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Old 02-23-2002, 05:32 PM #22
spud majic
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i cannot record video being that i dont know how to hook up my digital camera to record. i said my gun will only shoot at 7 without chopping problems. i can shoot 10 with my finger but i will usually chop if i shoot a long string of shots at that fast. look at my first post on this thread if that doesnt sound like what i said.. is there any way to hook a tape recorder up to record video on a computer? it is an old one so i doubt it. any ideas of what i can do to prove this i will be willing to try... if you can buy any gun that performs better than mine at walmart i would really be amazed.
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Old 02-25-2002, 11:05 PM #23
wiseco16
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wtf

this has to be one of the funniest things ive seen. you guys really have no idea what you are talking about!!! I play ball with this kid, yeah he does shoot ~10bps. Ive seen it. No fanning, no electro, no nothing, just straight up shooting it. Low pressure doesnt do anything? you guys need to pull your head outta your a$$. Yeah you cant buy any LP internals for rebels, luckily he made all of his, huh? My spyder cocker shoots damn near 6-7 bps, with a 3/16 pull. Oh yeah i might be bullsh*tting you guys so i better give you the link. http://pub21.ezboard.com/fpaintballs...D =1897.topic
yeah guess what i made all that ****, bought the cocker parts, and made all the mounts,along with my LP internals, just like spud...
yeah and his 1.5 mm is sweet, just please dont get mad cause its better than your pull, ok?
so if you guys have anything intelligent to say, say it. If not, quit wasting his time and go jack off or something.

Last edited by wiseco16 : 02-25-2002 at 11:07 PM.
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Old 02-26-2002, 02:39 PM #24
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Wow, your so special. You can attach pneumatics that are worth more than the "gun" itself. Just because you put them on, doesnt mean its even comparable to a cocker. That is te biggest junk box ever. And low pressure doesnt accomplish anything. There is ZERO ball distortion/warping at 300fps. Therefore, you arent going to be any easier on your paint. You wasted so much money on that, why didnt you just buy a good gun? You crack me up. lol. And your trigger pull isnt even comparable to a RT trigger, so shut up.
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Old 02-26-2002, 02:56 PM #25
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hahaha..a spyder cocker? you could probably buy a cocker for the price that you payed to make a cockerout of a ****box spyder..spyders suck and i regret doing what i did to mine...its a newbie phase...go play with your 20 inch barrle for super accuracy

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Old 02-26-2002, 06:03 PM #26
spud majic
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actually he only spent like 200 bucks for everything. including the barrel... which wouldnt even buy you a cocker so i think that your wrong buddy. and his barrel is 12" ... how do you figure its a piece of crap if it shoots without any problems.... just because the name isnt known for high quality doesnt mean that the gun isnt... the gun is timed like a cocker, the bolt has higher tolerances than a cocker, the hammer/valve design is the same as a cocker, it is closed bolt like a cocker, the barrel design is the same as the cockers... so all the variables that affect accuracy are equal to or better than a cocker... making it shoot jsut as well as one. one last good question for ya...if low pressure doesnt do anything than why would AKA make there guns run at like 80 psi if 300psi was more efficient.....
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Old 02-26-2002, 06:27 PM #27
wiseco16
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i have the answer for you spud, these kids are **** biscuits, and thats all there is to it. Yeah my barrel is just about 20 inches, let me tell you. You still believe low pressure doesnt accomplish anything? hmmmmmm you must be stupid as hell. No distortion at 300 psi? Oh yeah, you figured this out with your physics busll**** huh? my bad dude, maybe next time. You think just cause you have an rt valve that you pull is gonna be shorter? You must drive a honda civic and think its faster than a saleen mustang, but that is just your type. I wasted money? i bought the gun for 75 bucks and the pneumatics were 40 bucks. Oh that might be a lot of money to you cause you only get 25 bucks for sucking d*ck Why did i waste my time? my spyder shoots better than your mag!!! LOL!!! thats why.....so i can laugh at dumb ****s like you at the field. i said to say something intelligent, maybe you should have jacked off. later *****
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Old 02-27-2002, 01:32 PM #28
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Your Sh*t box, i mean crap, i mean recylcled chinease beer cans, i mean spyder shoots better than a RT? ahahhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh hhhhhhahaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhaa. You newbies are so special. I bet your pos cant cycle at 26+ sps can it? I bet you bolt open time is comparable to a talon. And my trigger pull is adjustable through my output pressure, and it is alot better than your pos "gun". Man, you guys must be major snipers ha? 20" barrels give you more accuracy right, I would be afraid of you guys on the feild. Look at a real gun, Colt M-4 Commando, it only has a 16" barrel. Real firearms have barrels shorter than yours. You dont beleive me there is no distortion at 300fps? Watch the high-speed AGD RT maintence video of a ball dropping into the breach. You know what? No distortion. O man, your wrong again.

