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Old 02-02-2013, 03:01 PM #169
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Yeah price point is going to be key. With Empire coming out with two guns and these guys with PE coming out with a all new Ego style. Things should be very interesting come end of Feb.
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Old 02-02-2013, 03:15 PM #170
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The price point is good, very good.
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Old 02-02-2013, 03:24 PM #171
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Originally Posted by f8al View Post
The price point is good, very good.
and very competitive
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Old 02-02-2013, 03:36 PM #172
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Looks interesting, but if the quality is that of the other recent new comers.. (Vapor & demon spring to mind as flops)
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Old 02-02-2013, 03:41 PM #173
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Quote:
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Looks interesting, but if the quality is that of the other recent new comers.. (Vapor & demon spring to mind as flops)
This guy wasn't making guns for someone else (ZR1) where tolerances were off and then coming up with his own design where the tolerances were still off (Vapor).

As for the Demon....well I'm not gonna comment on that.

Based on what I have been told about this marker, it will deliver the performance they are promising. A new platform at a competitive price point is EXACTLY what this sport needs if you ask me
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Old 02-02-2013, 04:14 PM #174
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Screams new creed, lets get some things here

Same ASA what looks like an empire axe
Same design that Alex did on the creed for the prototype of the Lancer for the regulator.
Same looking feedneck
Li-po battery 100k shots. (sound familar?)
Same trigger guard as the Creed
Same kind of rubber grip deisng that it looks like, same amount of space between the rubber and the trigger guard.
Only thing i can see that does not look like a modified creed is the Ego part that is unique to them is under the bolt where it extends out to your wrist when holding it.
But considering Alex didnt get paid from Vanguard far as i know, and how Vanguard did not purchase the rights to the creed and is discontinued, I could understand alex selling the design to another company with a few improvements.

Alex, are you behind this? I take it that you are since you are not posting about this. But every other gun thats announced that you're not part of you manage to make almost ALWAYS a first page comment on it..
Wow I was just talking about a design exactly like this last month that's been in my head for about a decade lol. NICE! Can't wait to see how she flies.
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Old 02-02-2013, 05:37 PM #175
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Looks and sounds interesting can't wait to see this release and hear more about it.
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Old 02-02-2013, 09:18 PM #176
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This design is brilliant in it's simplicity. Honestly i don' know why it hasn't happened earlier, and why such an important patent never fell to the high power hawks. But i'm really glad, I made a snide patent comment on MCB but I didn't realize it was a small company of paintball fanatics that had grabbed it. I assumed it was a shell, with a major producer hiring them and owning the patent. I SO glad to hear members and paintball fans personally own/run this company/patent.

Further I really think this could be...I'll say an Ego killer. I think anyone being honest would admit Spools have major advantages, but many things about poppits makes them IMO the better call in paintball markers. This marker has ever positive aspect of both while fixing EVERY problem. At a pretty high price point I imagine it could dominate the high end marker. I imagine the design will allow it to shoot far better in cold weather then any spool to date (save maybe the old shoeboxes) and be perhaps the smoothest shooting stacked tube.

I am hoping that I was picking up on hints that you guys are trying to beat the price point on other high ends. I am hoping I am right, because despite my praise I won't be spending anywhere close to a 1k on this. I just tend to not think (at my level of play right now) its worth it, but if i'm right that this is targeted at being a "high end play, mid range price" option, with fancy milling pushing some versions into higher price ranges I'll be sold.

For 800-1000 it would just be another cool marker, albiet an innovative one IMO.

For 600-800 it is interesting, and a nice progression in the sport.

If the price new can be in the 250-400 range for the base model it would be, in my mind REVOLUTIONARY. and could really pose a major threat for the high end producers out there.

If everything works out right, i feel it could combine the best features of an Ego and a Dye Matrix, albiet with a very different internal design. The east of cleaning/maintaining of the ego/geo style markers (as well as the better ability to handle cold) with DM style smoothness. That would be amazing to begin with, if you'all deliver it at a third the cost, it'll change the sport.
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Old 02-02-2013, 09:35 PM #177
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I'm doing all the design work for J4 for the launch at extravaganza, and I must say he is one hell of a nice guy and just awesome to work with. I hope this really takes off for him. I believe good things happen to good people and I know this will be a huge success. That being said wait to you see the t-shirt design. You can check it out on J4 paintball's Facebook page.
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Old 02-02-2013, 09:43 PM #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99BPS View Post
This design is brilliant in it's simplicity. Honestly i don' know why it hasn't happened earlier, and why such an important patent never fell to the high power hawks. But i'm really glad, I made a snide patent comment on MCB but I didn't realize it was a small company of paintball fanatics that had grabbed it. I assumed it was a shell, with a major producer hiring them and owning the patent. I SO glad to hear members and paintball fans personally own/run this company/patent.

