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Old 10-28-2012, 07:33 PM #1
KINGKILLA21
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Ugh help really needed and appreciated!

Hey guys so I'm not sure if its my gun or tank or what but here's the situation, last weekend I used co2 with my rs and it worked flawless had an awesome day, fast forward to today I got my hpa filled and went to the field, keep in mind I literally JUST bought this tank, I get there and air up the rs with the hpa I can hear a small leak I think? Whatever, it would shoot one ball then the next trigger pull would send out 3 balls then the next one then after that again 3, I'm using a dynasty vlocity on the battery save mode meaning no force, after that it would shoot, then I had to recock it by hand (still had around 3000 psi in tank so not low on air), then the gun started rapid shooting like I was running out of air but I wasn't even close to being empty, so anyways there was broken paint in the barrel, in the loader, it would rapid fire and shoot like 3 balls instead of 1... At the end of the day I cleaned the bolt and that stopped the rapid fire but by that point it was drowning in paint and just done, ALSO I JUST NOTICED THAT BOTH DETENTS ARE GONE SOMEHOW AND THE LEAK I CAN SEE/HEAR IT ON THE FRONT BLOCK PART JUST WHERE THE REG SCREWS IN. Thanks alot people
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Old 10-28-2012, 09:33 PM #2
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Maybe you need to service the reg. Check all the o-rings lube them up and replace the detents. I bet shooting with co2 caused some damage to the o-rings
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Old 10-28-2012, 10:37 PM #3
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lack of detents might cause the balls to drop out. Now kingman puts the yellow ones from the newer pilots. the orings might have froze. try and retighten or put teflon tape on reg threads and screw on tight. they are known to leak a little in that area. but teflon tape seems to work. try to avoid using co2 too much...in the long run they damage the o rings a lot sooner then using HPA.
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Old 10-28-2012, 11:30 PM #4
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Oh okay the leak is right where the reg screws on to the block so I should tighten the block (it's pretty loose) check I rings in the reg and that's it? Also it would rapid fire for like 10 mins for no reason just every time I pulled the trigger? And the Teflon is a great idea we use it at work with air tools, ps is there any specific detents I should use? Thanks guys
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Old 10-29-2012, 08:04 PM #5
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The gun is used to C02, you probably need to readjust your regulator. Some guns (piranhas come to mind) would work fine for years on C02, then all o a sudden thy switch to HPA and start farting as you described. There is some logical explanation that I can't recall but the co2 swells more or something and it just works.

SO, you can replace te orings and readjust your regulator, I think I had to use a larger striker oring to fix it at one point personally, but otherwise the leak I would tighten, but first pull the block and check te orings on the plug, and of it still leaks it could be a valve body oring. You may also need to grease the orings on the block to seal it better
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Old 10-29-2012, 08:34 PM #6
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So how do I re adjust the reg? And I can physically feel the air leaking out from where the reg meets the block but I just tried to take the reg off and it won't unscrew so I'm guessing the unremovablw reg has something to do with the leak so ill update as I fix this problem! Thanks for all the info and such so far
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Old 10-30-2012, 09:25 AM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGKILLA21 View Post
So how do I re adjust the reg? And I can physically feel the air leaking out from where the reg meets the block but I just tried to take the reg off and it won't unscrew so I'm guessing the unremovablw reg has something to do with the leak so ill update as I fix this problem! Thanks for all the info and such so far
That sucks, man. Good luck. Might try some light heat to the regulator to get it to expand slightly.
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Old 10-30-2012, 10:07 PM #8
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Why is there a known problem with the regs unscrewing? Will a strap wrench work?
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http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=3892297

You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

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Old 10-31-2012, 12:58 AM #9
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unscrew the black coated steel line from elbow on reg. now you have freedom to turn the reg 360* to unscrew. hold it tight by the metal piece above the rubber reg body and unscrew. put teflon tape on reg thread and reattach securely....i think the threads are too short and if not completely tighten some air tends to leak out. reattach the steel braided line and see if that helps the leak. BTW i would change out the elbows on the reg and on/off with some swivel macroline fittings and use macroline.
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Old 10-31-2012, 11:14 AM #10
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I have removed the elbow off the reg but it's still not unscrewing I'm thinking of using pliers? And is that the reason it's leaking? Damn kingman lol
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You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

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Old 10-31-2012, 11:54 PM #11
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just an update i finally got the reg off and the oring thats there doesnt seem to have any damage, neither does the actual reg, i put some tape on the reg threads to hopefully help with the leak, also could the leak possibly be from the block being loose? also i should have detents before next saturday (we play every weekend) and im hoping to have the leak fixed by then and it all adjusted and chrono'd!
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http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=3892297

You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

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Old 11-01-2012, 07:17 AM #12
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Almost any part that can be removed has the potential to have a leak. So, yes, it is possible that the front block is leaking somewhere. It appears you have 2 o-rings going into the body and one on the lpc. Check those, too. Even though the o-ring to the reg may look good, as tight as it was, it may have been pinched a little.
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Old 11-02-2012, 01:33 PM #13
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Have you recently taken it apart?

First things first, tighten up the front block. If you have a leak and there are loose parts on the gun then it should be intuitive that you ALWAYS start there. There's two O-rings between the valve and front block that may have been cooked or unseated by the CO2. Check these for damage while you're in there.

On that note, don't use CO2 if you're shooting faster than 5 BPS (or at all if you have a choice). It causes o-rings to swell and contract, sometimes drying them out or destroying them altogether. If tightening the front block doesn't solve the leak then I would wager that the regulator o-ring is a different size from when you started. Even if it looks OK you may as well replace it since they're so cheap.

