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Old 03-11-2004, 01:50 PM #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by hawk
Are you talking about raking the trigger?? Raking the trigger is about the easiest way to get the most out of your trigger. And if the trigger sensativity is set to it's most sensative, it will cause "bounce". Combine that with raking (approx 5 hits per down and up stroke- counted as 1 full stroke) and a really light trigger, and the trigger can technically bounce against the raking finger during the full stroke a lot more than 5 times, resulting in obnoxious rates of fire. You can easily outshoot a halo like that.
With my LED matrix, before installing the eyes, I had a standard LED board with the GUN20 chip and I have been pulled off the field after a game in several different tournaments to have my gun checked for "ramping" or illegal modes of fire. It was stock with a short trigger job. Nothing was ever found and no penalties given. Now, with the tadao v4 board, I can rake a little faster and still, with eyes on- NO bounce (debounce setting of 4 to prevent bounce). However, with eyes off, it bounces a little. But the point is, that it is possible to start laying a stream and during that stream, get it just right so you get even faster for a second or so, but not consistantly like a board that is actually programmed to ramp.
So, either the guy with the Legacy team's chip/board is raking with bounce, or it's had the original programming altered- but that is not likely.
it's not raking. raking is when you run one finger up and down the bump of a double trigger really fast. this guy is walk the trigger but just "brushing" the side of the trigger with his fingers. when he pulls like this, the gun starts ramping shots like crazy. i dunno if my defitnition of raking is the same as yours.
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Old 03-11-2004, 02:24 PM #44
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Hmmmmm...... It could be that there was a lot of side to side play on the trigger and brushing directly against the side instead of head on might cause it to fire. If that were true, then the trigger "pull" to activate the switch would be extremely short- shorter than anything out there now... a hairs breath so to speak.
Otherwise, he could be raking at a 45* angle to the trigger, which would still allow him to barely hit the bumps, and probably do it a little faster than normal raking.
..and then again, it could be a combination of the 2.
who knows? I would have to see how he does it, but I sincerely doubt if the board ramps. Still waiting for Dave to get back to me about that. this is a busy month for him and he's only been on MO once this month.
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Old 03-11-2004, 02:26 PM #45
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from what a ironmen player told him, all dye sponsered teams have a special board inside that ramps shots. at LA, dynastys shockers were taken away for the same reason
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Old 03-11-2004, 03:14 PM #46
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kenny, when you say "ramping" shots, you are talking about increasing fps via increased dwell? Kinda like ABS software?

If so, how can you tell the guns ramp? Visual and audio interpretation? Do the shots look flatter, farther, and sound louder?

Thanks
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Old 03-11-2004, 03:20 PM #47
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ramping meaning that his ROF is being ramped. watch his fingers move and watch the amount of balls that are being put out. or just listen to the sound.
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Old 03-11-2004, 03:48 PM #48
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ok... thanks

I've heard it used in both contexts before.
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Old 03-11-2004, 08:57 PM #49
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well u have to get used to it the last tourney i was in was a nov and i saw one team with there back guys shooting timmys and they would slap the trigger and it wouldnt stop shooting they would gust acting like they were shooting
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:20 PM #50
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I think they should just let trigger bounce be legal. More money for the paint companies.
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:33 PM #51
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True that, except that when someone gets stitched 15 times from a bunker, and saftey issues come into play, especially with TV deals coming close, that will become a major problem. The paintball masks arent built to take that many shots that close. That and it will just ****en hurt. You can have fun explaining your 100 welts at the end of a tourney to your girlfriend or wife.
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:48 PM #52
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That would be the worst thing to happen to this sport. as it stands now, all the "cheater boards" out there just make a stronger case for placing a cap on ROF.
getting wailed on by 15-16 balls at once is enough to cause the body to go into shock. I'm here to compete and to have fun, not to hurt anyone, and not to play where no skill is really needed any longer. These higher rats of fire basically make the game slow down because no one is going to move when they have streams of paint raining down on them
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Old 03-11-2004, 11:55 PM #53
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i think it should be limited paint
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Old 03-12-2004, 12:03 AM #54
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limited paint would never work and teams would shy away from it. especially in xball where u dont carry alot of paint for a game
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Old 03-12-2004, 12:59 PM #55
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I would be in favor of a 15 BPS cap. Any higher than that gives you no advantage, it only hurts people more and risks serious injury.

At 15 BPS the paintballs are .066 of a second apart. Not including bounces, no one is going to get through a well placed string of 15 bps.

Besides, aside from some freak fingers out there no one can really pull a trigger faster than that anyway.
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Old 03-12-2004, 03:55 PM #56
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controlling bouncing will actually be much easier than convincing all loader companies to cap their loaders at 15bps.
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Old 03-12-2004, 04:49 PM #57
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Yeah, but checking BPS is easier than checking bounce.

Either way this debate will continue for a while and either way the ultimate solution will be in the hands of the manufacturers
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Old 03-12-2004, 04:50 PM #58
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you dont have to convince the loader companies to cap at 15, youhave to hae the manufacturers of the guns cap their boards at 15 bps. But then again, you always have those people who make cheater boards and so on... As long as there is a way to cheat, some one will do it.
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Old 03-12-2004, 04:53 PM #59
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Putting a cap on the boards will kill the technological advances in this sport.... it won't happen.
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Old 03-12-2004, 04:55 PM #60
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Like i said, if there is a way to cheat, someone will do it. This sport is just too full of gray areas to play with. Its going to be ahrd to ever stop all the cheaters out there
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Old 03-12-2004, 07:50 PM #61
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cheating is in every sport.....steroids in baseball....every play someone holds in football do they call it everytime?in auto racing they get away with hiding parts and skimming by here and there to cheat,its going to happen, and alittle cheating or bending of the rules isnt going to hurt the sport for TV

also....you think someone getting hit 30 times is bad for tv???? people love to see that stuff, there are shows dedicated to showing the best,most brutal football hits, do you think those guys dont get hurt?its sad but thats just the way it is, people like violence....
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Old 03-12-2004, 07:55 PM #62
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thats true, but like in paintball, football has special pads to help protect the players. do u think football would be legal if they didnt ahve all thoe pads to protect them? i doubt it. Paintball does have certain things to protect the players, and that is our masks. PSP only allows players to wear one cotton shirt under your jersey. Now i know i like to watch people get bunkered and stuff, but even im going to cringe if someone gets buknered and gets 10 to the head. We dont have protectice gear for that stuff. Getting shot in the throat is no joke, and getting bnunkered there could be very dangerous. If the PSP will allow for the higher rates of fire, then more protection is going to be required to have on for all players.
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Old 03-12-2004, 08:10 PM #63
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Football was legal when they wore leather helmets without any face protection. Then as the sport grew so did the technology, and protection grew because of it. Same with paintball. As technology grows, the protecton will as well.

I guess you weren't around for the days of shop-glasses.
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