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Old 01-20-2013, 09:03 PM #526
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Old 01-20-2013, 09:16 PM #527
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Old 01-20-2013, 09:38 PM #528
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcozombie View Post
[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QjZY3WiO9s[video]
Interesting back story about that little test

It was rigged from the beginning.

They used people with minimal firearms training (one had non) as the CCWer.
They used experts with firearms as the active shooters
The active shooters knew which "student" was carrying.
The active shooters knew where the CCW was going to be sitting
Oh and even with all that, the active shooter shot fewer people in the incidents in which the CCWer was able to draw and fire.


Here's a more accurate portrayal of what happens when someone with a handgun attempts to stop an attack:



http://digitaltexan.net/2012/state/d.../#.UPy4Ymd2SSA
http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/colle...invader/nD9XG/
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Last edited by slateman : 01-20-2013 at 09:41 PM.
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Old 01-20-2013, 10:00 PM #529
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[quote=slateman;77834031]Interesting back story about that little test

It was rigged from the beginning.

They used people with minimal firearms training (one had non) as the CCWer.
They used experts with firearms as the active shooters
The active shooters knew which "student" was carrying.
The active shooters knew where the CCW was going to be sitting
Oh and even with all that, the active shooter shot fewer people in the incidents in which the CCWer was able to draw and fire.
QUOTE]

-"Gun experience ranging from none at all to more than 100 hours" (The guy with the 100 hours of experince didnt fare so well).

-Does not matter who the shooter was, they were testing the reaction time of the CC holder. You cannot possilby predict or know the training an attacker has had.

-That was not specified, please show the time where they mention that

-Again that was not specified in the video, please show where they mention that.

I'll give you that last one

An interesting side note:

"Our basic course is already more hands on training than almost half the states in the country require to carry a conceled weapon."
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Old 01-20-2013, 10:06 PM #530
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[quote=marcozombie;77834271]
Quote:
Originally Posted by slateman View Post
Interesting back story about that little test

It was rigged from the beginning.

They used people with minimal firearms training (one had non) as the CCWer.
They used experts with firearms as the active shooters
The active shooters knew which "student" was carrying.
The active shooters knew where the CCW was going to be sitting
Oh and even with all that, the active shooter shot fewer people in the incidents in which the CCWer was able to draw and fire.
QUOTE]

-"Gun experience ranging from none at all to more than 100 hours" (The guy with the 100 hours of experince didnt fare so well).

-Does not matter who the shooter was, they were testing the reaction time of the CC holder. You cannot possilby predict or know the training an attacker has had.

-That was not specified, please show the time where they mention that

-Again that was not specified in the video, please show where they mention that.

I'll give you that last one

An interesting side note:

"Our basic course is already more hands on training than almost half the states in the country require to carry a conceled weapon."
http://www.buckeyefirearms.org/node/6631

It was rigged. I showed you four different cases that trump Diane Sawyer's so called "test"

Concealed carry works. It's already proven.
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Old 01-20-2013, 10:26 PM #531
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You showed nothing but picking and choosing. And so does the website.
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Old 01-20-2013, 10:30 PM #532
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It's obvious that her supposed test is rigged. The active shooter is a marksmanship expert who trains the police in shooting and strategy. He turns to the same spot each time prior to the the CCW even going for his/her gun. Oh and he goes in to the classroom KNOWING that not only is someone armed (a killer would not know this) but where that person is sitting prior to going in to the classroom. Yea ... fair test ...

The entire premise of her special was flawed in the fist place. She conducted a test and rigged it to find the information she wanted. And she still never addressed the issue that in each case where there was a CCW holder, more students made it out of the classroom alive.

I showed four separate incidents where a CCWer was able to not only engage but ultimately save lives. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of others.

You can start by reading these
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Last edited by slateman : 01-20-2013 at 10:39 PM.
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Old 01-21-2013, 12:32 AM #533
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i really dont understand why we are all still arguing about this. concealed carry works and can definitely prevent crimes from occurring or prevent them from stopping before even worse harm can be done. Also, if you take away guns, you simply take them away from good citizens. The bad guys will still obtain guns just as easy as they do now.

There really isn't much to argue here.
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Old 01-21-2013, 12:33 AM #534
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Originally Posted by jamest91 View Post
i really dont understand why we are all still arguing about this. concealed carry works and can definitely prevent crimes from occurring or prevent them from stopping before even worse harm can be done. Also, if you take away guns, you simply take them away from good citizens. The bad guys will still obtain guns just as easy as they do now.

There really isn't much to argue here.
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Old 01-21-2013, 01:18 AM #535
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Originally Posted by jamest91 View Post
i really dont understand why we are all still arguing about this. concealed carry works and can definitely prevent crimes from occurring or prevent them from stopping before even worse harm can be done. Also, if you take away guns, you simply take them away from good citizens. The bad guys will still obtain guns just as easy as they do now.
I don't get this. This certainly isn't true in most cases.

Japan
Malaysia
Singapore
China

I don't advocate a gun ban (as I have said 100 times), but most citizens/criminals in countries that do have very strong gun bans would have A LOT of trouble trying to get one.

--

You're going to say "Look at drugs". I'm not buying it. A case study of countries with high gun control is much more relevant than comparing apples (guns) to oranges (drugs).
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Old 01-21-2013, 01:46 AM #536
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I don't get this. This certainly isn't true in most cases.

Japan
Malaysia
Singapore
China
When did these countries ever have 300 million guns to begin with? And which of these countries has mexico as a neighbor?
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Old 01-21-2013, 01:49 AM #537
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China, probably.

Civil war/WWII + Next to aghanistan, even worse.
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Old 01-21-2013, 01:58 AM #538
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Civil war/WWII + Next to aghanistan, even worse.
8 of the 9 most dangerous countries in the world are in the americas, so no it's not "even worse". Afghanistan isn't even in the top 100. To put it in perspective, Afghanistan has 2.4 homicides per 100,000, and Honduras has 91.6 per 100,000.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._homicide_rate
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:03 AM #539
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...why does that matter?
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:04 AM #540
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You tell me, you're the one who wants me to believe Afghanistan is incredibly dangerous, when in fact the united states is twice as dangerous.
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:05 AM #541
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It is. Theres like 30 countries at war there, which I doubt shows up under "homicide deaths."
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:08 AM #542
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It is. Theres like 30 countries at war there, which I doubt shows up under "homicide deaths."
That's only temporary, and the same could be said if there was a war in the united states. The homicide statistics are much more concrete.
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Old 01-21-2013, 02:16 AM #543
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSilentAssassin View Post
I don't get this. This certainly isn't true in most cases.

Japan
Malaysia
Singapore
China

I don't advocate a gun ban (as I have said 100 times), but most citizens/criminals in countries that do have very strong gun bans would have A LOT of trouble trying to get one.

--

You're going to say "Look at drugs". I'm not buying it. A case study of countries with high gun control is much more relevant than comparing apples (guns) to oranges (drugs).


I don't have to pull the "Look at drugs" card. I can simply say look at current criminals today. You think they are all flocking to their local gun mart and purchasing up their weapons? They all use unregistered guns or scratch the serial numbers off the guns to make them unidentifiable, making them untraceable to the source and supplier.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:52 AM #544
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Many use legal guns too, but I agree that preventing gun crime by preventing people from getting guns is not effective.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:57 AM #545
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Its not the firearms it the people.
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:24 AM #546
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The ammunition is what kills people, it's about time we start punishing them instead of the guns.
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