[marcozombie]

If there is a God, why did he let this horrible thing happen...What was the point of letting those little ones be born if he very well knew this was going to happen as it was a part of 'the plan.'

[cckynv]

If this is a part of God's plan, or as AFA Spokesman Bryan Fischer said the children "died because the school did not embrace God", then that is not a God that I want to worship.

[marcozombie]

American Family Association spokesman Bryan Fischer had something heinous to say about the tragic school shooting in Connecticut today. He said that God allowed the shooting to happen because prayer, the Bible, and the Ten Commandments are not taught in public schools and "God is a gentleman" who does not go where he is not wanted, Right Wing Watch reports:

Fischer said that God could have protected the victims of this massacre, but didn't because "God is not going to go where he is not wanted" and so if school administrators really want to protect students, they will start every school day with prayer.

Wow.

[spracks21]

I've been fighting the strong urge all day to confront my facebook friends who are repeatedly posting statuses about how this country needs more GOD, in order to prevent these sort of things. Not the time/place, so I won't, but it's getting real tough to bite my tongue.

[Treghc]

Just show them this:

http://current.com/community/9283193...make-up-75.htm

[vijil]

It's the usual "why does God let bad things happen" argument. There have been numerous books written about it from both sides. Go read if you really want to know.

Probably a misleading stat treghc, given that in the US everyone calls themselves Christian by default. Redo the stats for only those that are actively involved in their church and it'll be more accurate. That's if the stat is genuine at all - read skWilliams comment.

[marcozombie]

Maybe I will...i'd still like to see what people on here think and why...

[ElJefe13]

God let this happen because he had to.
Part of mortal life is that people can make their own choices. This person chose to kill these kids, and he had the free agency to do that. And honestly, those kids are almost the lucky ones. They do not have to suffer through life like the rest of us. The true victims here are not the kids, but their families, but they too can find peace if they turn to God and realize they can see them again.

My $.02 anyway.

[spracks21]

Originally Posted by vijil

It's the usual "why does God let bad things happen" argument. There have been numerous books written about it from both sides. Go read if you really want to know.

Probably a misleading stat treghc, given that in the US everyone calls themselves Christian by default. Redo the stats for only those that are actively involved in their church and it'll be more accurate. That's if the stat is genuine at all - read skWilliams comment.

Bull****, who are you to say who the real Christians are and are not? You can't just pick and choose the "proper ones" and label everyone else as not Christian enough to count.

But anywho, I ended up going with this one:

[spracks21]

Originally Posted by ElJefe13

God let this happen because he had to.
Part of mortal life is that people can make their own choices. This person chose to kill these kids, and he had the free agency to do that. And honestly, those kids are almost the lucky ones. They do not have to suffer through life like the rest of us. The true victims here are not the kids, but their families, but they too can find peace if they turn to God and realize they can see them again.

My $.02 anyway.

Christianity is a sad and depressing religion.

[Drex17]

Originally Posted by ElJefe13

God let this happen because he had to.
Part of mortal life is that people can make their own choices. This person chose to kill these kids, and he had the free agency to do that. And honestly, those kids are almost the lucky ones. They do not have to suffer through life like the rest of us. The true victims here are not the kids, but their families, but they too can find peace if they turn to God and realize they can see them again.

My $.02 anyway.

Seriously?....SERIOUSLY?!

I dunno about your life (which clearly must be miserable) but I love my life even with it's problems and I'd far rather be living it then shot dead when I was six.

[ElJefe13]

Originally Posted by Drex17

Seriously?....SERIOUSLY?!

I dunno about your life (which clearly must be miserable) but I love my life even with it's problems and I'd far rather be living it then shot dead when I was six.

Why? Honestly why?
You have to work and struggle every day just to stay alive. Life is terrible and horrible.

You're going to tell me you're rather not be in heaven right now? Or are you implying those little kids went to hell?

[F1VENOM]

Christian heaven exists?

[spracks21]

Originally Posted by F1VENOM

Christian heaven exists?

Duh, haven't you read the Bible?

[spracks21]

Originally Posted by ElJefe13

Why? Honestly why?
You have to work and struggle every day just to stay alive. Life is terrible and horrible.

You're going to tell me you're rather not be in heaven right now? Or are you implying those little kids went to hell?

Why? Because I have real people and things in my life that I draw meaning and bliss from, and not just an imaginary friend whom I hope to actually meet after I die.

And if the kids had not adequately accepted Christ as their lord and savior to His holy liking, prior to being murdered (Or as you might say, before the best possible thing ever happened to them), then yes they are now burning inescapably in Hell for eternity. That is, if you subscribe to that sort of thing. I myself find it all pretty vile and sad.

[Drex17]

Originally Posted by ElJefe13

Why? Honestly why?
You have to work and struggle every day just to stay alive. Life is terrible and horrible.

