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Old 11-25-2012, 12:04 AM #715
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Also breech delay came back as 15 from the factory. I just changed to 6?
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Old 11-25-2012, 01:59 AM #716
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I dropped the dwell down to 6ms two different times and shot 150 balls through each time. I believe chris at pooty has shot his at 6ms before as well.

How would I go about rebuilding my reg? All it consists of is the piston with one oring and he spring correct?

I have tried about 10 different paint a with this to non avail. I have shot at least 5 cases alone trying to tech this before I sent this to machine to be fixed. Honostly your my only hope

If your busting paint with a low dwell then that is a no no. Always bring it back to stock and see if the paint busten gets better. 6 dwell is very low. The video i have on youtube has a vapor set at a dwell of 6. But no air is coming out of the bolt. Its just being cycled enough to show the balls effects by the bolt with no blow back as a cause. If you are running a dwell of 6 then your probably running a higher then normal reg pressure to get to 285. Thus your bolt pressure is very high. Maybe in the operating pressure of 200psi... I would expect ball chopping. I think the vapor runs around 170-180 stock (just from my finger pressure tests compared to luxe pressure testes)



Reset your board to the factory settings. Then turn off your reg pressure and adjust it up from zero over the chrono. When I bust paint I reset, adjust to stock any other adjustments or screws then work from that point to figure out what is the cause.
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Last edited by Pooty51 : 11-25-2012 at 02:44 AM.
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Old 11-25-2012, 08:24 AM #717
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remember, BREECH DELAY is NOT THE SAME as BOLT RETURN.

Breech delay should be 6ms, Bolt return should be 26-32


And yea, it sounds like your pressure is cranked WAY too high. Follow Pooty's advice and if you can't get it figured out, pm me.
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Old 11-25-2012, 11:13 AM #718
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pooty51 View Post
If your busting paint with a low dwell then that is a no no. Always bring it back to stock and see if the paint busten gets better. 6 dwell is very low. The video i have on youtube has a vapor set at a dwell of 6. But no air is coming out of the bolt. Its just being cycled enough to show the balls effects by the bolt with no blow back as a cause. If you are running a dwell of 6 then your probably running a higher then normal reg pressure to get to 285. Thus your bolt pressure is very high. Maybe in the operating pressure of 200psi... I would expect ball chopping. I think the vapor runs around 170-180 stock (just from my finger pressure tests compared to luxe pressure testes)



Reset your board to the factory settings. Then turn off your reg pressure and adjust it up from zero over the chrono. When I bust paint I reset, adjust to stock any other adjustments or screws then work from that point to figure out what is the cause.
I have never run my vapor at 6ms. I dropped it down to try it and see if it would help. I have reset everything to stock and then dropped reg pressure all the way down and turned up to shooting 285. Current setting are 12dwell, 28 bolt return, 6 breech delay, Fsdo settings stock at 2. I have tried every configuration possible after readying all these threads and talking with ken. It seems that pro mods idea of the solenoid safety dumping is by far he closest to what's going on. Pro mod ill pm you.
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Old 11-25-2012, 05:45 PM #719
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I have never run my vapor at 6ms. I dropped it down to try it and see if it would help. I have reset everything to stock and then dropped reg pressure all the way down and turned up to shooting 285. Current setting are 12dwell, 28 bolt return, 6 breech delay, Fsdo settings stock at 2. I have tried every configuration possible after readying all these threads and talking with ken. It seems that pro mods idea of the solenoid safety dumping is by far he closest to what's going on. Pro mod ill pm you.
Cool, got your message and replied via PM and email. let's get to the bottom of this!
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Old 11-25-2012, 06:26 PM #720
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Got my new vapor today, a smokin deal, and much smoother than my old luxe!
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:24 PM #721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yourPBfriend View Post
I have never run my vapor at 6ms. I dropped it down to try it and see if it would help. I have reset everything to stock and then dropped reg pressure all the way down and turned up to shooting 285. Current setting are 12dwell, 28 bolt return, 6 breech delay, Fsdo settings stock at 2. I have tried every configuration possible after readying all these threads and talking with ken. It seems that pro mods idea of the solenoid safety dumping is by far he closest to what's going on. Pro mod ill pm you.
share your results....I think I'm having the same issue
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:29 PM #722
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share your results....I think I'm having the same issue
From the email convo, I think it was that the transfer port inside his tophat was leaking slightly (wasn't turned in 1/4 turn) and the slight leak was causing the hpr to slowly leak air....which lead to a super-hot shot every so often. I'll let him post the final result, as I don't have the marker in front on me.
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Old 11-25-2012, 11:09 PM #723
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Yeah the fix works but too bad Machine doesn't sell individual eye covers. Even if they were just black it would help with those who lost their eye covers
Hi. Thanks but i alread had done that to the eye covers after the 1st time it cam off. It was always on the right side of the gun the one on the left never came out. Just to elaborate o what you daid. The are alot of people who have lost eye covers. Becuase in a reply from Machine themselves they say that i am the only person that they know of that has an eye cover problem.
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Old 11-26-2012, 12:52 AM #724
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Hi. Thanks but i alread had done that to the eye covers after the 1st time it cam off. It was always on the right side of the gun the one on the left never came out...
If you did my mod properly and your eye cover latches aren't horribly mangled (and the magnets haven't been flipped), it's genuinely impossible for them to come out on their own.....If you caught your wrist on the latch or rubbed the latch while switching hands, then that's more of an end-user problem, as that can happen with any QD eye cover system. Make sure there's no debris under your eye covers and that the latches are intact.