"just because the name isnt known for high quality doesnt mean that the gun isnt" haha. So, if people know that the gun is a pos and it isnt quality, that means the gun is? Explain that one.

Low Pressure is all HYPE. Since you guys are newbies, I will explain it to you so your little heads dont get frustratred. Although LP may increase the shots per tank, it doesnt do anything else. Companies like AKA, make their money of newbies like you guys. They know if they say it has all this that newbies like you little buggers wil buy it and talk about it to their newbie friends. Its called marketing. Look at this-

http://www.automags.org/forums/showt...threadid=26842 I dont know if your little heads can process that, hopefully so.

Why dont you put a post in the cocker forum saying you junk box can shoot just as good as one? O, better yet in the mag forum saying your trigger pull is better than a RT's? Ok, you do that.
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Old 02-27-2002, 01:53 PM #29
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newbies and stupid people suck
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Old 02-27-2002, 04:36 PM #30
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now this is getting ridiculous. there is no ball distortion/warpage at 300 fps? no **** buddy! i never said there was. but is there gonna be any distortion at 300psi? (note to dumbsh*ts, fps and psi are not the same thing) dont you think there is gonna be more at a higher pressure? maybe thats why your mag shoots at 400psi huh? yeah i think so too. the people at agd are not dumba$$es like you are. yeah and i believe a spyder can pull about 25sps. who the hell knows if its gonna get shootdown, i bet it will, but thats not the question here. By the way hoss, the 20 inch sniper barrel thing is getting old. I got a laugh out of it the first time. Let me try to explain this to you, if someone hits you in the hand with a 850 pound hammer and a 200 pound hammer, which one do you think is gonna jack your hand up more? when we are shooting low pressure the fps is still gonna be under 300. its just lower pressure, at a higher volume. now look buddy know your mag is gonna shoot alot faster than my gun, and i never said my gun shoots as good as a cocker, but does an rt valve make your mag more accurate? Seriously think about this one. And recycled chinese beer cans? this is original. Do you even know what a mag is made out of? i know what your gonna say, but do you know what grade? im interested to hear your answer......

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Old 02-27-2002, 05:36 PM #31
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Alot of intreseting arguements here.

Both sides are correct to some degree.

Ball deformation does not occour at any PSI that normal paintball guns operate at. If it did it would break. Elasticity is the same at 0 fps as it is at 300 fps...

A blowback can cycle at around 40bps, however the shootdown would be so great that the ball would go 1 foot. There would also be no time for the ball to feed.

As far as shoting 10 bps w/o revy it seems unlikely but not impossible. Blowbacks have enough kick to them that it is usually sufficent to agitate the balls.

As far as low pressure goes, you would have to tell more about what modifications you made. There must be enough pressure to recock the spring and to propell the ball.

Meaning the mainspring has to be lighter, the valve spring must be lighter. The valve would need to be modified to increase flow, the bolt would have to be modified to increase flow. And the internal passages would have to be modified once again to increase flow.

This has turned into a fighting match please keep it civil and refrain from accusations unless you are absolutely sure. To me it seems like there may be a bit of figure fudging, but not completely bogus.
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Old 02-27-2002, 06:55 PM #32
wiseco16
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thanks

well what we are saying about the 10 bps is that its not gonna be 10 balls shot, maybe 7 balls at 10 bps. balls that are already in the throat of the hopper, which i think is 7 at the max.

About the low pressure deal, all the mods that you have stated are done.

I feel that pressure is almost like drag racing, a 10 second run can be achieved 2 ways. Horsepower, or torque. Same as 300fps can be achieved 2 ways, hp, and lp. In my opinion, i just think that lp is a more controlled push, rather than a high pressure smack. But hey i could be wrong. thanks for straightening this up dude.......
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Old 02-27-2002, 07:08 PM #33
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Well horsepower is mathmatically related to torque.

Horsepower= torque x rpm x constant.

A high horsepower engine can make more torque simply by using lower gears.

500lbs/ft torque spinning at 10k rpm can be made into 1000lbs/ft at 5000 rpm 2000lb/ft at 2500 rpm and so on...

On the topic of cars...

A high prssure gun is like a dragester that gets up to 200 mph in the first 1/16 mile then just coasts to the finish line.

