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Old 02-06-2012, 10:30 PM #337
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Originally Posted by Alpha Q Up View Post
because the front elbow part is so low now, isnt it going to be a lot easier to shoot people that are getting into/filling the snake??!?!
filling into the snake will definitely be tougher, you'll pretty much have to run for it and superman slide in.... and hope the corner gets shot off the break. It'll make the snake more challenging in general, but not impossible.
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Old 02-06-2012, 10:50 PM #338
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Originally Posted by raehl View Post
Damien has said several times that they are shorter than the 2011 beams.


I don't see what all the apprehension here is. 6 long narrow things are replaced with 4 medium narrow things and 4 bent narrow things. either they keep putting other bunkers in the snake, in which case it ain't much different than before, or they don't, in which case you use the interior bunkers on the field to block out other bunkers to make your shots.

I mean, really, even before, if you can shoot at someone from the snake, they can shoot at you. If, in the past, you used a "knuckle" to block out a different player so you could shoot a player, worst case now you just move to put another bunker on the field between you.

This could actually make the snake even stronger, as if there are more interior bunkers blocking out more shots on the snake, it'll take more guns to keep snake players down. More guns on the snake means less guns anywhere else - which makes the snake effective even if it isn't the snake player getting the actual kills.


- Chris
I totally see where you are coming from. From 8yrs of snake experience, this makes the snake players job more difficult. We have less protection is the bottom point. Gun battling another snake guy is made harder, and snap shooting across the field is as well.
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Old 02-06-2012, 10:51 PM #339
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I hear a lot of this:

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Old 02-06-2012, 10:51 PM #340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raehl View Post

I mean, really, even before, if you can shoot at someone from the snake, they can shoot at you. If, in the past, you used a "knuckle" to block out a different player so you could shoot a player, worst case now you just move to put another bunker on the field between you.

- Chris
So while you do that, what is there to stop shots coming at you from the other snake player or the corner?
If I'm in the corner, I dominate the wire, and keep shots over your head. If I'm in the snake, I wait until I hear your gun shoot then I pop up and shoot you.
these force play outside and low. Only coming to the inside when the opportunity presents itself, and not more than a second or two.

Unless there is really serious thought into the design of the field. Then the risk reward has gone down.
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Old 02-06-2012, 10:54 PM #341
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Old 02-06-2012, 11:52 PM #342
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going to need to play these before i can give an opinion. I can see good and bad things happening to the guy in these bunkers
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Old 02-07-2012, 12:31 AM #343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjs21 View Post
I totally see where you are coming from. From 8yrs of snake experience, this makes the snake players job more difficult. We have less protection is the bottom point. Gun battling another snake guy is made harder, and snap shooting across the field is as well.
How can gun battling the other snake guy be harder? He's in the same snake you are; so by definition, you vs. him CAN'T be harder. If it's harder for you, it's just as much harder for him.

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So while you do that, what is there to stop shots coming at you from the other snake player or the corner?
If I'm in the corner, I dominate the wire, and keep shots over your head.
If your opponent has snake corner, maybe all you do for a while is force him to keep his gun on tape - but that assumes there are NO bunkers taller than the snake bunkers on the entire length of the snake, and I find that unlikely. But even if that is the case, that just means you can't get lots of G's out of the snake just by being "even" on bodies on the tape - you may have to be up a body on snake tape to get full advantage, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Quote:
If I'm in the snake, I wait until I hear your gun shoot then I pop up and shoot you.
Maybe I shoot my gun and then shoot you when you pop up.

Quote:
these force play outside and low. Only coming to the inside when the opportunity presents itself, and not more than a second or two.
Even if that's true, that's not necessarily bad. A second is plenty of time to shoot out another player as long as your aim don't stink.

Quote:
Unless there is really serious thought into the design of the field. Then the risk reward has gone down.
While it's certainly possible, depending on the layout, snake might not be as dominant as it was that's also not necessarily a bad thing.

But I'm definitely not seeing don't-play-snake as a valid strategy. If you do that the other team will be quick to take advantage.

- Chris
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Last edited by raehl : 02-07-2012 at 12:38 AM.
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Old 02-07-2012, 01:20 AM #344
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You all are really being such babies about this. Yeah I don't like it and I play snake as well but what this requires is for you to know how far to back up or move toward to get a good and fast snap shot on a certain bunker. Theres no more ability to sit out and aim. You have to know what the angles and predict where your snap will end up.

