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Old 03-06-2014, 07:47 PM #1
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Is it time for a 3rd party to reshape American politics?

http://www.thenation.com/blog/178717...-united-states

I love Bernie Sanders, and want desperately for him to become POTUS. Unfortunately though, I am skeptical that this is an achievable dream. I am skeptical, but not without some measure of hope.

The current political climate in this country is very much polarized. More relevant to this though, there are many people fed up with both major parties, and want someone who is willing to truly shake the system. If ever there has been a time when an independent could legitimately take the white house, 2016 may be it.

I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, Hilary seems like a real safe bet to crush whoever the Republican candidate will be in 2016. And I personally think she would do an acceptable job, but not much will change and things will likely not get too much better in reality (I could be wrong, of course). Bernie would be the man as POTUS. But if he runs as a 3rd party, he will steal the progressive votes from the dems, and quite possibly lose the election for Hillary, giving way to one of the far right crazies to become leader of the free world.

So I wanted to see what people on here think. Should he run as an independent/3rd party candidate? Can he win as such, and is the US ready to elect someone outside of the two major parties? Should he run as a dem? Could he win the primary with likely the party heads against him, and a large portion of Americans who wouldn't support him soley because of the D next to his name? Is the chance of him winning strong enough to get past the "Nader" problem, or would his running as an independent/3rd party candidate be the demise of the dem candidate in 2016, leading to victory for the Republicans?

Post up your opinions/thoughts/sentiments on this matter specifically, as well as your thoughts on the possibility of a 3rd party emerging in the near future.
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Old 03-07-2014, 07:59 AM #2
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I'm worried for a populist candidate to become popular and campaign on a remaking of American society.
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Old 03-07-2014, 08:11 AM #3
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Old 03-07-2014, 08:33 AM #4
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Bernie has always been the man. Read up on him and check his record. You'll feel better.
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Old 03-07-2014, 08:40 AM #5
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I refuse to vote for anyone who played for the Detroit Lions.
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Old 03-07-2014, 08:44 AM #6
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I refuse to vote for anyone who played for the Detroit Lions.
I lol'd
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Old 03-07-2014, 09:42 AM #7
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Progressivism is past its pull date. Bernie boy appears, from what I can gather, to be more business as usual along that ideological line of thought. Anyone who speaks of Revolution is well worth keeping their eye on as a dangerous individual.

A successful third party candidate will address the issues of economic decline and climate change in a way that sounds plausible to Americans because he will be saying what party members from the democratic and republican divide refuse to touch, refuse to address in any meaningful sense. What I fear is that this candidate will rely on populism and couple solutions to practical problems by trying to remake American society through discarding our whole system on the charge of corruption.

Societal transformations that posit some utopia, openly or not, never end in anything but disaster.
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Old 03-07-2014, 11:30 AM #8
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He seems to be the only potential candidate willing to take on the money in politics issue. That puts him far and above the rest, imo. Obviously he is very liberal on most issues, bu I don't think he is promising a eutopia. Surely though, things can better than they are now. I don't expect conservatives to love the guy, of course, but I would like to hear the thoughts of people on both sides of the aisle regarding his chances, what people want to see him do, and why.
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Old 03-07-2014, 11:35 AM #9
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There is a degree to which money will always be in the democratic process. People say things can get better, but I'd love to know what they mean by that in a way that isn't vague. Can you cue me in to what this man's vision is?
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Old 03-07-2014, 04:25 PM #10
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Quote:
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There is a degree to which money will always be in the democratic process. People say things can get better, but I'd love to know what they mean by that in a way that isn't vague. Can you cue me in to what this man's vision is?
Over turn citizens united for starters, but more importantly he would push legislation that would otherwise be halted by big money interests. A more progressive tax code, a higher minimum wage, legislation to combat climate change, and big ideas like a transaction tax on wall st just to name a few examples (And try to get past the name in the article, there are other places you can learn about it if you wish, but I just wanted to show that he is in favor of going against the wishes of the wall st elite, and this specific idead would help reduce billionaires from manipulating the markets as much, while raising significant revenue).

