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Old 06-03-2014, 10:07 PM #64
Soul06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRAXX View Post
wow, first I've ever heard of an Ego breaking due to dry-fire.

- Not exactly confidence-inspiring. But then again, the Vanquish (the original, not sure about the 1.5) was a terrible marker. if the 1.5 fixed the issues over the original, then it should be a decent marker. It's kind of ugly though, just saying.
Considering dry-firing is unnecessary I don't see the issue or reason for lack of confidence. If you absolutely need to dry fire then they make a muffler that offers enough back pressure to keep it from damaging the internals.

And for the record PE has always said not to dry fire. It's not a new development.
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Old 06-04-2014, 05:17 AM #65
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Originally Posted by monkeyballer099639 View Post
Between those two, it is a poppet v spool argument. I would say the LV1, but I think there are better options than those 2.
IMO the lv1 is one of the better poppets but I agree. They're are probably better spools that the vanquish i.e. VIS, Luxe, GTi

So between those two id pick the lv1
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Old 06-05-2014, 02:22 AM #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soul06 View Post
Considering dry-firing is unnecessary I don't see the issue or reason for lack of confidence. If you absolutely need to dry fire then they make a muffler that offers enough back pressure to keep it from damaging the internals.

And for the record PE has always said not to dry fire. It's not a new development.

Still, that's just fail. Say - for whatever reason - your eyes malfunction in your LV1. You have to switch to eyes off. Then, your hopper for whatever reason jams and you continue to fire - dry fire.

You've just Eff'd your marker up during a point.

^ Fail. I'm a pretty big fan of PE's marker design and quality, but that is simply just freakin fail.

I'd get an Axe over an LV1 just because of that, and that's saying something.
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Old 06-05-2014, 03:10 AM #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRAXX View Post
Still, that's just fail. Say - for whatever reason - your eyes malfunction in your LV1. You have to switch to eyes off. Then, your hopper for whatever reason jams and you continue to fire - dry fire.

You've just Eff'd your marker up during a point.

^ Fail. I'm a pretty big fan of PE's marker design and quality, but that is simply just freakin fail.

I'd get an Axe over an LV1 just because of that, and that's saying something.
Have you actually shot an LV1.

Simply dry firing a few shots won't destroy the gun. The owner's manual states "excessive dry firing" is not recommended.

Before spouting off on the dry firing "controversy", it takes a couple minutes to pull up the manual from the Ego message board and you can read the information.
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:34 AM #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRAXX View Post
Still, that's just fail. Say - for whatever reason - your eyes malfunction in your LV1. You have to switch to eyes off. Then, your hopper for whatever reason jams and you continue to fire - dry fire. You've just Eff'd your marker up during a point.

^ Fail. I'm a pretty big fan of PE's marker design and quality, but that is simply just freakin fail. I'd get an Axe over an LV1 just because of that, and that's saying something.
That is a pretty far fetched and ridiculous scenario you just tried to present. What are the insanely minute odds of those two things ever happening, in the order you presented, mid game, with a properly maintained Ego and a quality hopper?

And as was said above, a situation like you just mentioned isn't going to make the marker fall apart. Excessive or regular dry firing will.
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Old 06-05-2014, 10:54 AM #69
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Soul, correct me if I'm wrong, but the ego has a training mode on the board that is an appropriate setting for dry firing. I know the Geo3.1 has it on the settings, but I've never actually messed with it. (BTW, this is a newish account... I stopped using blueshifty)

On the LV1... those things have pretty well proven themselves by now. At PSP Dallas last year I saw one go down on Ollie (or someone on dynasty)... in typical PE fashion it turned out to be a bad battery. I am pretty confident that the LV1 won't ever actually self-destruct from this stuff, but it's certainly more forward force on the internals without backpressure. Toss a squeegie down the barrel and you can dry fire all you want.


edit: This thread is OLD. At this point in time the LV1 and the Vanquish 1.5 are both very solid markers. Each have their own benefits and drawbacks, but all said I'd take the LV1 personally.
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Old 06-05-2014, 02:00 PM #70
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@Soul, you seem quite content on the LV1, and are continuously throwing out scenarios and ideals to compensate for this very 'real' flaw in the LV1's design. If you want to compensate for it, by all means do so. People give and take in the paintball industry all the time; sacrificing one aspect for another. There really isn't a perfect marker out there.


