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Old 08-28-2012, 06:24 PM #43
Deimus85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EPluribusUnum View Post
It's great that they made a presence to the vendors, but in reality it's the teams that pay entry and play at the events that bring in money. Rarely do people complain about the vendors at an event...
Vendors pay a lot of money to be there. If there were no vendors there, I would say that the event would not feel like a National event, and thus, why would players want to be there?

3500 fills at a National event is inexcusable. If there was an issue with the compressor, then games should be delayed until that issue was ironed out.
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Old 08-28-2012, 06:26 PM #44
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I liked field 2's chrono ref, he was pretty funny.

That's about it.
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Old 08-28-2012, 06:29 PM #45
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Last year I was getting 5k fills at pevs. This year one game I was lucky to get 3200. Not sure what changed. Even after the "lunch break" where the compressors could have caught back up with nobody filling, it was still 3200.
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Old 08-28-2012, 07:08 PM #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nick |nike| View Post
I liked field 2's chrono ref, he was pretty funny.

That's about it.
this.
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Old 08-28-2012, 08:13 PM #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EPluribusUnum View Post
The reffing was bad, but it didn't even compare to how bad the event as a whole ran. 3000psi fills in the pits, 5 hour breaks for some teams, constant schedule changes on fields and times played, field 3 altogether was a giant joke, and overall one kid on my team played 4 games without a virtue chip in his gun!

NPPL your league is clearly dying. Chuck and Pev I have an idea for you, how about you walk around the pits and talk to your customers face to face shaking their hands, asking them how they feel about the event, and how you guys can make improvements. I payed 1900$ to play d3 in 2009. Today I am spending 2600$ at an event that is blatantly going down hill every single event. Every season there is talk about boycotts of paint companies and pro players and all other kinds of paintball manufacturers, but you seem to do nothing about it. Instead of worrying about beer sponsors, band jams and bikini contests how about you fix the god damn problems with PAINTBALL! My god how is it there is not one person who knows how to run a legitimate business in the NPPL?
[Begin RANT]
I agree with this whole statement.
What I wanted to ad is the staging area.
There were people cleaning up all right and I might add doing a great job.
The problem was there was not enough staging area! When I pay $2600 for entrance I expect to be treated a lot better than that! Friday my teams games started at 2:00pm right in the middle of the heat! There was NO tables or tent space for us to stage under, what a crock! Having to put our gear and paint on the ground! 2 of my guys got heat stroke and it was not because they did not drink enough liquids because they sure did. Chicago was even worse! There was even less space for staging.
Mr. Poorman seems to think he can help this league and wants us to keep playing it. At the rate the NPPL is going now, they are lucky if there is going to be a league next year. I know things don't change over night, but at least fix the things that go wrong from event to event.
The NPPL really has to stop pampering the pro players and start making the event enjoyable for the divisional teams. Remember that is who pays the bills not the pro's!
Don't get me started on the schedule, because that was a crock as well. NPPL kept changing it but did not have any for us to view at the field? Usually we got the field real early and printed it off before we left the hotel, when we got to the field the refs would say it was changed? Why not just leave it the way the person produced it in the first place? You don't think that they might use a program to generate it.
[End Rant]

Anyone have a problem with what I have said just PM me, I don't care!
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Old 08-28-2012, 08:50 PM #48
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I found found out early and clearly that the gauges on field 2 refill stations were inconsistent and out of calibration.
But I consistently received 4500psi or more refills throughout the entire event, from Friday AM prelims thru losing in the finals Mid-Late afternoon on Sunday.
I know my setup and its efficiency limitations, I shot my entire pack on multiple occasions throughout the weekend. To do that I'm required at least 4100psi hot fill. I never had a efficiency issue, in fact during one game I shoot everything I had, and was still able to shoot half of a discarded pod left by the dead opponent snake player.

They did have a whip on one station that blew out orings, but if players paid more attention to fully seat the connector before activating the on/off lever, those problems are less frequent.

