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Old 07-18-2004, 12:24 PM #64
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dude that sucks. so much money wasted because your gun shoots 5 extra balls. see now if they set it up to shoot 30 and you hit 40 or 50, id understand, but how much is 5 balls gonna make in a game? there is so much paint flying around anyways.
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Old 07-18-2004, 12:37 PM #65
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they should defineatly have more robots and have them accesible to you before the tournament, and have each team an assigned time to go to the chrono and make sure all bounce is out of the gun.

don't hand me crap about how it's expensive, the nppl is rich.
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Old 07-18-2004, 02:13 PM #66
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I agree it seems the robot needs to be used BEFORE the event starts so ppl no they dont bounce. But they did get caught bouncing, and rules are rules. Learn your gun and you will be able to control things like that a little better. Better luck at the next event.
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Old 07-18-2004, 07:15 PM #67
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the thing with 665 if i remember right.... it was an electro cocker, that the ref on the spyder field took it from teh player to test it and it shot full auto by itself... then brought another ref in and it unloaded the hopper on its own. we were up next on the field, so im not 100% sure if this was them, but if i remember right it was

.... edit.... not 665... possibly chop shop or another team being checked
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Last edited by crashdan : 07-18-2004 at 08:16 PM.
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Old 07-18-2004, 07:22 PM #68
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Thats BS ignorance isnt an excuse but how are you suppose to know if your gun bounces 5 balls out of 30 pulls? Thats 4/25 of a shot per trigger pull how are you suppose to check that without the robot being excessible to you before hand? If you hit 13 bps which is average and it goes up to 15 how are you suppose to know your gun is bouncing. 15bps isnt unreachable by any means and you definately cant count how many times you pull the trigger.

I wonder how many top pro teams were checked I have a feeling if they did it to all the pros guns they would find atleast one gun that bounces on each team. But it would be bad for business if teams like Dynasty and Infamous get DQ'ed so that probably won't be happening.

If the guns were bouncing rediculously I could understand the DQ but if its undetectable and no one but the robot could find the bounce the teams should atleast get a warning.

NPPL's gun checking rules are a joke. If they are going to go overkill on a team with one bouncing gun the robots should atleast be available before hand.

Last edited by 845 : 07-18-2004 at 07:34 PM.
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Old 07-18-2004, 08:08 PM #69
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naa that wasnt 665 crashdan....they had probs with an ironman trix not a cocker...that might have been chop shop...
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Old 07-18-2004, 08:16 PM #70
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Everyone saying 5 extra balls isnt alot. . .true its not but it is 16% of the balls that come out of the gun u didnt shoot urself. I mean i agree it should be alil lax like a warning or something, but 16% is alot of extra mathmatically.

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Old 07-18-2004, 08:21 PM #71
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yea but he didnt even know that he was ripping 5 more which is even gayer...he dosnt know and gets dqed...ouch!
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Old 07-18-2004, 09:08 PM #72
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the pro'd team won't get caught because there sponsoirs make cheater boards for them, they won't bounce untill a hidden switch is pulled or a certain bps is reached. Like HK and dynasty come on there such good friends and your gonan try and tell me dynasty doesn't have cheater guns? please..... but there not the only team i agree with someone who said it earlier the only pro teams the complain are cocker teams, this is why ND don't have a wgp sponsor anymore.
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Old 07-18-2004, 09:15 PM #73
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it is kinda dumb that you cannot adjust your gun to the robots specs.... if a normal person cant get it to bounce i.e you or the ref... i think it should be perfectly fine... hell, rip a stream with my gun... it wont bounce... but when the robot does it, it does.... its man power not robotic power thats gonna be pulling the trigger on the field ya know... this is why i slightly favor psp a bit more... yes they care about alotta bounce but a little isnt bad.... i think its a bit absurd trying to stop an extra 3 or 4 balls coming outta barrel... like its gonna make a diff when you got 15 flying at your head every second....

