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Old 01-14-2013, 10:15 AM #22
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This is all great advice and I appreciate it. Keep Me from spending unnecessary money that can go to other wise useful things like paint! I'm curious about the 4c eyes. If they are t needed then why make an addition slot for it? According to the reading I've done it shaves off milliseconds . That has to be good, concidering that's what we strive for is faster times. No?
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Old 01-14-2013, 10:22 AM #23
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The 4c eyes are mainly used for shooting in semi mode. If you are shooting in a ramp mode of any sort, they are not needed. The regular 2c eyes are just fine for that.
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Old 01-14-2013, 10:26 AM #24
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Not really, if you can only shoot 12.5bps(15max) then why do you need a pair of eyes to increase your gun speed to 20-25bps?

Basically, the normal method is to use the break beam eyes, then when the gun detects a ball breaking the beam(meaning the gun is loaded) it doesn't allow the gun to fire for 10ms(basically 1/100th of a second) to let the ball settle in the breach. With 4c eyes the gun tracks the ball down so it electronically tracks the balls progress until it fully settles.

It sounds like something you need, however in practice the gun is just fine using the delay. It sounds cool, but if you get it, it won't make a bit of difference in the performance of the gun.
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Old 01-14-2013, 10:57 AM #25
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Old 01-14-2013, 11:03 AM #26
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My $.02

You have to have the tester and reliable gauges. Get an oring kit with some Tri-Flow and dow55. I would recomend the lp poppet, I love mine. A low pressure tank is good for the marker (I have an slp, but looking back I would buy a ninja adjustable instead). Techt bolt sucks don't buy it for the g6r, and read anything in the manual and FAQ the information is very helpful.
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Old 01-14-2013, 11:36 AM #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catdaddysmooth00 View Post
This is all great advice and I appreciate it. Keep Me from spending unnecessary money that can go to other wise useful things like paint! I'm curious about the 4c eyes. If they are t needed then why make an addition slot for it? According to the reading I've done it shaves off milliseconds . That has to be good, concidering that's what we strive for is faster times. No?
The 4c eyes are a noticeable improvement in semi play. If you are going to be playing a lot of semi, I would definitely recommend them. They, along with a trigger that is comfortable to you, will help you get the fastest, most consistent streams possible.

The reason why they aren't worth it for some is because a lot of tournament play these days is done with ramping and a good number of players only use semi for occasional rec or fun play. The 4c eyes are nice but not really needed for these people. I love mine, I thought I could do without them until one of them broke and I had to go back to the 2c eyes. I ended purchasing replacements.

Here is my thought on other upgrades: Dow 55, Triflow, and an O-ring kit are no brainers.

Bolts: Only minimal improvements if any improvements over stock.
LP Poppit: A pretty popular upgrade that works as advertised. Allows you to run lower hpr pressures which give a slightly smoother and quieter shot.
Board: Minimal improvements if any.
4c eyes: Noticeable consistency and speed improvement.
Trigger: Totally a preference. A comfortable trigger is going to allow you to shoot fast. The stock is an excellent trigger if it is comfortable.
SLP: This will give a pretty good efficiency increase for efficiency nuts. For the price I think it is one of the better purchases for the G6R.
Zero Ping ram: Not an essential item, it can quiet down the return sound of the ram some if that bothers you.
Pressure Guage: I feel this is an essential item, it allows quick adjustment and reference of your pressures which will keep your gun running perfect.
Barrel: Performance wise the stock barrel is great. Some might have a preference to more bore or porting options.

For reference I own the following: Violent Products trigger, Ebisu Board, TechT Hush Bolt, Pillow Bolt, Premium Pillow Bolt, 4c eyes, LP Poppit, SLP Pro Regulator, Dye CF Boomstick. About half the upgrades were nice and about half were a bust, overall I like trying all the different parts out and finding what works best for me.

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Old 01-14-2013, 07:41 PM #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Stealthy View Post
The 4c eyes are a noticeable improvement in semi play. If you are going to be playing a lot of semi, I would definitely recommend them. They, along with a trigger that is comfortable to you, will help you get the fastest, most consistent streams possible.