Officiating IMHO, which only reflects my personal experiences not other teams..
First, I thought they were fair and even handed, never felt they were looking to influence the outcome of any teams performance. Do I think they made some bad calls? Hell yes, one of my players was pulled for a pack hit, the ref mistaken a broken ball inside the pod as a hit. Lol! We are all human and as players make more ,mistakes tactically during games than refs make bad calls. Focus on your game, finding ways to elevate your play creates wins, not perfect or bad officiating...
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Old 08-28-2012, 09:35 PM #49
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lol....all i want to knowis why he keep saying that is not his job...
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Old 08-28-2012, 10:48 PM #50
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lol....all i want to knowis why he keep saying that is not his job...
You dont know? That is the NPPL motto right before "thanks for your money"
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Old 08-29-2012, 12:46 AM #51
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[quote=Amac;76582416]I played PSP MAO and can say the reffing on the fields we played on was total **** & was so far below the level that it was at when I used to ref PSP. I cheated more times in the two days at that event than I have done in a whole season of playing CXBL & Millennium combined.

If you had to cheat that much it should tell you something as a player...

To make my post on topic, I seen alot of funny business on field 2. Several one ref calls player clean while other throws a penalty for playing on. Seen penalties called for invisible hits. Seen lots of mind changing. One second they're out the next they're clean. A couple of I shot him first that made me chuckle since it clearly wasn't the case ending with the legit team getting a penalty. Too me it almost seemed like whoever called the "I shot him first" or the " ref he's hit" card was the one that they listened to. So many times someone would be like he's hit blah blah blah and the ref would pull him without checking.
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Old 08-29-2012, 04:04 AM #52
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First up, Ed's title in his role with the NPPL is "Team & Sponsor Liasion", so that is why he was out in the pits getting feedback.

Any reffing issues need to be taken up with Tony, so I am directing my offer of assistance towards him.

Props to Ed for taking the time to check this thread and reply.

In relation to the other issues that have been brought up, and apologies if I am covering old ground, but there are many elements to a successful major league tournament. I use the term "major league" since at this level, expectations are that much higher.

In no particular order, they are:-

i. Location (in terms of proximity to an airport, hotels, food;
ii. Enough teams in attendance to make running it worthwhile;
iii. Prize money;
iv. Enough refs, who ref consistently, in accordance with the rules;
v. Consistent air fills with no queues;
vi. Covered secure staging areas for the teams;
vii. A schedule that doesn't change, apart to reflect no-shows;
viii. Good weather;
ix. Good event paint;
x. Good playing surface, with adequate netting.

As you can see, it's a long and expensive list. And don't even get me started on the weather, because as a Brit I'm obsessed with it.

My areas of specialism are reffing and organisation, so I can certainly assist the NPPL with those if they want me to.

That said, everyone is not going to be 100% happy with any paintball event, as there will always be a call or an incident that didn't go a certain way.

But let's not forget, the NPPL gave us HB 2003. They set the bar.

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Old 08-29-2012, 05:41 AM #53
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our team never had an issue with air fills any of the days.... sometimes it filled a little slow, but was always over 4K everytime.
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Old 08-29-2012, 10:38 AM #54
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You dont know? That is the NPPL motto right before "thanks for your money"
know i understand,thanks for setting me straight...
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Old 08-29-2012, 04:21 PM #55
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[quote=eatp8nt;76600049]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amac View Post
I played PSP MAO and can say the reffing on the fields we played on was total **** & was so far below the level that it was at when I used to ref PSP. I cheated more times in the two days at that event than I have done in a whole season of playing CXBL & Millennium combined.

If you had to cheat that much it should tell you something as a player...
The point of me saying this was to stop people comparing the reffing at PSP as something that is 100% perfect. The level of reffing there has dropped majorly as well but at least the logistics and scheduling has improved.