Still, it just seems like a silly flaw. I just personally feel that 'that' is just not fit for the makings of a super gun - especially one put out by PE.

Just expected more for it I suppose.
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Old 06-05-2014, 02:25 PM #71
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Ironyusa - it has a training mode but in training mode the bolt doesn't actually cycle. It's a simulated firing cycle and a beep indicates when a shot is supposedly fired.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRAXX View Post
@Soul, you seem quite content on the LV1, and are continuously throwing out scenarios and ideals to compensate for this very 'real' flaw in the LV1's design. If you want to compensate for it, by all means do so. People give and take in the paintball industry all the time; sacrificing one aspect for another. There really isn't a perfect marker out there.

Still, it just seems like a silly flaw. I just personally feel that 'that' is just not fit for the makings of a super gun - especially one put out by PE.

Just expected more for it I suppose.
Repeating your opinion over and over again doesn't make it fact. Neither does presenting far fetched scenarios that likely less than 1% of users will ever come close to experiencing. A "flaw" would be the marker having poor efficiency. A "flaw" would be the need to replace orings after every use. Recommendation against dry firing isn't a "flaw" because it isn't necessary for play. This is like calling the marker "flawed" because it can't hammer in nails

But for your information dry firing isn't "good" for any marker. Not just the LV1. It puts excessive wear on the internals.
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Last edited by Soul06 : 06-05-2014 at 02:31 PM.
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Old 06-05-2014, 09:02 PM #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soul06 View Post
Ironyusa - it has a training mode but in training mode the bolt doesn't actually cycle. It's a simulated firing cycle and a beep indicates when a shot is supposedly fired.



Repeating your opinion over and over again doesn't make it fact. Neither does presenting far fetched scenarios that likely less than 1% of users will ever come close to experiencing.
That scenario is not far-fetched. That's actually a very real one that happens quite often. I've seen it happen. In fact, I actually have this exact scenario on Video during the WTL for everyone's viewing pleasure. - The eyes on my team mates's Etha weren't working properly so he turned the eyes off. Then, his rotor jammed while he was running - trying to lane someone - and the pillow flew off the marker. Shortly after, it became a blender. I mentioned this aspect to a buddy of mine, and he stated that this actually happened to a friend of his (his LV1) during a big scenario game in Wyoming at the end of last month. both instances were on the field.

All kinds of weird **** happens in paintball. So this 1% statistic you speak of? Where'd you gather empirical data for that? My goodness, you must be a genius!


Quote:
A "flaw" would be the marker having poor efficiency. A "flaw" would be the need to replace orings after every use. Recommendation against dry firing isn't a "flaw" because it isn't necessary for play. This is like calling the marker "flawed" because it can't hammer in nails
^ this is possibly the worst analogy I've ever heard. This is a very real flaw, especially for PE - a company that prides itself on putting out the most durable tournament markers out there. This is far from durable. I'm calling it flawed because it can't shoot air out of the barrel without screwing itself up! THATS STUPID! I fail to see how that's not a big deal to you!

Quote:
But for your information dry firing isn't "good" for any marker. Not just the LV1. It puts excessive wear on the internals.
A paintball marker should not break or wear itself thin just because of shooting air out the barrel - period.

But whatever. Most people really like the gun. Like I said, people sacrifice one aspect for emphasis on another - all the time.

Just stop defending this aspect of the LV1 as if there's nothing wrong with it.

BECAUSE - obviously, there is. Maybe the LV1.5 might fix everything in it.
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Old 06-05-2014, 10:25 PM #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRAXX View Post
That scenario is not far-fetched. That's actually a very real one that happens quite often. I've seen it happen. In fact, I actually have this exact scenario on Video during the WTL for everyone's viewing pleasure. - The eyes on my team mates's Etha weren't working properly so he turned the eyes off. Then, his rotor jammed while he was running - trying to lane someone - and the pillow flew off the marker. Shortly after, it became a blender. I mentioned this aspect to a buddy of mine, and he stated that this actually happened to a friend of his (his LV1) during a big scenario game in Wyoming at the end of last month. both instances were on the field.

