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Old 05-08-2012, 01:06 AM #64
lilrahbe83
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im surprised no one has brought up the fact that games started what, an hour or more late..

as for the skunk, they threw a bat at it. then shot an entire hopper at it. putting it thru hell. thats WRONG.

and come on, people drove from wisconsin, illinois, and im sure from other surrounding states to play. finals ending at 630. people have driving to do. and jobs to attend the next day

for the money/time/effort i put into this. i wasnt satisfied. bunkers half deflated in finals?? i saw one penalty called all day.

this one goes for the actual field itself. the netting was what a whole 15ft tall? i was parked in the grass behind field 2, and nearly got hit a few times from balls coming over. i felt that was my biggest issue.
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Old 05-08-2012, 01:20 AM #65
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getting hit by paintballs because they are coming over the nets happens at just about any event, I cant tell you how many times ive been to PSP events like World Cup and the Chicago Open and gotten hit by a random ball of ultra evil lol, Just part of the sport
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Old 05-08-2012, 01:59 AM #66
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-Was not happy with reffing on field one. Honestly think they cost us a chance at winning our first game. As it turns out we didn't even get to play half of it.
-The skunk issue, not getting into. I will say this ... My team and I saw that skunk not 10 feet from the field 1 far end dead box. We chased it out into the field with a shot or two behind it to keep it moving farther into the tall grass. Apparently it wanted to hang around and check things out.
-As far as the nets go, we had several balls off of field 2 hit the tables in our pits. We noticed each time it happened there was a player in the corner dorrito and we were prolly getting bounces. This was actually brought up at a PSP clinic I just went thru, they say it does happen quite often.
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:17 AM #67
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-the day could have started a little more promptly.
-bracket sheets should be given out w/ schedules when teams sign in.
-clubbing a skunk and then shooting a full hopper at it from 10ft isn't cool in my book!
-field2 was ran professionally. field1...not so much.
-BB you do a hell of a job being a 1 man army! Good Work!
-liked the race2 format, though it kind of drained me waiting so long in between matches.
-enjoyed have 2 FULL length fields compared to event #1!
-clubbing a skunk and then shooting a full hopper at it from 10ft isn't cool in my book!

see you at event #3
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:18 AM #68
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Best part about the whole event was the girl in the pink bikini top running around getting pods idk what team she was with but for that we thank you made the long wait for the d3 to start somewhat better
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Old 05-08-2012, 02:43 AM #69
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Whew there are quite a few weenies in this thread who are clearly making sweeping generalizations as well as sweeping accusations about every possible issue I could think of. This is a feedback thread which purpose serves to help the league better prepare for their future events. Dragging on and on in a thread and continuing to bring up issues which have already been noted is completely unnecessary and does not help anyone what so ever......it has the complete opposite effect on everyone. Everyone is entitled to share their feedback respectfully, but continuing to ***** and complain about every little detail without contributing any positive input is simply trolling, you are making yourself as well as the people you are representing out to be complete *******s.

Furthermore for having a large turnout (25+ teams combined) you can not realistically expect to not have short turnaround between matches in prelims simply because of the raw number of teams which all need to play. There is a reason why a lot of regional and national tournaments span multiple days.
When you have a number of teams on the order of 25+, having multiple rounds of finals (which is most fair) takes quite a bit of time. You face the hard decision of cramming the entire event into one long *** day, or expanding the event to a 2 day event - which will make it much more difficult for traveling teams to attend and more importantly afford. I thought the event ran about as smoothly as it possibly could have considering the number of teams present.

Reffing on the eclipse field was excellent, I cannot imagine having to ref such a long day out in the heat, even with multiple breaks, big thanks to all the refs.

Overall a great event considering the cost of entry and prize money paid out for a good grind in the heat. Great competition and good reffing.
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:15 AM #70
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Best part about the whole event was the girl in the pink bikini top running around getting pods idk what team she was with but for that we thank you made the long wait for the d3 to start somewhat better
Team: Doom On You does what it can to help provide entertainment between points. She is also a good player. Part of our newest all girls team - Doom Divas..
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Old 05-08-2012, 08:18 AM #71
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Whew there are quite a few weenies in this thread who are clearly making sweeping generalizations as well as sweeping accusations about every possible issue I could think of. This is a feedback thread which purpose serves to help the league better prepare for their future events. Dragging on and on in a thread and continuing to bring up issues which have already been noted is completely unnecessary and does not help anyone what so ever......it has the complete opposite effect on everyone. Everyone is entitled to share their feedback respectfully, but continuing to ***** and complain about every little detail without contributing any positive input is simply trolling, you are making yourself as well as the people you are representing out to be complete *******s.

