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Old 01-29-2013, 10:58 AM #1
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rapid fire drop off

Can you guys help me out with a quick question? My luxe is having trouble maintaining bps on everything but the first two shots at around 290fps and then slows down to puff puff although 1 shot/second seems to be right at 290fps consistent. This seems easy except I tried a different tank (HPR assumed, myth reg) that shot perfectly with my first shot being in the 350 area so I HPR'd down and hit 288-292 on every single shot and 15bps semi felt like it was flying the same. I took my tank, my rotor and my friends rail and his gun seemed fine at whatever his bps cap was like 12 or so.

The last couple of weeks it has been colder, so I didn't mind going up with the dwell but I'm at 25 with or without FT when I normally run 16/FT in and this last weekend it was 75 and sunny.

I have a 2.0 and a 1st gen ninja adjustable reg on a old school dxs tank set to 1 silver, 1 red shim (taking out 1 red shim from when it was hpr new from ninja)

I inspected the HPR and all of the orings (replaced the sail, inner can and back cap from UR to BN, same) as well as rebuilt the regulator on the tank although I don't have a way of testing its recharge rate.
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Old 01-29-2013, 11:44 AM #2
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If you tried a different tank and it works great, try adding that other red shim. Otherwise you'll want to follow the general rules for eliminating shoot down...back out your manifold, run the higher dwell (16-20 compensates for a lower input pressure), and see what happens.

Also, make sure the noid is properly installed and no part of it is loose. You could also take the core out and gas it up slightly to blow out any excess grease from the air passages.
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Old 01-29-2013, 01:34 PM #3
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Thanks for the tips, I have almost no access to an air source during the week so I have been trying to avoid venting the tank again after rebuilding it this weekend (and adding one small silver shim) but I can try running high pressure as I did when the luxe was new. I did vent the tank over the weekend to rebuild the reg by pulling the power core and running the asa maybe 50% open for a few minutes so that should have cleared any air passages completely out although the core itself could be full but I pulled the cap for 10 seconds with the ASA on with no change. That shouldn't really be a concern though because another tank resolves the issue. I really want to blame the tank/reg, but the tank works on two other guns now (the rail previously and a NT this morning)

In a quiet room, I can't hear any leaks and rechecked that the solenoid is secure and the manifold is not loose. The manifold screw has gone from a few turns out above flush to a few turns in but it's flush right now.

The dwell has been changed from 16, 18, 20, 22 to 25 with no change and FT in or out. Primarily out for this testing but I have always used it prior to the past few weeks.

Does having to run higher dwell in the 22 area at 50 degrees help diagnose this at all? Does that indicate some type of impending failure that I was covering up with high dwell even though I usually run 16 at 70 degrees?
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Old 01-29-2013, 05:06 PM #4
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Simply sounds like the tank reg is starving the marker. Seems to have nothing to do with the marker at all.

The NT has an operating pressure of 130 PSI; the luxe has an operating pressure closer to 200 PSI. This is a very big difference and would explain why the luxe is starving and the NT isn't.

I'd blame tank reg 100%

I was blaming my marker for a while when I had the same type of issue. Turns out my myth2 reg went bad and needed servicing. I just switched to a ninja reg and never looked back.
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Old 01-30-2013, 01:25 PM #5
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I was also having some Luxe issues, but I went from SLP, to mid pressure (550ish), to high (800ish) with improved results each time
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Old 01-31-2013, 03:38 AM #6
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Philly's onto it. I've just gone from a Myth2 (650) to a CenterFlag (450) and didn't even have adjust velocity from last time out and experienced no drop off
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Old 01-31-2013, 09:05 AM #7
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Even if the tank reg is good, sometimes certain combinations of regs and on/offs don't work and restrict flow. It sounds like you have done a good job ruling out the other possibilities. It sounds like the tank reg...
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Old 01-31-2013, 09:29 AM #8
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Thanks guys, I really didn't want to hear about a $60 problem but I think so too.. at any rate, now I can get the adjustable top hat
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Old 01-31-2013, 10:16 AM #9
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air blockage

Quote:
Originally Posted by poopresearch View Post
Even if the tank reg is good, sometimes certain combinations of regs and on/offs don't work and restrict flow. It sounds like you have done a good job ruling out the other possibilities. It sounds like the tank reg...
Very true. It could simply be that your ASA knob is blocking air flow on your tank because the pin depth isn't quite right on the tank reg. In other words the knob is blocking air flow out of the tank.

Try to turn the knob slowly until the gun airs up then maybe another quarter turn and leave it. Don't screw it all the way in until it stops. See if that helps.
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Old 01-31-2013, 10:19 AM #10
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^^^ True. I don't think it's necessary, but I always turn my on/off on all the way until it's fully engaged and then back it out a quarter of a turn. You could try this before you buy a new reg.
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Old 01-31-2013, 05:46 PM #11
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Originally Posted by B Baller View Post
Thanks guys, I really didn't want to hear about a $60 problem but I think so too.. at any rate, now I can get the adjustable top hat
$60..? A ninja reg is right around $35. I would highly suggest getting the ninja reg.
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Old 02-01-2013, 10:41 AM #12
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@#$* it was the tank reg.. (the $35 ninja variety from around 2008 no problems until now)

I bought one of the ninja pro's to have the adjustable hat so the fill nipple doesn't poke me, it had 2 thick and 2 thin shims so I removed 1 thick shim from SHP and the luxe is perfect again

Good call on the Luxe ASA btw, I usually barely screw it in just until I hear the gun gas up as it seems like it has way too much travel.

anyway, not a Luxe problem! thanks guys
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Old 02-01-2013, 11:26 AM #13
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Hey B Baller
Glad to hear your using a new N-Pro system with you Luxe.
I see you mentioned SHP , Did you install a Pro SHP reg system?
Ninja Pro SHP series systems are designed for Mags and Tippmann`s
Ninja Pro series Adjustable systems only use 3 silver-grey style adjustment shims, Let us know which Pro system your currently using
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Old 02-07-2013, 02:01 AM #14
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You were right, I was thinking of the other reg

I have the 3 shim variety, running 2 shims total in the pro adjustable
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Old 02-08-2013, 03:04 PM #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MstrKey View Post
Very true. It could simply be that your ASA knob is blocking air flow on your tank because the pin depth isn't quite right on the tank reg. In other words the knob is blocking air flow out of the tank.

Try to turn the knob slowly until the gun airs up then maybe another quarter turn and leave it. Don't screw it all the way in until it stops. See if that helps.
Quote:
Originally Posted by poopresearch View Post
^^^ True. I don't think it's necessary, but I always turn my on/off on all the way until it's fully engaged and then back it out a quarter of a turn. You could try this before you buy a new reg.
Because of past issues with various tank regs and how far they like their pins depressed, I recommend doing what these guys suggested. I never screw the ASA all the way in... it's backed out a bit to help avoid these types of problems. That being said, I haven't had a issue like this with Ninja tanks since they pretty much work perfectly everytime.

Good luck!
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Old 02-08-2013, 04:16 PM #16
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It's really cool that ninja actually posted on here to help out a customer.
They literally went out of their way and forum, Just to help someone make sure they are using the right pressure.
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Old 02-13-2013, 03:35 AM #17
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It's really cool that ninja actually posted on here to help out a customer.
They literally went out of their way and forum, Just to help someone make sure they are using the right pressure.
Thats why I am a complete advocate for Ninja!

I have always screwed my ASA knob all the way in (dough)! Even I learned something new. I love this forum!
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