Further I really think this could be...I'll say an Ego killer. I think anyone being honest would admit Spools have major advantages, but many things about poppits makes them IMO the better call in paintball markers. This marker has ever positive aspect of both while fixing EVERY problem. At a pretty high price point I imagine it could dominate the high end marker. I imagine the design will allow it to shoot far better in cold weather then any spool to date (save maybe the old shoeboxes) and be perhaps the smoothest shooting stacked tube.

I am hoping that I was picking up on hints that you guys are trying to beat the price point on other high ends. I am hoping I am right, because despite my praise I won't be spending anywhere close to a 1k on this. I just tend to not think (at my level of play right now) its worth it, but if i'm right that this is targeted at being a "high end play, mid range price" option, with fancy milling pushing some versions into higher price ranges I'll be sold.

For 800-1000 it would just be another cool marker, albiet an innovative one IMO.

For 600-800 it is interesting, and a nice progression in the sport.

If the price new can be in the 250-400 range for the base model it would be, in my mind REVOLUTIONARY. and could really pose a major threat for the high end producers out there.

If everything works out right, i feel it could combine the best features of an Ego and a Dye Matrix, albiet with a very different internal design. The east of cleaning/maintaining of the ego/geo style markers (as well as the better ability to handle cold) with DM style smoothness. That would be amazing to begin with, if you'all deliver it at a third the cost, it'll change the sport.
Lmao
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Old 02-02-2013, 09:48 PM #179
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Dont exactly agree with price points there 99BPS. Your lowest end price, I honestly wouldnt see it being feasible.. have to remember alot of markers in that price point lack the bells and whistles as well as being mass produced in cheap labor chinese and taiwan factories. Now perhaps a lowest model at 500, with the LED and just a single color and no extraordinary milling... mayhaps.

600-650 much more justifiable for said model. A model up with perhaps still a LED board, but now with multiple different color choices and different milling for lets say 800. And a top tier model at the 950-1050 mark with the OLED, multiple colors, including fades or perhaps made to order and a barrel kit. Then yes Id def forsee it being able to hang in the market against the competition that has the mid and high end range covered in products.
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Old 02-02-2013, 09:56 PM #180
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I realize im pretty hyped, but design wise there is a lot of potencial. And it's a small company with awesome operating flexibility. It would be really sick to see something with the quality of high end from a company with no need to put that type of price tag on it. Alien does this pretty well, but use more of less the most basic design possible.

The concept here really does a good job (completely in theory) of outdoing the best marker on the market today. I qualify that by saying, if it works as intended, this marker will just shoot. It will be the easiest marker on the field to keep running, will shoot as fast as your hopper allows (the design should allow for very high ROFs if run at a higher operating pressure. And if claims are true would be able to shoot in the cold much better then anything out today. The hall sensor ensure their is no bolt stick, period, this means none of the problems that exist in modern spool valves.

I realize i'm being somewhat hyperbolic but anyone who as thought about this design or something similar realizes that mechanically their is a lot of potencial. The sensor, if it works in an ideal manner (and I'm kinda trusting the guys who have spent years working on this marker, and chose a hall sensor over other options) would eliminate just, SOOOOO MANY issues we see in modern markers.

Basically you turn it on, air it up and the marker adapts to the conditions. Your marker would be PERFECTLY tuned for every day of play, no matter the temperature without you having to every do anything. The hall sensor takes the idea of an electro to the next level, it allows the marker to self regulate and see when its not cycling perfectly. Even Luxe's at 1600$ have FSDO problems till they introduced the age old spring, which has its own set of issues. The hall sensor means this marker won't ever have that issue, hell a new DM13 would NOT like a day of play in Vermont this time of year, if executed perfectly this would be one of the few electros that would shoot well, and it even uses a battery that can withstand the cold (li-p).

So sure, i'm pretty hyped on the marker, but I have reason to be. And I promise to eat my words if i'm wrong. I dont get this hyped about products in paintball, ever.

PaPB - Your right of course. It will almost certainly be no less then 600$.A marker 100% Revolutionary is not at all likely. I was just saying that considering how solid I feel the platform is I think it would honestly transform the sport at a midend price. NOT that I think that would happen. I agree of course.
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Old 02-02-2013, 09:59 PM #181
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Heard some good info about this marker today. I'm really looking forward to the week before Extravaganza. I almost can't wait actually.

I'm almost positive I'll be shooting one of these this season.
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Old 02-02-2013, 10:21 PM #182
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Originally Posted by 99BPS View Post
For 800-1000 it would just be another cool marker, albiet an innovative one IMO.

For 600-800 it is interesting, and a nice progression in the sport.