You're going to tell me you're rather not be in heaven right now? Or are you implying those little kids went to hell?

I'd rather live my life. Laugh, love, cry, enjoy and embrace the human experience. Even if you could PROVE to me heaven existed and I would go there, I would still want to live my life to the fullest before I die. Joy and happiness are all relative, to a starving child a few crumbs of bread is an amazing thing, to me....it is nothing. Can you actually have joy without suffering to put it into perspective? To be a human is amazing, the range of emotions, the sense of wonder and discovery as we take on the world, I would NEVER want to give that up.

[F1VENOM]

Originally Posted by spracks21

Duh, haven't you read the Bible?

D'oh, I knew I was missing something.

[ElJefe13]

Originally Posted by spracks21

Why? Because I have real people and things in my life that I draw meaning and bliss from, and not just an imaginary friend whom I hope to actually meet after I die.

And if the kids had not adequately accepted Christ as their lord and savior to His holy liking, prior to being murdered (Or as you might say, before the best possible thing ever happened to them), then yes they are now burning inescapably in Hell for eternity. That is, if you subscribe to that sort of thing. I myself find it all pretty vile and sad.

First of all, I've felt God's presence in my life. I'd don't think I'm going to see him when I die. I don't believe it. I know it, more than I know anything else in the world.

Second of all, I don't believe that you have to accept Jesus only in this life. That would be stupid. It would mean that maybe 5% of the people that have come to Earth would be damned. That is absolutely not true. You can repent and believe after you die. And all little children are accepted into the kingdom of god. No exceptions.

[vijil]

Bull****, who are you to say who the real Christians are and are not? You can't just pick and choose the "proper ones" and label everyone else as not Christian enough to count.

Yeah. When somebody calls themselves a scientist that makes them a scientist, even if they never actually do science.

Whatever you say man.

[spracks21]

Originally Posted by ElJefe13

First of all, I've felt God's presence in my life. I'd don't think I'm going to see him when I die. I don't believe it. I know it, more than I know anything else in the world.

Second of all, I don't believe that you have to accept Jesus only in this life. That would be stupid. It would mean that maybe 5% of the people that have come to Earth would be damned. That is absolutely not true. You can repent and believe after you die. And all little children are accepted into the kingdom of god. No exceptions.

Any scripture to back all of this up? I was taught that the only way to the Father, is through the son. On Earth. Otherwise what is the point of this "terrible and horrible" life, as a Christian?

Originally Posted by vijil

Yeah. When somebody calls themselves a scientist that makes them a scientist, even if they never actually do science.

Whatever you say man.

Someone who studies a science, can be said to be a scientist, yes. But typically people are referring professional or career scientists when they are mentioned. But scientist isn't as belief or religious preference, and science is simply a process of inquiry. So apples and oranges here, my man. Also, there was a choice of no religious preference in the study. So if they were not Christian, they could have said that. But the fact is that they all identified as Christian, and who are you to judge the degree of their convictions?

Isn't belief in and love for God enough to be a Christian? Even if these sentiments only arise in times of crisis and confusion. Maybe not a "good" Christian, but if you identify as Christian, pray to the Christian God, accept Christ as your savior, and believe in the Christian afterlife, I'm going to say your religion is Christianity, no?

Let's explore this. How involved in their church exactly must one be to count as a Christian? Who decides this? How many Christians are there really in the world then? Do "fake Christians" who accept Christ as their savior still go to heaven? Can't one have a relationship with God without sitting in a specific building every Sunday?

Christianity is a religion, and even the "default Christians" know the basic tenets of the religion that they are claiming to identify with. They are Christian, and with so many sects of the religion available to choose from, it really must remain an umbrella term for all of Christs followers and believers in the God of Abraham.

The statistics are accurate as they are. Unless I suppose we also account for the atheists who are active participants in the secular community. If someone says they are a Christian, I ask again, who are you to tell them they are not?

[ElJefe13]

Originally Posted by spracks21

Any scripture to back all of this up? I was taught that the only way to the Father, is through the son. On Earth. Otherwise what is the point of this life, as a Christian?

There is scripture backing this up, but I hate bible bashing because no one wins. There's a million ways to interpret any scripture, so you can never convert someone through reasoning and logic, only through the spirit.

And I think I phrased it incorrectly in my post. We live life and convert people now so that they may have joy in this life. But what happens to the people who could never hear of the gospel? Some poor kid who was born in Africa, did good in his life, and died never even hearing of Jesus Christ? Is he damned? I'm saying that I know there's an equal chance for everyone to hear this gospel, whether in this world or the next.

And btw, I suck at explaining my beliefs. If you really want to know more, pick up a copy of the Book of Mormon, read it, and pray about it. You'll know it's true too. Of check out Mormon.org, they're better at this stuff than me.