look BAD!!
Xx_One$hot_xX is offline  
Old 04-11-2002, 01:24 AM #11
Toboggan
Rye & Coke
 
Toboggan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
 has been a member for 10 years
So that is the matrix rather than the E-matrix. Very interesting read, almost put me to sleep.

I
__________________
If at first you don't succeed then sky diving is not for you
Toboggan is offline  
Old 04-11-2002, 11:03 AM #12
SIGG
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Saint John NB
 has been a member for 10 years
The back wall Luke use the back wall
Attached Images
File Type: jpg backwall.jpg (92.7 KB, 406 views)
SIGG is offline  
Old 05-12-2002, 12:53 PM #13
gunz411
Moderator
 
gunz411's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
gunz411 is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
A quick question regarding the back walls... Do the half moons face the breech or the back plate? I've been facing it forward..

Thanks
Tony
gunz411 is offline  
Old 05-12-2002, 12:58 PM #14
-=lii=- god
 
 
-=lii=- god's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
 has been a member for 10 years
damn canadians not explaining their new fangled designs. with a response like that, im definatly not buying a matrix. If they wont explain to me how it works, why should i buy one?
-=lii=- god is offline  
Old 05-12-2002, 02:30 PM #15
Fatty
Super Pimp
 
Fatty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Fatty is a Supporting Member
Fatty is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
-=lii=- god, it has more efficient air transfer... how in depth would you like it to be? Air flow in the stock bolt kit has various "dumps" where there shouldn't be. The bolt kit by Aardvark eliminates those dumps. Also, flow through the bolt is higher than the stock bolt.

Tony, the half moons face the backplate!

Dave
__________________
"Originally posted by paintmusician: Wow, you look like an extremly rich druglord, in other words, a ****ing savage"
"Originally posted by dholmblad: fatty, I want to be you when I grow up. I could see you hunting with your bare hands."


My Feedback
Fatty's Facebook
Fatty's Flickr
Fatty is offline  
Old 05-12-2002, 03:42 PM #16
mr_mich
Too hot for TV.
 
mr_mich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: MD
mr_mich is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally posted by DuMb-KiD-dReW
If this info was given out any company could copy our designs or improve others ie tmc/air tech indastries. So thats just plain out stupid of us to releash vital info like that.
Hm...I wonder if this has happened yet?
__________________
Stuff happens.
mr_mich is offline  
Old 05-13-2002, 10:17 AM #17
SIGG
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Saint John NB
 has been a member for 10 years
DKD, sorry to say, (that) any machinist with a blue or red or
whatever, colour bolt kit and a vernier or micrometer could copy the bolt kit.
There are a lot of bad ideas in the original stock bolt that Aardy
fixed ,like the backwall, and the weakness at the back of the
bolt, and the horse shoe,and making the air passages around
the beer keg smaller.

A PIC programmer could reverse engineer the chip without much
problem and perhaps even put the on/off delay and LED flash on
trigger pull, back in, like the gun12 chips

The antibolt stick is most likely just a few more ms of on time after
the gun has set idle for a while

Aardy's fixes are a combination of, fixing something stupid (back wall)
something probably not anticipated (breaking horse shoes and bolts)
and refinements. afterall so far there are at least 3 versions of the Aardy kit.

By the way the backwall and small end of the bolt are a valve
that shuts off the air supply from the tank. when the bolt moves
forward and fires there should be no new air getting into the
sleeve area. The stock bolt has a time during the foreward travel
and even worse on the backward travel ,that the backwall valve
is open at the same time that the Tophat valve is open.
Air from the tank is going down the barrel long after the ball is gone.
SIGG is offline  
Old 05-13-2002, 12:11 PM #18
Fatty
Super Pimp
 
Fatty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Fatty is a Supporting Member
Fatty is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGG
"DKD, sorry to say, (that) any machinist with a blue or red or
whatever, colour bolt kit and a vernier or micrometer could copy the bolt kit."

Absolutely true... so long as they don't sell it, Richmond won't sue them.

"There are a lot of bad ideas in the original stock bolt that Aardy
fixed ,like the backwall, and the weakness at the back of the
bolt, and the horse shoe,and making the air passages around
the beer keg smaller."

You never make a gun pefect, outta the box. It won't fly. These were intentionally left (besides bolt snaps and spacers).

"A PIC programmer could reverse engineer the chip without much
problem and perhaps even put the on/off delay and LED flash on
trigger pull, back in, like the gun12 chips"

Yep, nothing too difficult there.

"The antibolt stick is most likely just a few more ms of on time after
the gun has set idle for a while"

Thats it exactly.

"Aardy's fixes are a combination of, fixing something stupid (back wall)
something probably not anticipated (breaking horse shoes and bolts)
and refinements. afterall so far there are at least 3 versions of the Aardy kit.

By the way the backwall and small end of the bolt are a valve
that shuts off the air supply from the tank. when the bolt moves
forward and fires there should be no new air getting into the
sleeve area. The stock bolt has a time during the foreward travel
and even worse on the backward travel ,that the backwall valve
is open at the same time that the Tophat valve is open.
Air from the tank is going down the barrel long after the ball is gone."

Very good SIGG! You know this gun damned well... I'm curious, and I'm pretty sure this is what happened, but you didn't just talk to Greg to learn this... you tested things to figure it out. Kudos to you. I couldn't have read a more clear explanation from Aardvark.

Dave
__________________
"Originally posted by paintmusician: Wow, you look like an extremly rich druglord, in other words, a ****ing savage"
"Originally posted by dholmblad: fatty, I want to be you when I grow up. I could see you hunting with your bare hands."


My Feedback
Fatty's Facebook
Fatty's Flickr
Fatty is offline  
Old 05-13-2002, 01:54 PM #19
paintman161
 
 
paintman161's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: ny
 has been a member for 10 years
if they tell you what they did differant or expalined how it worked then someone would figure it out and only produce the parts that make the bolt efficeient. and therfore they would lose alot of money
paintman161 is offline  
Old 05-13-2002, 04:10 PM #20
Fatty
Super Pimp
 
Fatty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Fatty is a Supporting Member
Fatty is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
What you don't understand for the most part its seems, people... the bolt kit can be copied without thinking. Its understanding how the changes improve performance that takes some more knowledge. Any machinist could copy it, and have their VERY OWN bolt kits, that perform JUST as well as ANY bolt Aardvark makes. If they wanted to make improvements, thats different, its harder. But once they understand how it works, they will likely find things Aardvark overlooked.

There are PATENTS on the bolt kit, thats why people haven't jumped all over it. MackyGOG tried... got shut down.

TMC didn't knock off the bolt kit, Aardvark SOLD the rights to it months and months ago. So now TMC, so long as they keep their tolerances, are producing the exact same thing. I doubt they've actually made improvements as they claim, but thats just me.

Dave
__________________
"Originally posted by paintmusician: Wow, you look like an extremly rich druglord, in other words, a ****ing savage"
"Originally posted by dholmblad: fatty, I want to be you when I grow up. I could see you hunting with your bare hands."


My Feedback
Fatty's Facebook
Fatty's Flickr
Fatty is offline  
Old 05-14-2002, 01:56 AM #21
MuckMan
Wrath
 
MuckMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: NY
 has been a member for 10 years
my theory

to increase efficiency on a lp gun you would have to raise the firing pressure and decrease the volume of air used to propell the ball. and it would work w/ the same flow rate as a stock bolt kit.
just my 2 cents
__________________
- SH*T flows down hill -
MuckMan is offline  
 




Posting Rules
Forum Jump