If the price new can be in the 250-400 range for the base model it would be, in my mind REVOLUTIONARY. and could really pose a major threat for the high end producers out there.
It would be suicide for a new, small company to follow this pricing on the only marker they have available.
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Old 02-02-2013, 10:34 PM #183
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Well three weeks to go until us dealers get to see it and promote it to the players. I think this year is going to be interesting. With Empire releasing two guns, PE coming out with something different as far as ego wise. Then these guys coming out with something completly different as well. I think the $600-$1000 gun market I'd going to be a bear this year.
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Old 02-02-2013, 10:51 PM #184
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Quote:
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Dont exactly agree with price points there 99BPS. Your lowest end price, I honestly wouldnt see it being feasible.. have to remember alot of markers in that price point lack the bells and whistles as well as being mass produced in cheap labor chinese and taiwan factories. Now perhaps a lowest model at 500, with the LED and just a single color and no extraordinary milling... mayhaps.

600-650 much more justifiable for said model. A model up with perhaps still a LED board, but now with multiple different color choices and different milling for lets say 800. And a top tier model at the 950-1050 mark with the OLED, multiple colors, including fades or perhaps made to order and a barrel kit. Then yes Id def forsee it being able to hang in the market against the competition that has the mid and high end range covered in products.
Chinese manufacturing is so cheap. Hell, USA is cheap if you know where to go.
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Old 02-02-2013, 11:45 PM #185
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Old 02-03-2013, 12:17 AM #186
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Chinese manufacturing is so cheap. Hell, USA is cheap if you know where to go.
Scale and company size are important. Under 1000 units the US is entirely unfeasible, and even china gets too expensive to build, sell, support and turn a reasonable profit on a marker for $400. And if you've got no existing business structure or other products, even more so.
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Old 02-03-2013, 05:57 AM #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99BPS View Post
I realize im pretty hyped, but design wise there is a lot of potencial. And it's a small company with awesome operating flexibility. It would be really sick to see something with the quality of high end from a company with no need to put that type of price tag on it. Alien does this pretty well, but use more of less the most basic design possible.

The concept here really does a good job (completely in theory) of outdoing the best marker on the market today. I qualify that by saying, if it works as intended, this marker will just shoot. It will be the easiest marker on the field to keep running, will shoot as fast as your hopper allows (the design should allow for very high ROFs if run at a higher operating pressure. And if claims are true would be able to shoot in the cold much better then anything out today. The hall sensor ensure their is no bolt stick, period, this means none of the problems that exist in modern spool valves.

I realize i'm being somewhat hyperbolic but anyone who as thought about this design or something similar realizes that mechanically their is a lot of potencial. The sensor, if it works in an ideal manner (and I'm kinda trusting the guys who have spent years working on this marker, and chose a hall sensor over other options) would eliminate just, SOOOOO MANY issues we see in modern markers.

Basically you turn it on, air it up and the marker adapts to the conditions. Your marker would be PERFECTLY tuned for every day of play, no matter the temperature without you having to every do anything. The hall sensor takes the idea of an electro to the next level, it allows the marker to self regulate and see when its not cycling perfectly. Even Luxe's at 1600$ have FSDO problems till they introduced the age old spring, which has its own set of issues. The hall sensor means this marker won't ever have that issue, hell a new DM13 would NOT like a day of play in Vermont this time of year, if executed perfectly this would be one of the few electros that would shoot well, and it even uses a battery that can withstand the cold (li-p).

So sure, i'm pretty hyped on the marker, but I have reason to be. And I promise to eat my words if i'm wrong. I dont get this hyped about products in paintball, ever.

PaPB - Your right of course. It will almost certainly be no less then 600$.A marker 100% Revolutionary is not at all likely. I was just saying that considering how solid I feel the platform is I think it would honestly transform the sport at a midend price. NOT that I think that would happen. I agree of course.
How can you even tout these claims with so much vaporware in paintball? I cannot count the number of manufacturers that have failed on start up or never even got passed the design stage. This company has proved nothing and you're already claiming its the best thing since the wheel.

I'm glad you all have a boner for something you've never seen, but this marker will have to prove itself on the field first before I drop a dime on it. I've owned Vapors and Demons, so I'm familiar with lemons. I put my trust in established companies, I've lost too much cash buying the next big thing to make claims like 99bps
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Old 02-03-2013, 08:12 AM #188
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How can you even tout these claims with so much vaporware in paintball? I cannot count the number of manufacturers that have failed on start up or never even got passed the design stage. This company has proved nothing and you're already claiming its the best thing since the wheel.

I'm glad you all have a boner for something you've never seen, but this marker will have to prove itself on the field first before I drop a dime on it. I've owned Vapors and Demons, so I'm familiar with lemons. I put my trust in established companies, I've lost too much cash buying the next big thing to make claims like 99bps
Ive shot Ego's, and Geos(exception of geo3), and Dm8-12's, Macdev Gt, and so far i was very happy with my creeds with ZERO issues, and i have ZERO issues with my demon, Very happy purchases and will be sending in my demon for 2013 parts next week just to see what it will be like, and not to fix the QEV since i dont have FSDO and qev issues. I waited a while before buying anything New. Any new product has its issues, but so far Creeds and demons have had theirs worked out.
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Old 02-03-2013, 08:28 AM #189
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Interesting..
Can't wait to see this at the extravaganza. Always great to see new companies.
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