I understand you may not agree with a lot of his ideas and policies as a conservative, but find me a better candidate who is less corrupted by big money interests. People always complain about how wall st and big banks are in the pockets of our politicians. Why don't we ever do anything about it? It certainly isn't going to be anyone from the right who does.

This thread isn't to focus on campaigning for or against the guy. I want to know if you think he should run, under what party if he does, and what sort of effect he may have on the primaries and general election.

I would also like to leave this thread open to discussion of any other 3rd party candidates in a similar position if you have any in mind. Are Americans fed up with both major current parties? Are either or both parties on the horizon of doom? Will either of them be replaced any time in the somewhat near future? Or are they here to stay forever, and no outside candidates will ever have a prayer? Is this good/bad? Try to keep the subject in this realm, please.
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Old 03-07-2014, 04:57 PM #11
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Thanks, I googled him this morning but didn't come up with any sort of concrete positions.

From the looks of things I don't believe any of those positions actually fix the core issues the US faces, but if he wants to run, more power to him. If I had knowledge of a preferable candidate I'd offer them up, though I have still to come across one that is outside the current dispensation enough to get behind them and I suppose enough to qualify as a third party.

I hope to God the libertarians never catch foot. While the emphasis on civil liberty is admirable, proven disasters like enforcing the gold standard are too big a part of their platform.

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Old 03-07-2014, 05:04 PM #12
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Quote:
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From the looks of things I don't believe any of those positions actually fix the core issues the US faces, but if he wants to run, more power to him. If I had knowledge of a preferable candidate I'd offer them up, though I have still to come across one that is outside the current dispensation enough to get behind them and I suppose enough to qualify as a third party.
How about this heathen: John Huntsman, Jr.?
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Old 03-08-2014, 08:20 AM #13
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I could tolerate Huntsman if there had to be a conservative president. I think sanders has triple the chance to win regardless of what he runs under, but Huntsman is a reasonable dude, from what I have seen from him at least.
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Old 03-12-2014, 10:52 AM #14
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How about this heathen: John Huntsman, Jr.?
Well he's a hair better than the Rump Pole Revolution.
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Old 03-27-2014, 06:53 PM #15
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He seems to be the only potential candidate willing to take on the money in politics issue.
He still believes that government (people) should be put in positions of incredible authority over people, meaning he has a violent and dangerous ideology. He may personally be against corruption/abuse/money in politics/etc., but all of this only naturally follows an ideology that places fallible people in a state of authority over other people in an attempt to cure human fallibility. Just sayin'
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Old 03-27-2014, 09:57 PM #16
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Old 03-28-2014, 12:38 AM #17
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He still believes that government (people) should be put in positions of incredible authority over people, meaning he has a violent and dangerous ideology. He may personally be against corruption/abuse/money in politics/etc., but all of this only naturally follows an ideology that places fallible people in a state of authority over other people in an attempt to cure human fallibility. Just sayin'
Are you not a conservative anymore?
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Old 03-28-2014, 10:01 AM #18
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He still believes that government (people) should be put in positions of incredible authority over people, meaning he has a violent and dangerous ideology. He may personally be against corruption/abuse/money in politics/etc., but all of this only naturally follows an ideology that places fallible people in a state of authority over other people in an attempt to cure human fallibility. Just sayin'
Ugh. What?
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Old 03-28-2014, 10:24 AM #19
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Are you not a conservative anymore?
I'm a conservative still ideologically, but I see government for what it is, and at the same time acknowledge that conservatism has failed to prevent it from becoming what those that founded it feared it would.
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Old 03-28-2014, 01:54 PM #20
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I love this. And in turn love you for it.
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Old 03-28-2014, 03:57 PM #21
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Kept in line with truncheons
Rifle butts and truncheons
This is state control, this is state control
State control, state control, this is state control
Beaten up behind closed doors
Cracked and bruised ribs, bloody mouth
Cracked and bruised skull, bloody mouth
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