If still no luck, rebuild the reg and turn it up a little. CO2 runs at a higher pressure than most HPA tanks output so if your reg is adjusted for CO2 then it could easily starve out the marker and keep it from recocking completely and catching the sear (hence the "rapid fire" you were experiencing) when using HPA.

Leaks on electro-pneumatic guns are often caused by messed up regulator pressures or solenoid gaskets. On a Spyder it can really only be one of three things: bad o-ring, assembled incorrectly (I fix Spyders with the valve in backwards all the time) or trashed part. If you still can't get it shooting properly after a while you are welcome to send it to me and I'll fix it for free.

Good luck!
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Old 11-02-2012, 04:16 PM #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Necrogen98 View Post
Have you recently taken it apart?

First things first, tighten up the front block. If you have a leak and there are loose parts on the gun then it should be intuitive that you ALWAYS start there. There's two O-rings between the valve and front block that may have been cooked or unseated by the CO2. Check these for damage while you're in there.

On that note, don't use CO2 if you're shooting faster than 5 BPS (or at all if you have a choice). It causes o-rings to swell and contract, sometimes drying them out or destroying them altogether. If tightening the front block doesn't solve the leak then I would wager that the regulator o-ring is a different size from when you started. Even if it looks OK you may as well replace it since they're so cheap.

If still no luck, rebuild the reg and turn it up a little. CO2 runs at a higher pressure than most HPA tanks output so if your reg is adjusted for CO2 then it could easily starve out the marker and keep it from recocking completely and catching the sear (hence the "rapid fire" you were experiencing) when using HPA.

Leaks on electro-pneumatic guns are often caused by messed up regulator pressures or solenoid gaskets. On a Spyder it can really only be one of three things: bad o-ring, assembled incorrectly (I fix Spyders with the valve in backwards all the time) or trashed part. If you still can't get it shooting properly after a while you are welcome to send it to me and I'll fix it for free.

Good luck!
hey thanks alot thats some pretty good info, what i did was tighten the front block, put tape on the regulator threads and the o ring did look fine i should have replaced it but i dont have spares right now and my local shop was closed today, as for the detents i cut a pen spring in half and used metal bbs, hopefully the spring tention isnt to high causing the bb to not move out of the way and this breaking it... i play tomorrow so i will update again then and let you guys know!

ps the guy i got it from said he used it only with hpa but i dont think he actually ever used it becasuse the first time i took it out the asa leaked from the steel braided hose and all it needed was a tightening and the velocity is a bit low not even sure if its enough to break paint on someone so i turned that up and when you said the co2 will cause the recocking problem (rapid fire) it actually only did the rapid fire when i used hpa so do i need to adjust the reg to a lower psi or something?
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http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=3892297

You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

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Old 11-02-2012, 05:20 PM #15
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I may have been unclear. What I mean to say is that using HPA could result in rapid-fire and not recocking if nothing else on the gun was changed. This is because CO2 tanks output at a much higher pressure (800-1100 psi) than do HPA tanks (450-800 psi).

The output pressure of a regulator is determined by a balance between its input pressure from the tank and the amount of time which it is "open" and allowing air to pass into the marker between shots. The "open" time is what you adjust on the reg to achieve an appropriate FPS. So if your marker is set right now to run on CO2 then the reg will require less "open" time to achieve the same FPS than it would with HPA because the CO2's pressure is higher.

So then, assuming that your reg is indeed tuned to CO2 pressures, less total pressure is entering the gun when using HPA while the reg is open. The result is that the marker will become "starved" for air; pressure may not be high or frequent enough to fully recock the gun, and velocity will be low. These sound like your symptoms. Turning the reg up to a higher PSI should help but you should also get the leak fixed since that will obviously screw with your pressures as well.

Hope this helps
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Old 11-02-2012, 07:36 PM #16
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okay so should there be a specific psi the reg should be at? i havent checked what it is with hps but i will increase it by a bit, other than that thanks alot for all the info, ill update after i play tomorrow
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You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

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Old 11-02-2012, 08:07 PM #17
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The gauge on the side of the gun should read 300 psi. You may need to go slightly higher.
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:18 PM #18
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Alright ill make sure to check that tomorrow, will putting tape on the reg threads help with a leak? I just want to do everything possible to make sure it's working, it wasn't a huge leak you could barely even hear it
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http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=3892297

You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

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Old 11-03-2012, 12:39 AM #19
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In my experience thread tape doesn't usually do much for sealing a leak like that, however if the leak was small it may and it is definitely worth a try.
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Old 11-03-2012, 01:38 AM #20
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oh okay and i took an o ring off an old bolt and put it on the reg so now theres 2 orings, double the seal? lol
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http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=3892297

You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

98% percent of ballers wipe, if your part of the 2% that has some sense of honor add this to your sig
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Old 11-03-2012, 06:07 PM #21
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So I got to the field and tested out my home made detents (bbs and pen spring) I was suprised when it worked, next I aired up the marker and my double O ring fix must have worked because the leak was gone so pretty much it seemed fixed, I played with it all day using co2 (I couldn't get hpa) and the whole thing seemed to work pretty good other than a couple chops which I'm hoping was from the cold wheather and at the end of the day I broke paint and it gummed up the loader eyes and the barrel but I think it was because the tank was running out, but other than that it (hopefully) seems fixed, now I just got to clean the whole gun, adjust the regulator to be at 300 psi and get it chrono graphed then it should be all good even with hpa, I'm just hoping it was the cold wheather that made the chops and not the home made detents!
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Sickest spyder rs around!
http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=3892297

You air up your marker, strap on the mask, and walk onto the field.. it doesn't matter that you failed that test, that your girlfriend broke up with you, or that you got a ticket on the way there... your world is right for the next couple hours,... this is your heaven on earth.. live it.. love it.. play it.. Paintball.

98% percent of ballers wipe, if your part of the 2% that has some sense of honor add this to your sig
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