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Old 01-28-2013, 02:04 PM #1
Dyepaintball088
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Exclamation Champions/Challengers and My Concerns

http://pspevents.com/2013/01/champio...sp-pro-league/

First of all I want to start off by saying this is an amazing concept, I feel like it wasn't thought out fully enough from the players perspective. Here are the problems I see with it.

MONEY/Sponsorship
This is the main problem with moving up to Pro. It is even stated in the article that most teams jumping to Pro is to big of a jump. The reason behind this is that most teams don't have the funding to compete in Pro, there are a lot of players/teams that have the athletic skill and drive to play Pro, they just do not have the funding or sponsorship available to them.

Even when some teams do have just enough money and sponsorship to play Pro, they do not have any extra to keep up with the level of practice that the top Pro teams maintain at.

I feel like this will just result in a repetitive and/or negative cycle flowing from D1>Challenger>Champion. I feel like D1 had a HUGE resurgence last year as years past had 6-8 teams competing, and it would be sad to see it return back to 07'-08' era.

I'll use myself as an example. Last year I competed in D1 for the first 4/5 events. Our team pretty much payed our own way for the most part. I wont go into the numbers but I am sure most of you have experienced paying full price for an event out of your own pocket and what a burden it is to do it year round. I AM NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT CURRENT COSTS FOR EVENTS. As a result I could not afford to play WC and for the same reason do not currently have a team.

So lets say my team (Team A) wins the first D1 event. We are put into the challenger bracket with 5 of the bottom Pro teams and the other 2 of the top 3 D1 teams (just theory).
Here's where the problem lies. The 3 D1 teams go from playing Rto5 to Rto7. I don't have the exact numbers but your paint bill is going to skyrocket up, not only this but they are going to have to greatly increase there practice regiment to be able to compete in Challenger.

TL;DR
Same 8-10 teams go through a cycle of Challenger>Pro>Challenger etc...
Thus slowly draining there pockets and never gaining anymore sponsorship and or losing sponsorship during or fort the next year because they are no longer or still aren't playing on the webcast, and slowly these teams fall apart or have there best players picked up by pro teams.
Players now have to calculate whether they can not only just afford D1 costs, but the chance that they get moved up and have to increase there costs of Challenger/Champion.

Pls feel free to discuss/critize and comment.
Sorry if this makes no sense writing it sick on antibiotics with no sleep
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:21 PM #2
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I think you may have understood. The change only affects the pro teams. No D1 teams get pushed to pro. Both pro groups will have the same rules. There will be no moving from RT5 to RT7. But your other point on sponsorships and webcast is very valid.
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:38 PM #3
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The PSP Professional teams will compete against each other in the 2013 PSP Dallas Open. The top 10 teams from that event will move on to PSP’s Event #2 and play in the newly established Champions Division. They will perform on the main field for all the glory in front of thousands of fans watching from the PaintballAccess.com webcast and the PSP grandstands.

The other Pro teams from the Dallas Open will be enlisted in a new division known as the Challengers Division.* They will be joining other teams to be named at a later date. The group of teams in the Challengers Divisions will use the same format and rules, but play on a secondary Professional field during the prelims and will play their final match on the main field for all their fans to watch. Starting after Event #2, the top two teams from the Challengers Division in each event will move up and compete in the PSP Champions Division for the following event. They will be replacing the bottom 2 finishers from the previous event’s Champions Division, who will instead perform in the Challengers Division.
From what I understand they are splitting up the pro division after Dallas to a Champions bracket and a Challengers bracket. Divisional teams won't be affected.

*Edit: I guess this is the part that is in question.

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Old 01-28-2013, 02:39 PM #4
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I guess I'm confused/curious as to how many teams total there will combined between the two brackets. I know there's 10 in the "Champions bracket" but I imagine their can't be just 5 teams in the "challenger bracket." Say if there's 20 teams combined in both brackets(10 each) then that means some D1 teams are getting bumped to the "challenger bracket." Which brings me to the question, who's getting bumped up and is it determined if they win an event?

Which then brings back to the original post, how in the hell would a D1 team afford that?
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:43 PM #5
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I think they will need to move up at least a few D1 Teams in order to create a successful challenger division, maybe there are a few teams we aren't hearing about, but I don't think they have enough "pro" teams to have two divisions.

Having said that... I believe this is an awful idea. I understand that some teams struggle in the pro division and that the bump from D1 to Pro is rather large, but this will make it very difficult for new teams to become well established pro teams. Vicious just started to make sunday matches this year, and if they had to constantly battle between which division they were in then i don't believe they would have become as successful. And what if a very established pro team (dynasty, damage, heat) does poorly at a tourney, then they are screwed for the next event competing against teams they will most likely crush. I'm all for creating some other kind of division to allow more pro teams to compete, but switching between every event is going to get hectic and hold teams back from there potential.
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:47 PM #6
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It amazes me that such a change is just now being released, only a few weeks prior to the first event. It appears that even the pro teams didn't know it was coming.