The reason why they aren't worth it for some is because a lot of tournament play these days is done with ramping and a good number of players only use semi for occasional rec or fun play. The 4c eyes are nice but not really needed for these people. I love mine, I thought I could do without them until one of them broke and I had to go back to the 2c eyes. I ended purchasing replacements.

Here is my thought on other upgrades: Dow 55, Triflow, and an O-ring kit are no brainers.

Bolts: Only minimal improvements if any improvements over stock.
LP Poppit: A pretty popular upgrade that works as advertised. Allows you to run lower hpr pressures which give a slightly smoother and quieter shot.
Board: Minimal improvements if any.
4c eyes: Noticeable consistency and speed improvement.
Trigger: Totally a preference. A comfortable trigger is going to allow you to shoot fast. The stock is an excellent trigger if it is comfortable.
SLP: This will give a pretty good efficiency increase for efficiency nuts. For the price I think it is one of the better purchases for the G6R.
Zero Ping ram: Not an essential item, it can quiet down the return sound of the ram some if that bothers you.
Pressure Guage: I feel this is an essential item, it allows quick adjustment and reference of your pressures which will keep your gun running perfect.
Barrel: Performance wise the stock barrel is great. Some might have a preference to more bore or porting options.

For reference I own the following: Violent Products trigger, Ebisu Board, TechT Hush Bolt, Pillow Bolt, Premium Pillow Bolt, 4c eyes, LP Poppit, SLP Pro Regulator, Dye CF Boomstick. About half the upgrades were nice and about half were a bust, overall I like trying all the different parts out and finding what works best for me.
this is great! i feel the same way as to trying new products, mix and matching different configurations to make the best option for me. although nowadays one must be careful cause this stuff all adds up in the end.
pb members thank you for all your input! keep up the opinions and suggestions
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Old 01-14-2013, 10:53 PM #29
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I have 2 G6r's. My 2011 is bone stock except for 4c eyes. My 2012 has 2c eyes and a violent trigger otherwise it is stock. I honestly can't tell the difference between the two. They shoot identically and I can't rip on one faster than the other. These guns are so amazing 100% stock that I would have to say you shouldn't upgrade anything on the gun until you have used it for a couple of months. The G6r will shoot an entire case on a single air fill.

1. If you haven't done it yet get an SLP regulator for your air tank. They put out around 230psi and give you the best possible efficiency from the gun. If you want to use the tank with other guns, then I suggest going for a tank regulator that puts out around 450psi. The G6r will run fine and the pressure is high enough that most modern spools and poppets can run on it too. Your old tippy wont be able to run off of pressure much lower than 600psi however. You will lose a little bit of efficiency because the regulator wont regulate down to the minimum pressure the gun can operate on, but it just means a couple of hundred shots at most you will lose. Still you will get close to a case from a full 68/4500 tank.

2. A pressure tester is quite useful. Don't mess with the gun regulators without one!!! Put the pressure tester on the gun and make note of what the gauges read. Later when you are fiddling with your G6r and completely screw it up, you can set the regs back to what they were originally. My first G6r took me a good while before I had it just right. I messed with the regs several times and made the gun shoot terribly and so I would just set it back to the original pressures and try again. No harm done and instantly I had a working gun again. If you are interested, I found a deal on decent gauges a while back and have several extra that I wont ever use. Better gauges are very helpful, but not necessary.

3. These aren't specific to the G6r and will help any gun. Get a barrel kit. Freak makes a decent kit. Get a kit that has 5-7" inserts or backs. Also bore sizes that get below .681 are good. Paint keeps getting smaller and the smaller bore sizes will help with efficiency and accuracy. Avoid any barrel kit that has bores shorter than 5 inches. Get a good loader. The Rotor is top notch and totally worth it.

4. If you are really dead set on upgrades for your gun, there are two that do make some improvement. Violent makes a great trigger for a lot of guns including the G6r. I have one on my 2012 G6r and it is pretty nice, but it's truly a comfort/preference thing. The Techt hush bolt and the BL Pillow bolt are nearly identical performance wise. They both add a little efficiency and are a little easier on brittle paint. With either bolt I can't tell the difference in the gun. The stock bolt with the oval hole in it is a little louder and less efficient than either of these bolts. You already have the pillow bolt so don't bother doing anything with your bolt. The LP poppet makes the gun shoot a tiny bit softer, but hurts efficiency too. IMHO the LP poppet isn't really an "upgrade". With tuning the regulators you can get the same effect as you get from the LP poppet and NOT lose efficiency.