i think just do away with any bounce rules because you cant stop it... cheaters will just think of better ways to get by these things ya know... hell i have a cheater board in my dm4 and its already outdated.... theres better boards then in my dm4.... anyway get rid of the bounce rules and such to an extent.... ramping i could care less only because you can stop a ramping gun easily... a bouncing gun is a bit harder to do.... and believe me i have experience with both types of guns... ramping and bouncing
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Old 07-18-2004, 09:33 PM #74
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Cocker teams shouldnt be complaining, eblades bounce the worst of any gun out due to the moving mass. They dont need special boards to do it lol just a slight trigger tuning.

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Old 07-18-2004, 09:38 PM #75
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If there going to have the rule they need to enforce it- Period. People a whole lot more in the know then anyone here seems to think it's important that's why it's there. But if the only way to induce it or find it is with the "robot" then teams/players must have access to it and if not they should be allowed to replace the marker in question and not DQ an entire team. The robot, in this case is making the player a cheater. 4-5 extra shots out of 30 will not be detected by any human so how can a player correct a problem they are not aware of? And I think we do a real disservice to pro ballers everywhere when we say they all have "cheater" boards. Does an NFL kicker use a cheater ball because he is able to kick or punt a ball straighter or farther then most other people? How about cheater basketballs, baseballs or pucks- they must exist because there guys out there that can do things with them I can't and you cannot. And of course we all know Lance Armstrong is using a "cheater" bike and the reason Tigers game has gone to crap is that his "cheater" clubs got stolen- only he cannot admit that to all of us. Give pro's there due- most are in a zip code none of us will ever even sniff. And that does not mean they are cheating.
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Old 07-18-2004, 10:02 PM #76
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Quote:
Originally posted by ajreaper
If there going to have the rule they need to enforce it- Period. People a whole lot more in the know then anyone here seems to think it's important that's why it's there. But if the only way to induce it or find it is with the "robot" then teams/players must have access to it and if not they should be allowed to replace the marker in question and not DQ an entire team. The robot, in this case is making the player a cheater. 4-5 extra shots out of 30 will not be detected by any human so how can a player correct a problem they are not aware of? And I think we do a real disservice to pro ballers everywhere when we say they all have "cheater" boards. Does an NFL kicker use a cheater ball because he is able to kick or punt a ball straighter or farther then most other people? How about cheater basketballs, baseballs or pucks- they must exist because there guys out there that can do things with them I can't and you cannot. And of course we all know Lance Armstrong is using a "cheater" bike and the reason Tigers game has gone to crap is that his "cheater" clubs got stolen- only he cannot admit that to all of us. Give pro's there due- most are in a zip code none of us will ever even sniff. And that does not mean they are cheating.
I am not saying they all cheat but that if the NPPL checked a pros gun the odds are there guns will also add 1-5 extra balls even if its completely by accident. Will they DQ a pro team? No because they would it start pissing off sponsors if their teams kept getting DQ'ed. I think its just funny that they choose to pick on the littler start up teams that pay for everything out of their own pocket.

Don't refer to the Redz Hurricanes thing because a ramping board is different from undetectable bounce.
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Old 07-19-2004, 12:03 PM #77
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what else would u like us to call cheater boards. .. u know the ones that ramp after 10 bps or so to max out the gun? Those arnt legal by the rules so . . . they sound like cheater boards to me. I mean dont kid urself, not all pros are shooting fast on thier own. If i had one of those boards i could do the same thing.

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Old 07-19-2004, 12:30 PM #78
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THIS IS A QUOTE FROM SEAN MORRIS HE WAS THERE HIMSELF , FORMER SHOCKWAVE CANADA MEMBER NOW A HUGE TOURNAMENT ORGANIZER IN CANADA>..


QUOTE:

" This is the way it happened from someonet that was there and involved.

