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Old 08-22-2013, 11:59 AM #400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paint4 View Post
No one is going to set gun to shoot 350. Would cause ball breaks and terrible shots. They may have jacked all their guns a little, but not to 350.
I think they set the gun for say 320s maybe 325 and when the alleged Oring blew it took it on up to 350. It isn't good for guns to shoot that high constantly it wears on the gun
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:04 PM #401
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1dayteam120 View Post
Yeah and they Werent shooting 20+ fps high they were 3-4 over. The fact that almost an entire team is shooting hot isn't a coincidence. The fact that 1-2 would be. But over half your team? Yeah that's fishy. You clearly don't get it. You should read all of the pages before you post
I have read it, but i think you did not.. As lane states : there is NO proof of the tonton team cheating..

And 2 guns over 316 fps.. Not 4.. I would suggest that you re-read the thread..

A few years back at an millenium event on the pro field some american pro players were got caught with 12.5 bps instead of 10.5.. Did anybody yell cheat ? No they just forgot to put the millenium mode instead of the psp mode.. **** happens.. They could have turned that into a 30 pbnation pages argument.. But nobody did.. Maybe because there was no webcast.. Or maybe because the coach of the other team did not own 30% of the psp.. Who knows :-)

Last edited by Nokia6618 : 08-22-2013 at 12:11 PM.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:15 PM #402
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I guess if i was playing at that level and I felt that shooting my marker at or around the limit was going to maybe yield me a tag or two off the break more than if i chronoed to a safer number (say 280fps) I would probably do it. Taking a minor penalty for a hot gun was probably a calculated risk. Enough teams had issues to suggest it wasn't simply one team trying to get an edge.

The biggest issue I had with their statement was the constant effort to point out it was the "first shot". I'm not sure why that matters, I get that they may be using FSDO settings but in that heat they probably didn't need to.
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:25 PM #403
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I guess if i was playing at that level and I felt that shooting my marker at or around the limit was going to maybe yield me a tag or two off the break more than if i chronoed to a safer number (say 280fps) I would probably do it. Taking a minor penalty for a hot gun was probably a calculated risk. Enough teams had issues to suggest it wasn't simply one team trying to get an edge.

The biggest issue I had with their statement was the constant effort to point out it was the "first shot". I'm not sure why that matters, I get that they may be using FSDO settings but in that heat they probably didn't need to.
Maybe because if you "intensionaly" up the reg on your gun, one would shoot all the time over 340.....

And since this thread is all about intent...
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Old 08-22-2013, 12:58 PM #404
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that article they posted proved 3 things.

1 the psp is stupid as **** for letting a DYE tech look for cheater boards and other stuff, obviously they arent gonna throw their team under the bus and make them and themselves as a company look bad... there are ways of programming the board to spike in velovity due to dwell and other ****... we're not stupid...

2 the ton tons basically write a huge condescending letter about how they need to pay to play and blah blah WE DONT CARE. if you wanna cheat you can pay to play still but in ANOTHER LEAGUE... sorry but an example needs to be made

3 when have you ever heard of an o ring in a regulator not SPEWING air resulting in him not being able to even finish 1 point nevermind 3...
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:02 PM #405
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You CAN NOT dwell ramp a DM. The first shot drop off setting is there to add dwell to dump the entire chamber. The fps will remain the same as long as the pressure coming out of the reg is consistent. If his first shot was hot the reg was creeping and his fsdo timer had kicked in.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:03 PM #406
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Reg creep while the marker still works and not spewing air. Notice if you let it sit the output is at 260. But as soon as you fire the marker, the output goes back down to 240. That is how you can have a 50fps difference between the first shot and the second shot.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:05 PM #407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nokia6618 View Post
I have read it, but i think you did not.. As lane states : there is NO proof of the tonton team cheating..

And 2 guns over 316 fps.. Not 4.. I would suggest that you re-read the thread..

A few years back at an millenium event on the pro field some american pro players were got caught with 12.5 bps instead of 10.5.. Did anybody yell cheat ? No they just forgot to put the millenium mode instead of the psp mode.. <del>****</del> happens.. They could have turned that into a 30 pbnation pages argument.. But nobody did.. Maybe because there was no webcast.. Or maybe because the coach of the other team did not own 30% of the psp.. Who knows :-)
I am not sure Mike Bruno (the coach of Aftershock) owns anything. But I am sure he doesn't own any of the PSP.

And I see a big different in ROF vs velocity. There's nowhere in the world it is OK to shoot over 300 fps.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:14 PM #408
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:19 PM #409
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:21 PM #410
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John View Post
I am not sure Mike Bruno (the coach of Aftershock) owns anything. But I am sure he doesn't own any of the PSP.