Furthermore for having a large turnout (25+ teams combined) you can not realistically expect to not have short turnaround between matches in prelims simply because of the raw number of teams which all need to play. There is a reason why a lot of regional and national tournaments span multiple days.
When you have a number of teams on the order of 25+, having multiple rounds of finals (which is most fair) takes quite a bit of time. You face the hard decision of cramming the entire event into one long *** day, or expanding the event to a 2 day event - which will make it much more difficult for traveling teams to attend and more importantly afford. I thought the event ran about as smoothly as it possibly could have considering the number of teams present.

Reffing on the eclipse field was excellent, I cannot imagine having to ref such a long day out in the heat, even with multiple breaks, big thanks to all the refs.

Overall a great event considering the cost of entry and prize money paid out for a good grind in the heat. Great competition and good reffing.
this is why the skunk issue is dead.
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Old 05-08-2012, 08:43 AM #72
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im well aware of the sport of paintball. and paint bouncing off bunkers happens. i just thought the nets could have been higher.

if theres that many teams playing. get another field going?
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Old 05-08-2012, 08:58 AM #73
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My two cents towards the league:

Make sure everything is provided on the field that reffs need and works before games start.

Make sure games start on time, even if this means the reffs get there earlier for reff meeting to be earlier.

Have water available for all reffs close to the fields starting from the get go.

Utilize any time available on both fields to assure the quickest turn around times possible. Do not shutdown one field for any reason, especially if its the "nicer" bunker field.

Its a players sport run by the players, if you dont have the players wanting to play you cant hold events.

As a ref from field 1 this is what I have to say:

I am the ref that restaked the bunker for the player when i noticed it falling over on him so I will not apologize for any poor reffing that happened on field 1 because I feel I did my personal best to treat the players how I would have liked to be treated.

I agree the ref smoking is completely wrong, had I known he was doing it during the games I would have stopped it as well.

As for field 1 not being professional, I feel the reffing group did the best job they could have with what we were given, i mean we were using our personal phones for start and stop timers and did not get squeegees until an hour or so into the day. As for the bunkers being junk, i agree as well but until you play at national events you wont always get to play on the best new fields.

With not only the players but the refs as well only having two minutes between points, that doesnt leave much time for the refs to write up the score sheet, air every bunker that is deflating at the same time, wipe down the bunkers, rehang the flag and get back into position before the point starts.

One thing that upset me as a ref was that there was a lot of the tournament still left and the "nice" eclipse field got washed off and taken down and the shock refs left when games could have continued on that field getting the tournament done much faster and keeping more players happy.

I was impressed for the most part with the cooperation of all players. I appreciate a lot of players thanking us for reffing, asking if we needed water, and telling us we actually did make good calls. Lets face it we all know unless we have two dedicated reffs to each side of a player then something is going to get missed, its paintball and its fast paced. Maybe somethings should have been let go, maybe others shouldnt have been missed but no matter what the reffing is always going to suck in the players eyes. I had an instance where a player moved to a bunker and got shot dead in the crotch and watched me signal him a dead player before he could start shooting. He looked down, keeping his legs closed and asked where at, so i pointed at my own crotch and he finally opened and looked and said "oh ok, i promise i didnt feel anything". Im sorry but if you dont feel anything, not even the slightest tap on your crotch then somethings wrong. He never continued to play, he never shot his gun so i couldnt pull a penalty by the rules standards but he did try keeping it covered and had i not seen the hit and he got to dive into the snake he never would have been pulled for the hit. We all know players try their best to get away with hits. So for the players on the side lines watching that say we missed players getting shot(especially the ones that say they have reffed before) give us a break, we had half the equipment we should have had, didnt get water on the field until hours into the day, i have no idea when the blower or squeegees actually showed up on the field, got lunch after 1pm which we paid for out of the little money we actually made, and for 11 hours of reffing we got three breaks i believe where we were allowed to take off our masks.

Im not asking for any sympathy just saying please put yourselves in our shoes and believe that hours without mask relief, hours of no water and half the equipment to start with we tried our best. And by the time we could have changed it and done a better job we are already dehydrated with no energy wondering how were still sweating. I dont know that ill reff again but hope these changes happen for the future reffs.
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Old 05-08-2012, 09:40 AM #74
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We all agree it was one hell of a long day, but with all efforts made, everyone seemed to help support each other. I appreciate everyone who did.

Improvements to be made:

Time management in obvious. Giving breaks to refs should be more organized.

I got clipped in the back by the cars, nets should be higher.

Maybe another bathroom, being a girl, it would be more appreciated. After drinking gallons of gatorade and water, I had to go SO MUCH...

Shock refs were great, but was dissapointed with the calls on the other field.

As far as the skunk ordeal, that was inappropriate. Not to mention it's a family event, so there are children, think twice guys.