I tune my G6r's like this. You will need a 1/8" allen, pressure tester and chrono. This will get you the softest shot possible and even the LP poppet wont get it better. At first you will possibly mess up the reg settings, but don't worry, just set them back to the original settings and start over.

1. Set the regs at the factory pressures if you have already messed with the regs with the pressure tester. If you haven't messed with the regs yet just record what your pressure tester reads. The gauges that come on the pressure tester aren't very accurate and usually wont read the same as the precision gauges BL uses at the factory. You will want these pressures for later reference if you mess up or just want to start over. Degass the gun, take off the pressure tester and continue to step 2.

2. Turn down the LPR until the gun starts shooting erratically and velocities are not holding within 5-10 FPS. Now turn up the LPR until the gun shoots consistently at what ever velocity it settles out at. This is the lowest pressure you can get the rammer to operate at reliably and minimize recoil. Don't worry if you aren't getting close to 280fps. It is very likely you will be in the low 200's. You will make less than 1/4 turn adjustments at a time.

3. Set the HPR to get the velocity to around 280fps on your chrono.

4. If you mess up the gun and can't get it to shoot right, just set it back to the original pressures with the pressure tester and start over.

5. Once you have the gun shooting silky smooth and consistently, put the pressure tester back on and record the new pressures for future reference.

Note: Make changes to the regulators 1/4 of a turn at most before testing the gun. The regulators are quite sensitive and small adjustments result in significant changes. After you change regulator settings shoot several times to get the gun to re-equalize at the new pressures.
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Old 01-15-2013, 05:32 PM #30
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Good info! i thought the slp reg output was 300psi? The others are 450 to 800psi output pending on shims?

Ok so after all the pros and cons on the 4c eyes ive read and done some more reading online and other forums. i have purchased the 4c laser eyes.
i will inform everyone if it makes a difference or not!
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Old 01-15-2013, 07:39 PM #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catdaddysmooth00 View Post
Good info! i thought the slp reg output was 300psi? The others are 450 to 800psi output pending on shims?

Ok so after all the pros and cons on the 4c eyes ive read and done some more reading online and other forums. i have purchased the 4c laser eyes.
i will inform everyone if it makes a difference or not!
SLP originally was listed as 275 psi. SLP Pro is now listed as 300 psi. I have heard Ninja reps say it operates around 275-300 psi. His numbers were a bit off. The adjustable ones are as you stated.
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Old 01-15-2013, 08:03 PM #32
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SLP originally was listed as 275 psi. SLP Pro is now listed as 300 psi. I have heard Ninja reps say it operates around 275-300 psi. His numbers were a bit off. The adjustable ones are as you stated.
As the reg starts to get broken in and the spring losing tension then each individual reg will operate somewhere between 300 and 275. I'm sure nobodies reg is outputting 300psi on the button.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:35 PM #33
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Put 8-9 cases through my Dragon. Shoots amazing. Haven't changed anything since I got it. There is a lot of myth of the time it takes to upkeep BL markers. I have checked the pressures every 2-3 cases and that's it. Alittle tri flow on the bolt and you are good to go. I would say leave it stock until you get a good feel for it.

Only thing I might change is the trigger to a Kodachi trigger. But that's personal preference.

Edit: read the manual. So much headache can be solved be by reading the manual. Also I have been running LP but am getting a SLP.
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Old 01-15-2013, 10:23 PM #34
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I may have had the SLP reg pressure wrong. I don't personally have one at the moment and may have just remembered it wrong from when I did. I have laser eyes in my Macdev guns and it is kind of nice to be able to see them working. Also laser eyes tend to cut through grunge better than do the regular eyes. Neither of my G6r's EVER break paint so it is very possible you will not ever need to clean your eyes. Occasionally I get a hit on or near an eye cover and sometimes paint fill gets under an eye cover. You can remove the eyes and gently wash them with an old tooth brush and water. Just be sure to thoroughly dry the eye boards before reinstalling them. I've done this to my G6r's a few times to clean the goo out of the eyes until I made some foam seals to put under they eye covers. I found the foam at the local hobby store, but you could probably find it at any store that carries hobby supplies. I spent a couple of dollars and have enough foam to make a hundred seals. The hole in the foam is so the ball detent have room to move. The edges of the foam look kind of ragged, but you can't even see that when the covers are in place. My first set of seals are quite old and look exactly like they did when first installed. When you first put in the seals (if you do make some), don't just crank down the eye cover screws. Just snug them down and then let the foam compress. after 10-15 minutes you can tighten the screws and the foam will stay compressed.