I will point out that it was a total of three times of playing on at MAO not 30 I just was comparing it to how strict reffing has been in other national leagues I have played in to the current level of both NPPL & PSP.
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:31 PM #56
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Originally Posted by ....VoLtAgE.... View Post

THATS ME IN THE 50 SNAKE POSTED DOWN TAPE

quesion pbnation did i spin? so why would the REF wipe his hit? I shot him first he was clueless if anything he played on

P.S This was in the finals for 1st and 2nd. way to blow it
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Old 08-29-2012, 09:20 PM #57
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Hey Guys, i thought about my response overnight and all day today, I want to apologize if i offended anyone. My title is Team and Player Liason. I will do my best to represent you and bring all your issues up with the right people who can do something about it. So I will continue to check all the threads and posts on the NPPL and do my best to help you get your suggestions, complaints and ideas to the appropriate people. Thanks.
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:49 AM #58
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I thought the DC event was awesome! The turf on those fields were in immaculate condition (aside from being a bit slippery). Little things like getting 3000 psi shouldn't matter that much.... Its not like 1 team gets 4500psi and the other 3000psi.... Everyone has to deal with that adversity... just like any other sport. As much as people like the PSP way more then the nppl league, i think that the 7man format is all around way better then the 5man psp format. Things like no coaching and being able to make the undetected snake highway bunker dive is what makes paintball what it is... As long as the NPPL finds a way to deal with their webcast and gain the people back on their side, they will be just fine
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Old 08-30-2012, 01:16 AM #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CK813 View Post
THATS ME IN THE 50 SNAKE POSTED DOWN TAPE

quesion pbnation did i spin? so why would the REF wipe his hit? I shot him first he was clueless if anything he played on

P.S This was in the finals for 1st and 2nd. way to blow it
IMO, the 2 players traded. The player who dove in the snake got hit in the leg and you can clearly see him wiping the hits on the ground. The ref that signaled him out should have made sure he got out, not just point an out signal and let his fellow ref check him. If he saw them trade them get them both out. The ref that "checked" him didnt see any of the hits because the player wiped them off while sliding.
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Old 08-30-2012, 06:25 PM #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan UK Refs View Post
i. Location (in terms of proximity to an airport, hotels, food;
ii. Enough teams in attendance to make running it worthwhile;
iii. Prize money;
iv. Enough refs, who ref consistently, in accordance with the rules;
v. Consistent air fills with no queues;
vi. Covered secure staging areas for the teams;
vii. A schedule that doesn't change, apart to reflect no-shows;
viii. Good weather;
ix. Good event paint;
x. Good playing surface, with adequate netting.
Ok, ive kinda stayed out of this but i figure i would throw my 2 cents in as politely as possible. PEVS is my home field and i can honestly say its one of the best fields i have ever played at, BUT ill give you my opinion on this list as pertaining to the PUMP division on field 3.

i. Location:
Great, and 20 mins from my house

ii. Enough teams in attendance to make running it worthwhile;
3 teams in the pump division,

iii. Prize money;
Not really worth mentioning

iv. Enough refs, who ref consistently, in accordance with the rules;
If you guys thought that the reffing on field 2 was poor, just be glad you werent on field 3.

v. Consistent air fills with no queues;
didnt really have an issue other than the gauge seemed way off on the airstation behind field 2

vi. Covered secure staging areas for the teams;
OK, with what space was available

vii. A schedule that doesn't change, apart to reflect no-shows;
HA, they scheduled West coast sharks to play pump and D4 7 man at the same time thinking that it would be ok since the fields are close. BUT that wasnt ok and we had to wait 4 hours to start games friday, then sat they couldnt give us an accurate schedule, and they also never mentioned that there wouldnt be finals for the pump division, we found out on our 2nd to last game.

viii. Good weather;
It rained

ix. Good event paint;
The redemption i get from some local fields is way better than the crap we had to shoot. Im sure it shot fine for most of you but your not playing pump. It matters

x. Good playing surface, with adequate netting.
This was the biggest issue for me. After playing PSP for the past few months and practicing on pevs turf, i was really looking forward to playing on that killer turf. Well we ended up on the grass practice field( which is ONLY ever used once a year as the Nppl practice field) Not only was it impossible to slide on, the mulch and excess paint behind the bunkers made it sloppy to play in. Then there is the netting aspect, it was only netted about 1/3 of the way. Spectators were not allowed, and we were told that spectaors could get free pit passes.( seems real secure) And when one of my teammates tried to get his GF in he had to pay 10 bucks for a wristband for her.( still not very secure as anyone could pay 10 dollars and have access to lots of gear)