A low pressure gun is like a dragster than uses the full 1/4 mile to get to 200 mph.
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Old 02-27-2002, 07:15 PM #34
spud majic
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high pressure has no distortion? why do you think high pressure guns break more paint than low pressure guns? answer- because when the high pressure charge hits it it tears the shell. and thanks butterfingers for useing common sence unlike all these other kids.
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Old 02-28-2002, 11:07 PM #35
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Spud, Actually there is no distortion of a paintball at 300fps, or lower. Tom Kaye of AGD did testing on this with high speed film, ie: slow motion.
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Old 03-01-2002, 12:34 AM #36
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Ok, now what I don't get is why the **** would anyone spend the money to do that to a rebel? I'd rather have a piece of junk tippmann. Power to the Rebel yo!!!!!!!!!.....yea'..
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Old 03-01-2002, 02:47 PM #37
spud majic
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so then what your saying is that when a ball breaks there is no ball distortion???????? now it is a fact that high pressure breaks more balls than low pressure. meaning.... high pressure is more likely to get too much distortion and break the shell. and there is always dostortion to be honest. even if the ball was made of steel there would still be distortion just so small it would almost be impossible to measure. even .005" of distortion which you could not see without presision measuring equipment would affect the flight path of a ball and not break it.
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Old 03-01-2002, 05:29 PM #38
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Nevermind, This whole thread started because you decided to walk all over someone elses thread. The original question was what kind of problems to you have with your Rebel, and you decided to try and show off your gun.
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Old 03-01-2002, 08:01 PM #39
spud majic
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actually i didnt show off my gun. i stated that my gun was capable of sustaining 7bps without chopping. which isnt a very impressive number to show off.
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Old 03-01-2002, 08:31 PM #40
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actually i dont break at all in my rebel and it is internally stock,so that must through the high pressure breaking balls out the window,there are factors that go with ball breaking,is the shell to brittle?,whats the weather?,and if your still useing the main spring to push the bolt into the ball it dont matter fi the gun is running 25psi the main spring is still beign the acting force tus keeping the shooting sequence at higher pressure,however low pressure does create less kick,ONLY times i ever break paint is when i outshoot my 12v revvy which is very common with my rebel,actually thinking i need an x-board,but i have outshot one with my rebel,however it didnt chop just skipped which i'd prefer,but i think the paddles in that rev were a bit messed up
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Old 03-01-2002, 11:02 PM #41
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what???? that stuff about the mainspring is pretty hard to see what your saying... in my gun the mainspring has nothing to do with how high the max pressure gets(it only allows it to be under the max pressure depending on how it opens the valve)... if the gas pressure is 250psi there will not be more than 250psi of force on the ball. reason being is that as soon as the gas hits the ball the air has already hit the hammer slowing it down making the ball come away from the bolt leaving the ball with forward momentum resulting in a constant increase in volume between the valve and the ball meaning that unless the gun can supply air at a rate equal or greater to the volumetric acceleration of the space, the force exerted on the ball will always be less than the input pressure. and my gun is high flow but not high enough for that to take place. if your gun could do this and still manage to recock the theroetical pressure for a 6" unported barrel to reach 300fps would be somewhere in the range of 30-50 psi from what i can solve mathmatically. this is only theoretical and will probably never be able to be proven being that there is far to many variables that take place inside the gun itself. also this design would not be efficient at all.
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Old 03-02-2002, 08:26 AM #42
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in a rebel the is 2 things that happens when the trigger is pulled,first the sear let go of the hammer allowing the main spring to push the bolt into the ball,which get the ball in the barrel just as the air lets out of the valve,thus the only pressure hats even needed to be used in ball breaking in a rebel is right there,when the bolt hits the ball,what happens after that doesnt break the ball unless it is a barrel break,which si caused by debri of some sort in the barrel or a ball to big for that barrel,all that th actually air pressure in question does is make it more effcient,which in some cases it doesnt,but in most it does,and cause less kick when recocking the gun,unless yu have a super light main spring to push the bolt and hammer forward the gun can not use the really really brittle paint made for LP guns,if you notice in a blowback such as the rebel the main velocity dial is the spring tension adjuster on the back,take out your spring guide you will shoot like 225 or something similiar now put it back in and see how high your velocity rises with it in,thats the main factor in a blow back,in most LP set up i have seen in spyder's and such,this velocity dialer is screamed and locked all the way for max velocity and also to allow all velocity adjustmesnts to be done through the regulator and allow lower operating pressure,but it still has a higher cycling pressure due to the main spring
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