And I see a big different in ROF vs velocity. There's nowhere in the world it is OK to shoot over 300 fps.
We must have different sources.. And there is nowhere in the world were it is allowed to shoot 2 bps more then the rules of that tournament either.. Still the real problem is intent.. And again there is no proof of that...
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:22 PM #411
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all dye team guns have stock boards. We do not flash boards. They probly left their guns in the sun. Riverside was HOT and that does make our guns o rings swell and can cause the pressure to be raised and can lead to hot shooting if not monitored (in my experience pro players pay the least amount of attention to there guns of any paintball player). I was not working the event but i know our techs that were in attendance - (one was Rocky Cag. and the other was a assembly worker for the guns when i was also on the assembly line) - neither tech would have any benefit of fabricating their findings on what their diagnoses of the guns were.
Keep your heads up TonTons. Stuff happens. look forward to the next event and just make sure it doesn't happen again next time.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:33 PM #412
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1dayteam120 View Post
Yeah and they Werent shooting 20+ fps high they were 3-4 over. The fact that almost an entire team is shooting hot isn't a coincidence. The fact that 1-2 would be. But over half your team? Yeah that's fishy. You clearly don't get it. You should read all of the pages before you post
And you should re read the official statement left by the PSP confirming that there was no cheating going on. There is nothing fishy going on at all as clearly stated by the PSP and tech.

I cant believe this thread has made it to 400 posts.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:39 PM #413
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And you should re read the official statement left by the PSP confirming that there was no cheating going on.
That's a stronger statement than they actually made. PSP said they had no proof.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:40 PM #414
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John View Post
I am not sure Mike Bruno (the coach of Aftershock) owns anything. But I am sure he doesn't own any of the PSP.

And I see a big different in ROF vs velocity. There's nowhere in the world it is OK to shoot over 300 fps.
So shooting someone at 20bps is Ok? I'm not seeing the logic.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:52 PM #415
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Quote:
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We must have different sources.. And there is nowhere in the world were it is allowed to shoot 2 bps more then the rules of that tournament either.. Still the real problem is intent.. And again there is no proof of that...
What source told you that the coach of Aftershock owns part of the PSP? Because they are 100% wrong. And it is perfectly OK to shoot 12.5 bps at people in tournaments all over the world. It's certainly worth a penalty if done in the wrong place though. But I don't see shooting at 350 or 400 as the same thing as shooting 2 bps over the ROF, especially when they were shooting the BPS they normally play and practice at. Again, nowhere do they legally play or practice at 350 fps.


Quote:
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So shooting someone at 20bps is Ok? I'm not seeing the logic.
Can you quote where someone said that? I certainly didn't. However, I guess the UWL allows it, but I don't see how that has to do with anything.

But again, it is perfectly OK to shoot 12.5 bps at people in tournaments all over the world. Now if a gun was shooting 20 BPS, I can see that as similar to shooting 350 fps in that it is an obvious difference the player should notice. I can certainly see how a player wouldn't think 12.5 BPS is incorrect since that's the ROF they are used to playing at. However, it obviously should still draw a penalty if it breaks the rules for that event.
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:54 PM #416
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My question on CEP's thread was....

Quote:
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Who ended up shooting over 400 fps last event & what are his consequences? Also was it him turning the gun up, or some kind of technology? Thanks just wondering.
Answer...

Quote:
Originally posted by DI*killa
It isnt important who the player was.

The gun was not turned up. It spiked to 400. The reason it did this is because debris got into the reg (loc-tite to be exact) which ruined the reg seat, making the reg malfunction and create a spike in velocity.

Not intentional, just an malfunction.

The player served a 3 game suspension from the PSP
Can that really happen with just some loc-tite???????
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Old 08-22-2013, 01:56 PM #417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ragin Cajun View Post
So shooting someone at 20bps is Ok? I'm not seeing the logic.
But they weren't. They were shooting someone at 12.5 bps, which is acceptable here but there it was 10.5 that was acceptable. However, there the velocity is 300fps and there it's 300fps. Not something that you can mix up going from here to there or opposite as the velocity is damn near universal.
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Old 08-22-2013, 02:01 PM #418
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Gun malfunctions happen. Ill accept that. But at the pro level you should take more care of your gun and have multiple chronos. Its all about preventive maintenance.
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Old 08-22-2013, 02:04 PM #419
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What about the fact that tontons were already suspsect for shooting hot? If it were obvious enough for others to notice, why didnt the tontons?
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Old 08-22-2013, 02:17 PM #420
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So the team shows up with six players after a 14 hour flight and says ok guys lets spike our guns up to risk getting penalties and suspensions and risk it all because that will def allow us to win... No way. Ive chrono'd my gun at 285 and it spiked up to 302-304 in the heat. They didnt chrono their guns in for their last match. Not to mention a ref checks guns frequently as players come on the field between points. Nontheless they will be rewarded a suspension and hopefully learn from their costly mistake. But on a positive note nobody was hurt and the PSP will take steps forward to make things safer.
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