Quote:
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...Just to elaborate o what you daid. The are alot of people who have lost eye covers. Becuase in a reply from Machine themselves they say that i am the only person that they know of that has an eye cover problem.
I don't mean to doubt you, however I highly doubt that machine said that you're the only one with eye cover problems. It would be more likely that they mean that you were the only repeat offender, so to speak.... I know one or two people who have purchased color-kits to replace lost eye covers, however I also know that they haven't lost their new covers.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:21 AM #725
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If you did my mod properly and your eye cover latches aren't horribly mangled (and the magnets haven't been flipped), it's genuinely impossible for them to come out on their own.....If you caught your wrist on the latch or rubbed the latch while switching hands, then that's more of an end-user problem, as that can happen with any QD eye cover system. Make sure there's no debris under your eye covers and that the latches are intact.



I don't mean to doubt you, however I highly doubt that machine said that you're the only one with eye cover problems. It would be more likely that they mean that you were the only repeat offender, so to speak.... I know one or two people who have purchased color-kits to replace lost eye covers, however I also know that they haven't lost their new covers.
Promod you may be right and i didnt do it properly. But im pretty sure i did. Before i did the change its was only the right side cover that ever came off. After i did the mod it was still the right side one that came off. With regards to my correspondance with Machine. i only emailed them with the issue once. After i actually lost the cover. Every time before i usually found the cover and just put it back without bothering.
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Old 11-27-2012, 06:46 AM #726
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is there a specific pressure tester that i can buy for the vapor? or have they mot mase one for it yet. i didnt no if the reg threads were universal or matched other guns reg threads.

also, dose anyone know ov any after market grips for this thing yet?
and if anyone knows what the new release date for the hopper is gona be.
im wondering if it was so close to production at cup, how much more are they going to change on it and for how much longer?
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Old 11-27-2012, 10:56 AM #727
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is there a specific pressure tester that i can buy for the vapor? or have they mot mase one for it yet. i didnt no if the reg threads were universal or matched other guns reg threads.

also, dose anyone know ov any after market grips for this thing yet?
and if anyone knows what the new release date for the hopper is gona be.
im wondering if it was so close to production at cup, how much more are they going to change on it and for how much longer?
There's no LPR so you shouldn't need a pressure tester. Zero out the reg and start to bring the pressure up until the marker seals up and cycles properly (loq-chrono is fine to start). Then skim through my tuning guide.

As for aftermarket grips, I've contacted several people to see if they'd be willing to take on the project. Once I get a response, I'll post their contact info so you guys can get new grips.

For the hopper; It was intended to be released at cup, however, it was delayed so the design could be refined and perfected a little more. Bryon Benini (former DYE VP, worked on the Rotor's design) is now a part of Machine so I presume he had a few changes to the design that were considered. (source: http://thefordreport.com/2012/10/leg...ine-paintball/ )
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:32 AM #728
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You know, I've always wanted new grips for the vapor. But lately I have changed the way I hold my marker. Last night I was playing with the gun in my couch(haha) and realized this grips were perfect. Made to fit exactly right if I hold it right and use the underside of my knockles to hit the trigger. Just s Rand but something I enjoyed about the vapor.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:34 AM #729
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yea I was gonna say the same thing not sure why you'd really need a pressure tester.