All kinds of weird **** happens in paintball. So this 1% statistic you speak of? Where'd you gather empirical data for that? My goodness, you must be a genius!




^ this is possibly the worst analogy I've ever heard. This is a very real flaw, especially for PE - a company that prides itself on putting out the most durable tournament markers out there. This is far from durable. I'm calling it flawed because it can't shoot air out of the barrel without screwing itself up! THATS STUPID! I fail to see how that's not a big deal to you!



A paintball marker should not break or wear itself thin just because of shooting air out the barrel - period.

But whatever. Most people really like the gun. Like I said, people sacrifice one aspect for emphasis on another - all the time.

Just stop defending this aspect of the LV1 as if there's nothing wrong with it.

BECAUSE - obviously, there is. Maybe the LV1.5 might fix everything in it.
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Old 06-06-2014, 09:11 AM #74
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As I've own just about every years incarnation of Ego or Geo since 06 I find this regular problem of eye malfunctions very hard to believe. I've never experienced one yet. But perhaps I just take better care if my equipment.

And PE has always advised against dry firing. Sooooo.....I guess it's just a flaw that you'll have to live with. As I'm pretty positive PE isn't going to build a 1.5 just so you guys can dry fire. Take better care if your gun and get a hopper that doesn't jam.


And I notice you clearly skipped over the part when I, and another, said "you aren't supposed to dry fire it EXCESSIVELY". So you far fetched scenario isn't going to destroy the gun
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Old 06-06-2014, 09:24 AM #75
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If you are wanting vanquish I honestly think a luxe is the better way to go. The gun has more internal volume (lower operaton pressure), talking bosrd with screen (OLED model) and a little bit better ergonomics for me. It also has the tooless eye removal which is extremely handy for cleaning the eyes in a pinch and the detents are superior to the pre 1.5 detents which basically forced you to either remove the spring or pull your bolt out to prevent deformation of the eye covers. The feathertouch manifold also allows you to slow the front bolt speed and customize the speed of the rear bolt movement for one of the smoothest shots possible (honestly not sure if the vanquish has an adjustable manifold). Lastly the Eigenbolt just released for the Luxe which, if it is anything like the Shocker one, should yield some very impressive efficiency numbers.

The Vanquish does have some things going for it: wired eyes, single tool disassembly, screen with pressure readout, etc. but the Luxe is still in my opinion, the slightly more refined package. Try to hold and shoot them both and see what you think.

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Old 06-06-2014, 09:46 AM #76
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Just answer this....why the hell would you dry fire a marker anyway? To show the cool kids how it sounds when it won't sound the same with a ball in the barrel.....just stupid. Don't be an artard and dry fire any marker there is no point in that outside of self masturbation basically.....

I suggest you play with these markers. Find them in a shop. Hold them see what feels right. Then shoot them. This will give you your decision.
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Old 06-06-2014, 10:25 AM #77
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Just answer this....why the hell would you dry fire a marker anyway? To show the cool kids how it sounds when it won't sound the same with a ball in the barrel.....just stupid. Don't be an artard and dry fire any marker there is no point in that outside of self masturbation basically.....

I suggest you play with these markers. Find them in a shop. Hold them see what feels right. Then shoot them. This will give you your decision.
Aside from a quick function check, your right. I generally recommend people put a barrel swab down the barrel so there is some back pressure when dry firing any gun. Eclipse also sells a "Muffler kit" that is handy for quietly and safely dry firing markers.

I also can't comment on the LV1 however I put a lot of paint through my Geo 3 which was already used when I bought it and never had an issue using the rubber tips. I have heard of people saying they have had it pop off so I won't completely dismiss it, but I would suspect that some sort of neglect or failure to replace a badly worn tip was involved.

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Old 06-06-2014, 10:28 AM #78
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I think the best thing to do then is just buy 50 reballs or whatever and give it a go into your couch.
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