Overall I had a good time, thanks again to everyone who made it out!
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Old 05-08-2012, 10:30 AM #75
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I am not going to get into the skunk, it is what it is

Porta John = Big fail
Field condition was IMO pretty darn good.. pits were great
for those complaining about the nets...

My biggest irritation was the fact that when D3 started they got control of the one field.. for 6 teams.. WTF

That really pissed alot of people off.

We only played field 1 all day so I dont have the shock refs to compare to but I thought these guys did the best they could... I didnt see a ref smoking but thats pretty bad... I think the refs are getting a bad deal here....

THings to fix for Event 3.....
1. Start on time
2. Keep all fields that are available OPEN and running games
3. Clean and more than 1 porta john.
4. Try to give players a notice for the refs break/lunch and maybe we could plan to go and get some stuff..

PS. We loved the new format...
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Old 05-08-2012, 11:57 AM #76
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if black did't get the d3 division on field one we would have all been there even later..........

they did what they had to do to get the event rolling after a late start. everything ended with the sun still being around.

i can assure that the event 3 will be way better. each and every event it has only gotten better.
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Old 05-08-2012, 11:59 AM #77
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NEXT EVENT YOU CAN EXPECT

more johns
more refs
more refs
more staff
better field conditions
better bunkers
air fill will be faster and consistent


MORE TEAMS. don't quit because on little things. give it another shot.
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Old 05-08-2012, 12:17 PM #78
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MORE TEAMS. don't quit because on little things. give it another shot.
QFT. If all teams quit playing a tournament series because of little things, tournament paintball in general would cease to exist. Get out there and play to win people!
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Old 05-08-2012, 03:18 PM #79
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Hello Everyone,

I would first like to take this opportunity to say thank you to all the teams that came out to support Team Aftershock and The MWXL Series. We realize that there are quite a few tournament series out there where you can choose to spend your money but, you choose the MWXL and we truly appreciate your support!

Wow! There has been A LOT of feedback given and we welcome it with open arms. It is because of this type feedback that allows us to go back to the drawing board and address the things we did wrong head on, to insure a better tournament experience for you (The Player). Thank You for taking the time to share your thoughts with us. At this point, I would like to address some of the key, re-accruing issues mention and how we plan to address them.

Schedule:
I take full responsibility for this one guys. I want everyone to have the best experience possible when attending an MWXL event. As game time rapidly approached, I still had about six (6) D4 teams that still had not registered. Being that this was a bit of a drive for most and for some even more of a drive, I made the decision to give them a little more time to get in and register. You pool this with games going the distance on time and in some cases overtime, complications with the air stations which extended the 2 mins between matches as well as APPA issues, it (as you know) made for a very long day.

Moving forward, we will be on a strict adhered to schedule. What does this mean? This means that moving forward if games start at 8:00AM, games WILL start at 8:00AM with or without you. If you are scheduled to play at a certain time and are not on the field ready to play, after a 2 min grace period your match will be marked as a forfeit. Now with that said, this does put the burden on you (The Player) to take all the necessary steps needed to insure that you are prepared, ready and on the field for your scheduled game times.

We will also take steps to insure everything is in place with regards to our refing staff being ready and prepared with all equipment needed to start games ON TIME. I will also be working with the staff at APPA to develop a more timely process in preparing next round score cards as this does take some time now. We realize your time is important and since these tournaments are held on Sundays, most of us have work the next day. It is our goal to insure you (The Player) that a reoccurrence of such delays does NOT happen again.

Breaks:
Another one I will take full responsibility for. Ideally, we would like to take an event break after prelims are done. But due to the fore mention delays, I made the decision to take the break when I did because my refs were dying. I thought I would get them recharged and back out ready to finish out strong. I would like to say that, I made (what I thought) a very good attempt to communicate this to everyone by way of bull horn however, by some of your comments I was unsuccessful. I will be working with the other folks behind the scenes of The MWXL to put something in place to communicate to everyone at the event loud and clear.
By adhering to our schedule, this should put us in a position to be able to take our lunch break as scheduled (after prelims are DONE). Playing a part in this and kind of going back to what I said about making sure are refing staff has everything need, this includes water on each field for quick hydration breaks.

D3 vs. D4 and the Fields:
I made the decision to finish up the D4 prelims on field 1 and get D3 started on field 2, only because field 2 was pretty much done. They only had about 3 matches left so; I gave those remaining matches to field 1. It had nothing to do with trying to build up D3. The D4 teams are the corner stone of the MWXL. The series wouldn’t be what it is had it not been for the consisted support of D4 teams like Viscous Bunnies. DOOM ON YOU, Incognito, MDK, ALL OF YOU!! You are The MWXL!!! So if my actions made you feel less than appreciated, for this I would like to apologize to each of you as this was not my intention. As far as the breakdown of field 2, the only thing I can say is… THIS WAS THE DUMBEST **** EVER on our part and will NEVER happen again. Once a field is done with matches, we will split what’s remaining on the other field and keep rolling until we get down to finals!