Chop Shop got an Angel sponsorship and received their new flies the nite before they were suppost to play. The air sponsorship did not deliver so they had guns but no air. They were able to get some tanks for their flies but not until hours before they were suppost to start playing.

Everyone knows that in the big leagues there is a fine line between what is legal and what is not, Chop Shop had to set up the guns themselves and they did not have time to test them out. The first shots through the guns was on the playing field. We understood that this was a risk but sponsors expect representation. One of the guns was set wrong and bounced, the ref noticed and the rules say that any team playing with an illegal gun is DQ'd.

That is how it happened. "
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Old 07-19-2004, 12:41 PM #79
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that blows

The robot needs to be availble to players prior to the event. I play against the guys on Chop Shop on a fairly regular basis and they're all good guys, it's a shame that something as stupid as this cost them the ability to compete.
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Old 07-19-2004, 02:01 PM #80
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well until the nppl changes their rules on bounce and what not i suggest you leave the triggers long with the wright trigger spring,

yeah i wish they would give up on this bounce thing too but it don't look like that is gonna happen,
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Old 07-19-2004, 05:16 PM #81
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Even a long pull doesn't matter if you have the switch set towards the front of the pull.

Up for the Chop Shop guys. We know all to well how it feels. Been competitive all year and then something stupid happens. It sucks.
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Old 07-19-2004, 10:28 PM #82
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Ok, this is how I see it. If they are going to have a rule, they need to make it possible for all teams to be sure they are following said rule. I don't care if it's expensive and alot of work..if they're going to make it a rule, they can't halfass it.

You can't expect teams to stay within the rules on sheer guesstimation. They need to be able to test, otherwise they will never know for sure if they are entirely following the rules. It'd be pure luck of the draw.

That's like having a FPS rule with only one chrono at the entire event. People would just set up their guns to what they THINK is around the right FPS, and then go play. If a ref thought they were shooting hot, they'd be taken to the one chrono they have and tested.

Sure, that's a bit extreme, but it's basically the same thing. You can't make a rule and not have the means for players to make sure they are following said rule. It's a disservice to all the players, and I personally don't think it's right. It has nothing to do with whether or not a couple BPS over getting a DQ is a harsh judgement, it's just the fact that players have no way of knowing. That's just weak.


There's my .02
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Old 07-19-2004, 10:56 PM #83
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Quote:
Originally posted by Paintballer476
I agree it seems the robot needs to be used BEFORE the event starts so ppl no they dont bounce. But they did get caught bouncing, and rules are rules. Learn your gun and you will be able to control things like that a little better. Better luck at the next event.

WTF Your going to sit here and tell us that this guy didn't know his gun? If I fill your hopper with paint and I let you rip a 20 sec string do you know how much paint you fired?
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Old 07-20-2004, 01:11 AM #84
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I feel for both the Chop Shop and 665 dudes out there. There was some serious ill crap going on in Denver. You pay some serious money to head out to these events just to get screwed by the refs (two words: spyder field) it happened to a lot of teams. I got yanked on a feed neck hit with no splatter on my goggles and the ref said it was an obvious hit and a "self check zone" hence, one for one. In the same game another guy got a front of the loader hit and got another one for one...both tapes blown by 1 for 1's = game over. That's just an example, I had more problems this event than ever. It seemed like all the refs were more intent on making sure you had the right amount of headbands on or only one t shirt under your jersey than reffing the games on the level. Same thing with the guns...now to the meat of my post.
Anyone know what happened with Rich Telfords gun? I know it got pulled on the JT field, and I heard it was found to ramp or bounce. true or not? XSV was not DQ'd obviously...
I also saw in one of the prelim games they started to 10 second count on the Dogs/Bushwackers game and about 6 seconds into it the refs started screaming "stop stopstop!" and made everyone throw their guns down. I was like...here comes the robot, but they just chrono'd them again. anyone know what was up with that? it was the strangest thing I had ever seen...
Like I said before..I feel for ya guys...see you in Vega$
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