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Old 01-16-2013, 06:22 AM #35
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I may have had the SLP reg pressure wrong. I don't personally have one at the moment and may have just remembered it wrong from when I did. I have laser eyes in my Macdev guns and it is kind of nice to be able to see them working. Also laser eyes tend to cut through grunge better than do the regular eyes. Neither of my G6r's EVER break paint so it is very possible you will not ever need to clean your eyes. Occasionally I get a hit on or near an eye cover and sometimes paint fill gets under an eye cover. You can remove the eyes and gently wash them with an old tooth brush and water. Just be sure to thoroughly dry the eye boards before reinstalling them. I've done this to my G6r's a few times to clean the goo out of the eyes until I made some foam seals to put under they eye covers. I found the foam at the local hobby store, but you could probably find it at any store that carries hobby supplies. I spent a couple of dollars and have enough foam to make a hundred seals. The hole in the foam is so the ball detent have room to move. The edges of the foam look kind of ragged, but you can't even see that when the covers are in place. My first set of seals are quite old and look exactly like they did when first installed. When you first put in the seals (if you do make some), don't just crank down the eye cover screws. Just snug them down and then let the foam compress. after 10-15 minutes you can tighten the screws and the foam will stay compressed.


What do those do? help keep outside water out? Interesting mod.
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Old 01-16-2013, 08:39 AM #36
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Quote:
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What do those do? help keep outside water out? Interesting mod.
I'm guessing by his post they keep the paint that hits on the outside on his eye covers from getting underneath the eye cover
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Old 01-16-2013, 08:48 AM #37
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I'm guessing by his post they keep the paint that hits on the outside on his eye covers from getting underneath the eye cover
Trying to keep paint out of the smallest cracks in the gun? Talk about a hopeless endeavor. Paint will ALWAYS find its way in there. I have no idea how it does it, personally I think paint is able to actually pass through the aluminum.
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Old 01-16-2013, 11:56 AM #38
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Trying to keep paint out of the smallest cracks in the gun? Talk about a hopeless endeavor. Paint will ALWAYS find its way in there. I have no idea how it does it, personally I think paint is able to actually pass through the aluminum.
Paint fill gets in all kinds of places for sure! I have yet to need to clean out under my eye covers since doing this. BL ought to add them to the factory gun build in my opinion. I've taken a couple of direct hits on the eye covers since adding the seals and no fill got inside the covers. I suppose as an over-kill test I could shoot the crap out of the eye covers with another gun and see what happens. Yeah...not gonna happen!
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Old 01-16-2013, 02:44 PM #39
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I personally think you dont need any ups :/
the dragon has the premium bolt and a violent trigger on it already so i see no need to do anything besides mabee lazer 4c eyes if i have money thats burning a hole in my pocket.
My dragon is amazing stock.
Only thing is as said before me is tri-flow, pressure tester, and dow-55
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Old 01-16-2013, 04:50 PM #40
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Dragon and other package g6r's do not come with a violent trigger..
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Old 01-16-2013, 05:20 PM #41
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[QUOTE=rkenders

dude! i like the idea! i dont see why this isnt done for all markers that have eye covers. it is a pain in the butt cleaning these covers and internals especially all the divets. you have a great idea there. make more and sell me a pair!
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Old 01-16-2013, 07:37 PM #42
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[quote=catdaddysmooth00;77796650][quote=rkenders

dude! i like the idea! i dont see why this isnt done for all markers that have eye covers. it is a pain in the butt cleaning these covers and internals especially all the divets. you have a great idea there. make more and sell me a pair![/QUOTE]

PM me so the nazi's don't penalize us for offering a service or something to sell in a non BST thread.
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