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Old 03-02-2012, 07:43 PM #1
BigCat88
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Deal with SGTspazzo - G6R arrived not as described

I had a deal with SGTspazzo for his Ambush Army G6R initiated February 28th, 2012. He had reached an agreement via PM's for $735 overnight shipped from BC, Canada to Ohio. USA. I paid the $735, but I had forgot fees in which I agreed to gift. When I received the marker, it was not in the condition described by SGTspazzo in his thread and in his PMs. The marker was covered in paint, gunked everywhere from the window, to the trigger, to the eye covers, and so on. He had the HPR covered in tape to mask the all the scratches. The rammer also strikes the bolt pin against the body. The laser engraving is stained to an off-white from neglect and the anodizing has also been scratched to the raw aluminum in multiple places as well. The barrel was also well

PMs:









His thread and pictures:





Pictures of marker received today:








I will be posting the unboxing video tonight and another showing the condition as well.

In summation, the marker was shipped not as described but instead in deplorable condition all over.
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Old 03-02-2012, 07:45 PM #2
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More pictures of the marker:





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Old 03-02-2012, 08:27 PM #3
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Have you talked to the seller about it...link to this thread? See if you can work it out...if he is unresponsive file a claim with PayPal.
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Old 03-02-2012, 11:04 PM #4
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I have contacted a moderator to help me resolve this and filed for a false feedback as well. I am not planning on commenting on here that often as It only matters to me what the moderators decide.

To start off I will assure anyone who asks that the pictures that BigCat88 took do show all the marks/nicks/scratches what ever you want to call it on the gun when I shipped it. Nothing appears to be added. The only one I do not recognize is the one on the maple leaf on the left side of the gun just before the LPR, but most certainly could have happened during play on sunday.

Just want to comment on a few things, one being:
BigCat88 never once asked me if I had the matching ENGRAVED barrel simply (You can see that quote in the screen shots he posted):
"One last thing gotta check before we proceed what exact ups does it have??? Also do you have the matching annoed barrel?"
so I responded:
"Yes I have the matching barrel it is the same colour as the red on the frame.
You will get:
Ambush Army G6r
LP Poppit
Pillow Bolt
4c Eyes
Violent Trigger
Stock Barrel
Original Box"

You can clearly see in the pictures that he took that the barrel is indeed matching!

Another:
I clearly said that it has its flaws/nicks what ever you want to call it and that there are some one the reg from my rings that I wear, which are visible in any of the playing pictures of me. It is not my fault that he never asked for a photo of just the regulator, and most certainly not my fault that he misinterpreted what i meant by some.
"Anyways I have here one of my teams guns up for sale. This happens to be the one I used for the entire 2011 season from HB till now. The gun is 1 of 15 Ambush Army 2011 G6r's on the market. It has always been teched by a certified bob long tech (good friend Bjorn ) This gun does however have a few nicks from regular play and some small nicks at the front of the reg from my rings I wear."

I also told him I have pictures and video's if he wanted. He never once asked me for them so again not my fault that he didn't "investigate" more into the maker before making the purchase.

And lastly:
To comment towards the paint and dirt being on the marker and it not being lubed. I never said I was going to clean it before I shipped it nor did I say I was going to lube it, EVER! I was planning on it but unfortunately I did not have my allen keys as they were in my gear bag which was not in my possession at the time I shipped. The gun has been lubed and cleaned many times. Some people say not enough some people say to many times. I unfortunately play the sport, I don't put everything on display on my mantle after I'm done playing. I could care less what the outside of a gun looks like whether it is dirty, oily, dusty, or if it is pink and has "The owner of this marker sucks at paintball" engraved along the side. As long as it shoots to my specification it is amazing in my books.

As seen in the picture with the receipt that was taken the night before I shipped it out. You can clearly see that there is paint, dirt, scratches, and the non "White"(DIRTY) engraving on the feedneck, "window", grips, lpr, trigger, screws and the body and frame. That should have been a HUGE indication that would make at least my self want to see more pictures.


Just a tip for anyone who has a engraved surface on a marker. If you take a damp cloth and put some elbow grease into it you can get almost 100% of the dirt off. Just in case it is not looking as "WHITE" as you think it should.