Refs:
This is an area where we are always striving to improve in. While I know that it will never be perfect, we are always working towards it (perfection). Some of the issues that I have heard with field 1 here are the first time I have. I can say that, when someone comes to me with issues regarding my refs I AM ON IT!!! I can’t do anything about calls that you consider being bad or questionable and for the most part will back my head ref and his final decision, this is why we have a “Head Ref” on the field. However, if I am hearing that refs are smoking on the field while refing, acting lazy and not getting in making calls (basically doing their job) I address it ASAP!!! This type of behavior will not be tolerated period! I will also be looking into having more refs on the fields. I think that refing on field 2 was good for a number of reasons. One particularly, there were 8 on that field and 5 on the other… this will be addressed.

The Hosting Field:
Issues dealing with the host field are out of my hands however, we will be working even closer with them to insure that any assistance we can provide to insure that your experience there as a MWXL participant is enjoyable.

Big shout out to Manny and his crew at Proving Grounds Paintball for working hard with what they had to get ready for this event… we really appreciate it. I would also like to send a special shout out to team DOOM ON YOU for helping set up field 2!!

I would also like to say this to the person who felt I just shrugged him off… I am very sorry. I am pulled in all sorts of directions and apologize if I was short with you. Whenever someone approaches me, I try to make sure that I am as cordial with the 50th person to ask me a question that I am with the very 1st. I would ask that you not make this the deciding factor to if your team does or does not play another MWXL event.

Thanks Again EVERYONE on behalf of Team Aftershock and the entire MWXL Staff!

Janssen “Big Black” Spain
Event Coordinator, MWXL
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Old 05-08-2012, 03:23 PM #80
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I thought that the refs did really well for what they had. I know how they feel, I've reffed out in the hot sun for hours with little to no breaks. I think overall they did a good job. (Shout out to head ref on field 1). The field itself was pretty good compared what it has been in the past. The nets were fine, balls coming over are going to happen its just a part of the sport (at cup I got hit upwards of 10 times a day when I was there). The skunk is what it is and there is no need to dwell on it. The worst was the time in between games. That was awful, and the break between the 3rd and 4th matches was stupid. Things are going to go wrong, come on its paintball if something doesn't go wrong then someone isn't doing something right. Big Black puts on a good series and I bet that there will be improvements for event 3. If you are unsatisfied with this event, I hope that you don't go to the others because of it. Don't take it as a sign to not play the other events. Big Black will be all over improvements for the next event.

Also stop ripping on the field, we've heard all of it already so no need to say it again. This thread is for the series, not the home field so knock it off. They did the best they could given the amount of time and limited resources they had. Come on, there are gonna be poor fields but I can assure you that there is no way in **** that this is the worst by any means.
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Old 05-08-2012, 04:03 PM #81
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shock should never be able to ref another event i tried to get a penlty so i got shot they saw i got shot and i ran up and shot out another player and they didnt do anything about it , and at one point the refs were running down a dirty player that had the flag to tell him he was out, its not his place to do that,and a dead player checking the player with the flag by rubbing against him wow shock you sure are a joke at reffing did they take the psp reffing course?
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Old 05-08-2012, 05:19 PM #82
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I enjoyed setting up the field on sat and the chance to grind with aftershock boys and others. Thanks again for a good event.
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Old 05-08-2012, 06:42 PM #83
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shock should never be able to ref another event i tried to get a penlty so i got shot they saw i got shot and i ran up and shot out another player and they didnt do anything about it , and at one point the refs were running down a dirty player that had the flag to tell him he was out, its not his place to do that,and a dead player checking the player with the flag by rubbing against him wow shock you sure are a joke at reffing did they take the psp reffing course?
Okay, I give. Can someone translate this for me? I tried to read it, but my head started to hurt.

Are you saying that you were testing the refs by trying to get a penalty? What field were you playing?
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Old 05-08-2012, 08:56 PM #84
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To the MWXL teams,

I apologize for the lack of port-a-johns. I completely forgot to order them for the weekend. You guys are the reason regional tournament series such as the MWXL are around, and are the voice that the MWXL will listen to. With that said, if YOU decide to have the MWXL come back to Proving Grounds, we promise to address each and every issue to the best of our ability.

A huge thanks to the MWXL, Renick Miller, Janssen "BB" Spain, Chicago Aftershock, the Indianapolis Wiseguys reffing crew, Doom On You, Kenny Schell of Asylum Paintball, to all the members of my teams and staff, and most importantly, to the teams that attended.

_Manny Francia, Owner
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