Astonishing.
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:54 PM #7
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Some d1 teams will have to move up and out of the division to make the challenger division relevant. Tyler has a very valid point. Another wrench in the wheel is that will the d1 teams that are moving up play the first event in d1 or sit out until the next event. The teams moving up are-should be the top 3 from last year so I was wondering about that as well.
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:26 PM #8
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How in the world are those teams moving up into the Challlenger Bracket going to be able to keep up financially?
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:31 PM #9
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semi pro?

so the best D1's will play with the worst Pro's......

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Old 01-28-2013, 03:32 PM #10
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I would assume that they would not force the teams into the challengers division if they could not afford it.
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:33 PM #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyepaintball088 View Post
So lets say my team (Team A) wins the first D1 event. We are put into the challenger bracket with 5 of the bottom Pro teams and the other 2 of the top 3 D1 teams (just theory).
I didn't see PSP say anywhere that D1 teams would be forced into the Pro division. They didn't say it because they are not doing it.

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Old 01-28-2013, 03:38 PM #12
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I didn't see PSP say anywhere that D1 teams would be forced into the Pro division. They didn't say it because they are not doing it.

- Chris
14 Pro teams from WC last year, adding Ton Tons, and T1 Topgun Union.

So the Challenger division will have 6 teams? If not, where do the additional teams come from?
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Old 01-28-2013, 03:47 PM #13
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The other Pro teams from the Dallas Open will be enlisted in a new division known as the Challengers Division. They will be joining other teams to be named at a later date.

hmm...wonder who the other teams might be?
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:49 PM #14
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Originally Posted by Splatkid10 View Post
14 Pro teams from WC last year, adding Ton Tons, and T1 Topgun Union.

So the Challenger division will have 6 teams? If not, where do the additional teams come from?
Volunteer D1 teams that the PSP deem worthy enough to compete in the division? I think the PSP will get (or have already gotten) enough teams to fill out the bracket. No real knowledge... just a guess.
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Old 01-28-2013, 06:56 PM #15
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I didn't see PSP say anywhere that D1 teams would be forced into the Pro division. They didn't say it because they are not doing it.

- Chris
Also neglected was what the other "challenger teams" will do during the first event. So truthfully his point was valid because PSP has failed to be thorough with explanations.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:00 PM #16
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Originally Posted by Splatkid10 View Post
14 Pro teams from WC last year, adding Ton Tons, and T1 Topgun Union.

So the Challenger division will have 6 teams? If not, where do the additional teams come from?

Confused on this as well, because I can't imagine the psp will "force" any D1 teams from moving up to the Challenger Division as Chris even said. So I am guessing that the Challenger Division will be locked to simply the bottom 6 pro teams. Basically making all pro teams constantly earn their spot in the pro division. Or by choice can a few division 1 teams enter the Challenger division? And what if by an unlikely chance, but possible a D1 team actually placed in the top 2 tier, do they move up?
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:04 PM #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splatkid10 View Post
14 Pro teams from WC last year, adding Ton Tons, and T1 Topgun Union.

So the Challenger division will have 6 teams? If not, where do the additional teams come from?
Topgun is staying D1
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:27 PM #18
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Cool concept, but this same concept is used over in the Millennium series. It quite simply has a different name here. Honestly I much prefer the regular system of pro all the way to d4.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:42 PM #19
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Cool concept, but this same concept is used over in the Millennium series. It quite simply has a different name here. Honestly I much prefer the regular system of pro all the way to d4.
The Millennium Series is way different. The overall standings at the end of the season dictate which teams are promoted, or relegated. It's not decided based on a single event.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:44 PM #20
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Quote:
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Confused on this as well, because I can't imagine the psp will "force" any D1 teams from moving up to the Challenger Division as Chris even said. So I am guessing that the Challenger Division will be locked to simply the bottom 6 pro teams. Basically making all pro teams constantly earn their spot in the pro division. Or by choice can a few division 1 teams enter the Challenger division? And what if by an unlikely chance, but possible a D1 team actually placed in the top 2 tier, do they move up?
Yes this is true, according to the information gathered online.

So say LTZ came back and played D1 Dallas and won the event.
And got invited into the Challengers Bracket for Event 2.

Now they won Event 2 and now in Event 3 play in the Champions Bracket.

So you can play in three different divisions in 1 year...

Thats what I'm getting out of it.

But you must be "INVITED" into the Challengers Bracket as it is locked like the Champions Bracket.
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Old 01-28-2013, 08:18 PM #21
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But you must be "INVITED" into the Challengers Bracket as it is locked like the Champions Bracket.
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