Again at any point I could have sent pictures or a shooting video but they were never requested. Not my job to show more than I have to!
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Old 03-03-2012, 10:06 PM #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SGTspazzo View Post

.... Not my job to show more than I have to!
This is a ****ty attitude going into a deal. It is your job to make sure your buyer knows what he's getting. Nobody can completely tell the condition of your used item, and no one will know what to ask as far as defects are concerned, because there are too many possibilities. So IMO it's your duty-if you were a legit seller- to be honest and completely describe (if necessary with pictures) the exact condition of your marker. To your credit, you did mention a few nicks from regular play and some small nicks at the front of the reg. Plus you did offer additional pictures.

To the OP: Different people have different standards of how clean they keep their gun. So it's just routine to scrub down every used marker you bought. More often than not there's still more dirt and gunk on and in the gun than a new owner would like to see. Secondly, you are buying a marker that has been used a whole year for multiple tournaments. So you should expect a "well-worn" marker. Anytime someone says nicks from "regular" play, expect the condition to be worse than you think. Specifically because people play with different styles, and what's "regular" for one guy maybe equipment abuse for another. So there is a certain degree of buyers beware here.
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Old 03-04-2012, 03:41 AM #6
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Didn't mean it as a thing of withholding information on the marker more meant it as I was not going to describe every scratches location. I'm not the type of guy who will let someone get something that doesnt work or is in horrible condition. Between the pictures of the gun with the scratches/dirt/paint that I provided in my BST post and how I described the condition of the gun I felt I explained enough. As I said in the thread I was not going to be putting much effort into the post as I could care less if it was sold or not.



I do not however see it fit that BigCat88 is to give me an ultimatum:
"Either you refund me $820 which includes the shipping cost back or send me $300 cash via paypal by Saturday March 3rd at Midnight EST! If not I will send the unboxing video and all the evidence over to paypal including all screen shots of your post and our conversations! I will be posting a thread in the theft report section of B/S/T with those details as well."
(can provide a screen if need be)

From dealing with other problems in the past I know that If I was to make this paypal dispute into a claim the worst thing that would happen is he would get his money back minus the $22 he sent as a gift and he would have to pay for the shipping costs out of his pocket.


EDIT: Would also like to view the unboxing video if it will be posted
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Old 03-04-2012, 08:47 AM #7
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ill ship the G6R back on my own dime to resolve this!!! Please send me back what i had originally payed which is the 735+25 and Ill gladly ship this back to you!!! Sorry if your offended by the truth! Connor common sense says if you weren't hiding anything then you would have covered up the damage in the pic with the receipt... Nor would it have been sent with tape covering the damaged areas!
I'm sorry i couldn't and wouldn't falsely advertise a marker and try to hide the damage like you did!
Connor McCron
"never said I was going to clean it before I shipped it nor did I say I was going to lube it, EVER! I was planning on it but unfortunately I did not have my allen keys as they were in my gear bag which was not in my possession at the time I shipped."

Under what circumstance is it ever right to have to discuss cleaning a marker! Your an adult and should have pride in your property and if someone is willing to pay you good money the least you could do would be to properly clean the gun NO ALLEN KEY NECESSARY!!! Please PM me and send the cash back so i can send you your marker back! I cleaned the outside of the marker! I will send you a set of Allen Keys so you can properly sell your gun the next time you list it.... If you want to work something else out please post here or pm me! I will hold off on the escalation of the claim with paypal for the time being but please make this right!!!!
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Old 03-04-2012, 08:51 AM #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardpainball View Post
This is a ****ty attitude going into a deal. It is your job to make sure your buyer knows what he's getting. Nobody can completely tell the condition of your used item, and no one will know what to ask as far as defects are concerned, because there are too many possibilities. So IMO it's your duty-if you were a legit seller- to be honest and completely describe (if necessary with pictures) the exact condition of your marker. To your credit, you did mention a few nicks from regular play and some small nicks at the front of the reg. Plus you did offer additional pictures.

To the OP: Different people have different standards of how clean they keep their gun. So it's just routine to scrub down every used marker you bought. More often than not there's still more dirt and gunk on and in the gun than a new owner would like to see. Secondly, you are buying a marker that has been used a whole year for multiple tournaments. So you should expect a "well-worn" marker. Anytime someone says nicks from "regular" play, expect the condition to be worse than you think. Specifically because people play with different styles, and what's "regular" for one guy maybe equipment abuse for another. So there is a certain degree of buyers beware here.
I full agree with the statements above for both sides! I feel as a buyer I was mislead and disrespected and Connor McCrons poor attitude has made this a tough pill to swallow. He showed his true colors when he needed to man up and by based on his defensive demeanor and his lack of respect how could i feel anything but scammed!