Reset the board.
check orings
fresh grease
reset the reg.

win
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:07 PM #730
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just for compairisons of different barrel and bolt combinations for the best operating pressure. This is my first high end marker and iv noticed alot of high ends having a pressure tester. i just didnt no if it was an option or not.
and what is your preferd paint to shoot with this thing? i bough a bag of redemption pro to see if it likes this better. ill come back with a review of it with this picky vapor.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:01 PM #731
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holy crap, i didnt have one brake with redemption pro! but quality still goes to graffiti. for the price its unbeatable unless yall have any other suggestions to paint you like to shoot with your vap.
i shot evil with 1 out of every 8 balls braking (may have been a bad batch)
fyre broke 1 out of every 20
valken feild grade broke 1 out of every 100 or so
graffiti didnt brake
redemption pro didnt brake.

but acuraccy had to tie bewteen graffiti and redemption pro. i dont see any reason to waste money on the redemption pro

and i had paint get under the grips and onto the board one day. so is there something you can do to help fix that? like maybe a hot glue line around the edges or something. i want to hear your options before i try any of my own.

Last edited by wmaxham : 11-27-2012 at 11:03 PM.
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Old 11-27-2012, 11:31 PM #732
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holy [carp], i didnt have one brake with redemption pro! but quality still goes to graffiti. for the price its unbeatable unless yall have any other suggestions to paint you like to shoot with your vap.
i shot evil with 1 out of every 8 balls braking (may have been a bad batch)
fyre broke 1 out of every 20
valken feild grade broke 1 out of every 100 or so
graffiti didnt brake
redemption pro didnt brake.

but acuraccy had to tie bewteen graffiti and redemption pro. i dont see any reason to waste money on the redemption pro

and i had paint get under the grips and onto the board one day. so is there something you can do to help fix that? like maybe a hot glue line around the edges or something. i want to hear your options before i try any of my own.

Yea, I think it might have been a bad batch of evil. I've talked with several other people and they're all having consistency/random break issues with the last batch of Orange Ultra-Evil. (orange shell, orange fill). Just threw out 4 cases of the stuff


But yea, Redemption Pro is looking like it's going to be my new go-to paint for events.


As for paint under the grips, I've had a handful of vapors come in with overtightened grips (overtightening grips = warped grips). I personally just clean off the board and I don't worry about paint getting on it....they gel-coat the boards to make it waterproof for a reason! Just make sure your wipe most of it off so it doesn't eat through the coating and corrode the terminals. I'm talking with a few grip manufactures right now to see if any of them would be interesting in making a batch of grips for the Vendetta. We'll see.....
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:18 AM #733
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that would be awsome! and what do you think about graffiti compaired with redemption pro?
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Old 11-28-2012, 02:27 AM #734
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that would be awsome! and what do you think about graffiti compaired with redemption pro?
I like the consistant shell of the RP a whole lot more than graffiti, but at the field we just shoot whitebox for practice. RP is really more of a tourney paint, and I love it because it's brittle, without having to be babied. I can slam a pod of it into my loader, dive on my loader, and fire it without having broken sludge in my loader and marker.


...going off your last comment about accuracy, it's really more of a consistency thing: imo, accuracy has little to do with what barrel you use; it's more about the quality of your paint, and consistant regulators/solenoids.

For instance....

~acceleration due to gravity: 9.8 m/s/s (not changing any time soon)

A marker that fires at +- 1fps will theoretically have a smaller vertical spread of paint (because all of the paint is in the air for about the same time, they drop at the same rate, which means they will fall about the same distance from the initial line of fire). Inversely, a marker firing +-20fps will have a large vertical spread because some paintballs are in the air for longer than others, which means they fall farther from the centerline...IE some shots hit high (faster) and some hit low (slower).

Now, quality of paint imo, determines how large of a horizontal/angular spread there is. I believe it's fair to say that lower quality paints (ovlong shapes, weird seams, etc.) tend to hook a lot more while in flight, than per-say, near-perfectly round tourney paint, or fresh first-strike rounds.


For a final line: If your marker is consistant, you should be able to rule the field. an accurate marker will, once in a while, hit dead center. While a consistant marker will ALWAYS hit high left (or somewhere predictable). If you know your marker is going to hit high left, aim low-right, and you now have an accurace, AND precise weapon.

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Last edited by ProMod : 11-28-2012 at 02:30 AM.
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Old 11-28-2012, 01:56 PM #735
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