Sorry if this is too difficult or too much work for you to learn, maybe you should gtfo of the snake. This will eliminate the wannabe skilled players diving into the snake because it was previously easy to play with a decent success rate... These new bunkers will out wanna be snake players and highlight true dominant snake players that will work hard and understand how a snake should be properly played

Before any little kid could dive into the snake, get a g or two and consider himself a snake player. Now it will require individuals with field vision and snapping skills. I'm sure psp is sorry for trying require a more dynamic player at this position

If anything this will make coaching snake side less effective because the player can know what bunker the opponent is in but he still has to figure out where to move to come up and get the best shot. If he's not on point the. He'll have to switch it up because now the opponent knows where he will be snapping out of if the snake player chooses to try again without moving

Last edited by Team.Infected : 02-07-2012 at 01:23 AM.
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Old 02-07-2012, 01:36 AM #345
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On another note, how do you think this will effect the pro division?

Just some thoughts:
1) new teams that entered pro division like 187 will have to adapt even faster to learn how to play the field in a new way as well as addapt to the pro style of play (not judging them at all)
2) will this level the playing field for new teams or rosters that have been greatly changed this off season?
3) will teams that have been together for a while be able to adapt fast enough because they are "used to" the old snake.

Lets try to make is a positive thread guys starting with this because I am very interested on the effects of this snake being a snake player.

4) will "snake players" now play other parts of the field more frequently and will anchor players now favor the snake corner/another spot on the field?
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Old 02-07-2012, 01:38 AM #346
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I cant wait to give these new bunkers a try.
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Old 02-07-2012, 02:34 AM #347
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how much smaller are the bunkers?
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Old 02-07-2012, 02:57 AM #348
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how much smaller are the bunkers?
I also wanna know, If i had to guess, looks like they cut 4 inches off the top, probally less though...
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Old 02-07-2012, 04:04 AM #349
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Originally Posted by raehl View Post
Damien has said several times that they are shorter than the 2011 beams.


I don't see what all the apprehension here is. 6 long narrow things are replaced with 4 medium narrow things and 4 bent narrow things. either they keep putting other bunkers in the snake, in which case it ain't much different than before, or they don't, in which case you use the interior bunkers on the field to block out other bunkers to make your shots.

I mean, really, even before, if you can shoot at someone from the snake, they can shoot at you. If, in the past, you used a "knuckle" to block out a different player so you could shoot a player, worst case now you just move to put another bunker on the field between you.

This could actually make the snake even stronger, as if there are more interior bunkers blocking out more shots on the snake, it'll take more guns to keep snake players down. More guns on the snake means less guns anywhere else - which makes the snake effective even if it isn't the snake player getting the actual kills.


- Chris
"shorter" and "taller" is two different things Chris

What he means is, that the beams are shorter in length - the height is the same as the 2011 beams.

As for the rest of your post:

Either, the snake is supposed to work without the addition of several other bunkers, as said by Adrenaline Games
Or, the snake will need just as many bunkers inserted as before.

In the first case, it is a crappy bunker
In the second case, it's completely pointless to do an upgrade, and just pulling money out of field owners pockets unnecessarily
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Old 02-07-2012, 04:07 AM #350
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If they're the same height, I'm even more confused as to any objection.

What if, instead of needing 4 to 6 "knuckles" to make the snake work, it now only takes 2?

- Chris
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Old 02-07-2012, 04:13 AM #351
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You all are really being such babies about this. Yeah I don't like it and I play snake as well but what this requires is for you to know how far to back up or move toward to get a good and fast snap shot on a certain bunker.
You want to back up?

Good luck with that

Without a knuckle in front of you..... you back up a yard, and paint rains in on you from the corner, over the top of the angle, which is only 2.5 feet tall (just like the former beams)
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Old 02-07-2012, 06:19 AM #352
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What he means is, that the beams are shorter in length - the height is the same as the 2011 beams.
Are you sure about that?

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they look taller, which does make it easier for bigger people, imo
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There are not. They are shorter. And the Snake beam is almost concave (about 2" shorter towards to middle.)
I'll see if I can get you pics with someone standing next to them.
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Old 02-07-2012, 07:41 AM #353
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Are you sure about that?
Yep

2.5 feet high
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Old 02-07-2012, 08:27 AM #354
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They look almost the height of the old Angel Bunkers from 2004-5 era....those things were always traps...very hard to get around it, and you can't really play over the top unless they put something to break up your outline like a can or temple. Either way, it's fun to have things change ever so slightly each year...hard on field owners to keep up with having the bunkers each year if they have to drop another 1-2 grand on bunkers and throw away the bunkers from the year before because they are now inadequate...in a sport where the tourney players really don't bring in the moneys they used to for field owners. I remember 80 bucks per case days and 20$ to play....just sayin...
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Old 02-07-2012, 08:28 AM #355
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My question is how soon are the updates comming out
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Old 02-07-2012, 08:37 AM #356
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I remember 80 bucks per case days and 20$ to play....just sayin...
I paid 50 a case and 20 to play last week....and every week since i started... just sayin....
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Old 02-07-2012, 08:43 AM #357
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As a snake player I'm loving the look of these. Only wish my local field had a few to experiment with.
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