I think its bad when your first line in your post is IM NOT HERE TO SCAM ANYONE I ONCE WAS YOUNG.... ASK ANYONE AT NPPL WHO Connor McCron IS AND THEY WILL GLADLY POINT ME OUT"... This clearly should have been my first warning and i am at fault for foolishly ignoring it and taking the other positive feedback as he had changed!

Further more I'm not saying that i don't have high standards and that i may be expecting to much out of people. He DID mention the dings on the reg but never once said that the laser engraving was scratched to bare metal in certain places! I hope that Connor can do the adult thing and properly rectify the situation at hand!
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Old 03-04-2012, 08:52 AM #9
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SGTspazzo, a lot of what you have done/said during this transactions seems rather dishonest. You should have been extremely up front with him and accurately described the condition of the marker as well as it not truly having a matching barrel. From the screen shots, and what you have admitted to telling him, you told him half truths and bits of veiled information. Judging by your past feedback this doesn't look like the first time you have done something like this either.

In the end, it is up to the buyer and the seller to work things out. I know if I were the buyer I would not be happy at all in this deal.
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Old 03-04-2012, 09:34 AM #10
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Originally Posted by SGTspazzo View Post
Again at any point I could have sent pictures or a shooting video but they were never requested. Not my job to show more than I have to!
The feedback left by the buyer seems appropriate, and should stand. Judging by you other two negative feedbacks, this is a pattern of yours. I know the gun might have been used, and will have some knicks, scratches and possibly small dents, but it should be fully disclosed. And sending out a dirty gun speaks volumes of how you actually conduct business. You clearly couldn't be bothered to clean the gun before shipping it, nor describe it's true condition.
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Old 03-05-2012, 11:28 AM #11
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Thanks guys i appreciate the support it was a crap ordeal ... However he seems to be making the situation correct. I will keep the thread updated with the progress!
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Old 03-05-2012, 12:24 PM #12
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good luck getting this resolved i would have never accepted this marker either
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Old 03-06-2012, 03:30 PM #13
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just noticed how all his pics appear to be of the same side of the gun, always get pictures of both sides but yes an overall greasy deal.
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Old 03-15-2012, 10:55 AM #14
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Dirty marker and high price for it. I've seen nicer G6Rs go for a lot less on here.
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Old 03-15-2012, 05:20 PM #15
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I would side with Spazzo. He did say it was used a whole season and that it had some nicks and stuff. He never said it would arrive clean. Yes he should have cleaned it but honestly, just take 5 minutes and clean it yourself, its not a big deal. The wear on the gun doesn't seem excessive especially for how he described it. Spazzo is annoyed because this guy is someone who should have bought a new gun, but bought used to save money, and then realized used means used, so not he wants to back out (after the transaction was finished).

Honestly Spazzo, let him take up the paypal dispute. We all know paypal does not decide anything about the contents of a transaction. They only decide if a party did or did not receive it, and possibly if it was counterfeit. Any info he has shown here is just as valif as the info you have posted, so it is a he said/he said, and paypal will stay out of it.

To the buyer, yes this is harsh to you, but it will teach you to ask for far more pictures when buying something this expensive. This is also a case of do not hope for something to be better when you have evidence to the contrary. He said it was used with some nicks and scuffs. It is used with some nicks and scuffs. Deal with it!


*edit*
Spazzo, if you do decide to refund him whatever amount, make sure not to send a thing until you get your marker back in the condition you sent it out in.

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Old 03-17-2012, 06:00 AM #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbthebenji View Post
I would side with Spazzo. He did say it was used a whole season and that it had some nicks and stuff. He never said it would arrive clean. Yes he should have cleaned it but honestly, just take 5 minutes and clean it yourself, its not a big deal. The wear on the gun doesn't seem excessive especially for how he described it. Spazzo is annoyed because this guy is someone who should have bought a new gun, but bought used to save money, and then realized used means used, so not he wants to back out (after the transaction was finished).

Honestly Spazzo, let him take up the paypal dispute. We all know paypal does not decide anything about the contents of a transaction. They only decide if a party did or did not receive it, and possibly if it was counterfeit. Any info he has shown here is just as valif as the info you have posted, so it is a he said/he said, and paypal will stay out of it.

To the buyer, yes this is harsh to you, but it will teach you to ask for far more pictures when buying something this expensive. This is also a case of do not hope for something to be better when you have evidence to the contrary. He said it was used with some nicks and scuffs. It is used with some nicks and scuffs. Deal with it!