Overall it was a very poor expirence for us as a team. We played well and won most of our games, the games we lost we legitimently lost. But when other leagues put forth more effort into the divisional leagues and less effort into "attractions" it shows, and my money will follow.
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Old 08-30-2012, 06:32 PM #61
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I don't really remember seeing a flag all morning friday on field 2 until I think some guy threw his gun and starting yelling from the dead box? Lots of obvious no calls. A couple of missed hits that I clearly saw through the net on the sidelines. But it is hard to be perfect, and I'd prefer no calls to unwarranted penalties.

What bothered me more was how inconsistent it got at times. Seemed like some refs weren't on the same page or didn't read the same rulebook. Like others have said, one ref signaling an elimination and another calling a player clean at the same time.

And after all the no calls early in the weekend, we caught a really questionable penalty in the quarters. To me it's like officiating any other sport, if you are going to be more strict or more lenient, that's fine. But don't change it up in the middle of the game.

And to the people who are upset at the players for cheating, I understand where you are coming from. But this is competition, players are out there trying to win. Sportsmanship is important, but everyone is going to try to walk the fine line, and it's the official's job to enforce where that line is. Be it 300 vs 301 fps, or spinning on an opponent, or what counts as an "obvious" hit. No different from any other sport. Not like an NFL corner is going to hand an intercepted ball to the reciever because he interfered with the pass, he's going to run it the other way unless the ref throws a flag.

It is what it is though. Every team is going to go back home, practice and try to improve for the next event. The refs and the NPPL management need to do the same. Ed seems passionate about the league and willing to listen to players concerns, I hope the rest of the people running the show spend some time to address the issues as well.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:18 PM #62
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Originally Posted by WayOutThere View Post
[Begin RANT]
I agree with this whole statement.
What I wanted to ad is the staging area.
There were people cleaning up all right and I might add doing a great job.
The problem was there was not enough staging area! When I pay $2600 for entrance I expect to be treated a lot better than that! Friday my teams games started at 2:00pm right in the middle of the heat! There was NO tables or tent space for us to stage under, what a crock! Having to put our gear and paint on the ground! 2 of my guys got heat stroke and it was not because they did not drink enough liquids because they sure did. Chicago was even worse! There was even less space for staging.
Mr. Poorman seems to think he can help this league and wants us to keep playing it. At the rate the NPPL is going now, they are lucky if there is going to be a league next year. I know things don't change over night, but at least fix the things that go wrong from event to event.
The NPPL really has to stop pampering the pro players and start making the event enjoyable for the divisional teams. Remember that is who pays the bills not the pro's!
Don't get me started on the schedule, because that was a crock as well. NPPL kept changing it but did not have any for us to view at the field? Usually we got the field real early and printed it off before we left the hotel, when we got to the field the refs would say it was changed? Why not just leave it the way the person produced it in the first place? You don't think that they might use a program to generate it.
[End Rant]

Anyone have a problem with what I have said just PM me, I don't care!
lol no problem here with that outlook.
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Old 08-31-2012, 03:21 PM #63
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from someone who has been playing nothing more than rec ball for 6 years and just decided to dedicate my self to tourney paintball here is something that i see of the post on here most seem to be understandable complaints but twice do you have people admitting to cheating first the guy who said he had a whole team of D3 guys competing in D4 and the guy who said at the MAO he has never cheated as much in his life now as someone who can speak from a standpoint of picking a national league to join and deciding it is worth my money the first thing that comes to my mind is I don't know of a signal sport where a player can post game admit on a national level that he cheated his way through an event or game and not suffer some form of sanctions at future events so if are goal is to have better refs and better enforcement of the rules lets start with the people who not only out there cheating but than bad mouthing the sport that they are cheating in to make it look bad on top of that the best way to clean up a game is to self police first than work from there
very very valid point. So if the smeared goggles fit.....Wear it. lol
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