*edit*
Spazzo, if you do decide to refund him whatever amount, make sure not to send a thing until you get your marker back in the condition you sent it out in.
I compliantly agree with above user. As a buyer its your job to ask for as much info an pictures you need to make the buy. He stated its used an i also agree if anyone that ever had a gun laser to anno knows that with dirty an paint on gun the white lasering looks dull an beat to crap. All you have to do is like user stated take a warm wet cloth an whip down. An small nicks you will get from play, theres some people that dont play hard or worry about every nick an scratch i look at that marker an see some play on it an the reg scratches you can tell are from a ring. Overall i believe the buyer had buyer remorse an is looking for a reason to back out.
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Old 03-17-2012, 04:01 PM #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VFT_GUNNER View Post
I compliantly agree with above user. As a buyer its your job to ask for as much info an pictures you need to make the buy. He stated its used an i also agree if anyone that ever had a gun laser to anno knows that with dirty an paint on gun the white lasering looks dull an beat to crap. All you have to do is like user stated take a warm wet cloth an whip down. An small nicks you will get from play, theres some people that dont play hard or worry about every nick an scratch i look at that marker an see some play on it an the reg scratches you can tell are from a ring. Overall i believe the buyer had buyer remorse an is looking for a reason to back out.
I have trouble with your stance. based on my own experience a seller can hide the true condition of a used marker, and mislead the buyer with ambiguous description. A buyer cannot know the true condition of a marker regardless of how many questions he asks or how many pictures he gets. It is up to the seller to let his sellers know the real condition of the item. It's the honest and the right thing to do.
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Old 03-17-2012, 07:08 PM #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardpainball View Post
I have trouble with your stance. based on my own experience a seller can hide the true condition of a used marker, and mislead the buyer with ambiguous description. A buyer cannot know the true condition of a marker regardless of how many questions he asks or how many pictures he gets. It is up to the seller to let his sellers know the real condition of the item. It's the honest and the right thing to do.
And we feel as though he did that. He had pictures and said the gun had nicks from a year's play as a tournament marker. Its up to a buyer to realize that if you buy a used gun, its used, not lnib unless otherwise specified. When I hear used for a year with nicks, I'm expecting a lot worse than what was pictured.
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Old 03-17-2012, 11:04 PM #19
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Finally someone besides my teammates agree that I was In the right.
To the people that still believe I was trying to hide the scratches, I was not. I can't explain it any more. I was not trying to scam him, rip him off, or anything like that. I was simply trying to get rid of a marker for a decent price to someone who I thought would know the condition of it. I don't treat my stuff with much respect; not that I throw my gun to the ground and try to clean it with sandpaper, I just don't care if its dirty. I don't like paintball to be perfectly honest; only reason I still play it still is because of friends, traveling, and meeting new people. I don't care what new guns come on the market or gear. As long as it works as good as I need it to it is good enough for me.

Although some may call me an *** for not providing more info, I provided enough and don't regret anything I did(I won't be loosing sleep over this).

As I am a decent human and understand what it feels like to receive something that you thought would be in better condition (as I have been down that road before), I have returned all the money including the money sent as a gift. Mr. Pitrone shipped the item back to me, unfortunately for me though there was a $103 custom's fee on it, as Greg failed to make it clear that it was been returned. I appealed it and am waiting for it to be reviewed which can take up to a month! I HAVE NOT ACCEPTED/SIGNED FOR ANY BOX YET!!!! I will do so once the fee has been brought down to Free Ninety-Nine. (I will make a video on the unboxing to make sure the contents are what I sent and that it is in the same condition that I shipped in.) Not that I don't trust him but just covering my *** as he did when he supposedly made a unboxing video himself.

Last thing I will say. To those who think that I was in the wrong for saying that the barrel was not matching when he asked. As far as Bob Long (who does not engrave any of there barrels) and the rest of the world are concerned it is a matching barrel. See the links bellow for proof (straight from Left Coast Paintball, the people who engrave Bob Long's markers). I mean there is an album just for us I'm pretty sure that the 10 of those shown came with a Red MATCHING barrel. Just saying though...
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...89909&type= 3


For more proof that BL doesn't engrave barrels. Look at our previous team guns:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...4589909&type=3
and
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...4589909&type=3
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Old 03-18-2012, 01:12 AM #20
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You refunded the money before you got the item back?! Why on earth would you do that?
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:37 AM #21
SGTspazzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbthebenji View Post
You refunded the money before you got the item back?! Why on earth would you do that?
I don't know. Being pissed off and wanting it to all end. Probably scrued myself.
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