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Old 11-07-2011, 09:44 AM #22
the incubus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martix_agent View Post
this is your opinion and you're absolutely entitled to it, but wouldn't you want to cater to a larger client base by satisfying those who want them?
I tested a few prototypes with upper adjustment screws for "Fine Tuning" with Ripper Machinist and he showed/explained to me with hard numbers how
ineffective those adjustment points truly are as all they would do is minimally alter the pitch angle and ultimately would weigh the Trigger down a touch.

Initially I designed them with an adjustment point up top but later ditched it in favor of running a lip running forward so the Trigger doesn't slide
up into the frame, making contact with the LPR in order to designate the Home Position. Mind you, was BEFORE the GEN5 was in the works so we were
going off the MARQ6. The Front Sweeping Lip has proven to offer the perfect counter balance to the rest of the Triggers' body, resulting in an almost
100% neutral balance point which is why 98% of Markers can run Spring or Magnet Free without the consequence of mechanical bounce many simply
cannot do with other MARQ & GEN5 Triggers. As for future POWER Triggers for other Platforms (PE will be next), my styles will retain all the same
adjustment points as the factory Triggers. Magnets are the other No-No I shied away from for 2 reasons.

First, it's the added weight of the Magnets. Magnets are considerably more dense and consist of a heavier substrate and even the tiniest of Magnets
alone would've counter acted my WRC altogether and my Triggers would've suffered for the same MB as everyone else so I always suggest to anyone
asking, to try and fine tune their adjustments so they can run magnet free and usually they end up running without them.

Second, since its introduction, part of the appeal of the Intimidator was due to the phenomenal feel of its Trigger. While they are assembled with a
rather stiff Trigger Spring, the vast majority of owners ditched the Spring altogether, opting to run right off the Microswitch altogether which offered just
the perfect amount of resistance throughout the entire Trigger Pull. With Magnets, you simply lose this altogether. However, I know many have jumped
from Markers utilizing only the Magnetic SNAP and is what feels best/more natural to them. For this reason, POWER Triggers will accept any Magnet Kits
that will fit/work with the Factory Triggers.

It wasn't until the very last minute we made a slight modification to the Triggers that made them 100% cross compatible between the MARQs & GEN5
Intimidators (Protege & Vice), but in the end, performance between the 2 platforms was identical and all in all, I've had maybe 3-4 people complain
about their Triggers with 2 of them being adjustment related where the user could not set them just right and I had them send in their Markers and
adjusted their Triggers and both were very satisfied with how I set them. The other 2 were odd issues, one being a tiny burr getting between one of the
bearings and the Trigger Post which made the Trigger Travel oddly so I swapped out his Bearings and Trigger Post and all was well. The Other Trigger was
just not right in a Protege no matter what I tried but it worked perfectly on my Vice, so I tried several others on that Protege and they all worked
perfectly. I swapped him out and he was happy as can be.

In the end, most of us (myself included) seek products with specific features, but developing products to suit everyone’s tastes is simply an impossibility
and the best we can do is to try and make something that falls right in between. Ultimately though, it's been my experience that performance of a
product should always be the #1 priority and I'm not willing compromise performance for "added features" just to sell more product. Keep in mind that
as a fellow Player (for almost 20 years now), I know where you're coming from, but my hope is that the masses keep an open mind and perhaps try a
POWER Trigger before passing judgment.

In fact, if you are weary of purchasing one because of the lack of upper fine tune adjustment points, I am open to sending you one to try out for yourself
and if in the end it’s just not your cup of tea, simply send it back (POWER will cover return shipping). If you like it (thinking optimistically, I think you will),
simply submit payment and join the minions of satisfied customers.



Mods, Please let me know if there’s anything in this message that you’d like me to remove/edit and I will do so. The intent is to provide as
much information to anyone reading/following this thread.
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Old 11-08-2011, 11:11 AM #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the incubus View Post
In fact, if you are weary of purchasing one because of the lack of upper fine tune adjustment points, I am open to sending you one to try out for yourself
and if in the end it’s just not your cup of tea, simply send it back (POWER will cover return shipping). If you like it (thinking optimistically, I think you will),
simply submit payment and join the minions of satisfied customers.
If there was ever a doubt in anyone's mind just how confident you should be in ordering one of these triggers, this should remove it. I've NEVER heard a complaint about quality from a Power trigger owner, and after fondling a Protege with a saber trigger myself, I was a believer. I personally am looking forward to the release of the Eclipse triggers.

The question on your mind really shouldn't be "should I get a Power trigger or another trigger?", rather you should instead be asking "should I get the kodachi or the saber?"

Last edited by WillyW0nka : 11-08-2011 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 11-08-2011, 02:17 PM #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the incubus View Post
In fact, if you are weary of purchasing one because of the lack of upper fine tune adjustment points, I am open to sending you one to try out for yourself
and if in the end it’s just not your cup of tea, simply send it back (POWER will cover return shipping). If you like it (thinking optimistically, I think you will),
simply submit payment and join the minions of satisfied customers.
I had one and got rid of it, it wasn't for lack of quality, I just didn't like it.(the curve of the saberr trigger was just awkward for me and a picked up a violent trigger instead) It seemed to me that it may have been due to lack of adjustments, but after reading what you've said I will take that back.

anyhow, people seem to love it so keep on doing what you do!

Last edited by martix_agent : 11-08-2011 at 02:19 PM.
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Old 11-08-2011, 02:22 PM #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martix_agent View Post
I had one and got rid of it, it wasn't for lack of quality, I just didn't like it.(the curve of the power trigger was just awkward for me and a picked up a violent trigger instead) It seemed to me that it may have been due to lack of adjustments, but after reading what you've said I will take that back.

anyhow, people seem to love it so keep on doing what you do!
Ahh, was it the Saber trigger? I can see how some people wouldn't like the shape. The triggers themselves are phenomenal, but there is no one shape/style that will be comfortable for everyone. I have a friend who prefers a straight stick trigger to everything. No idea why, as I've always thought curved triggers were the easiest to use, but to each his own.
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Old 11-09-2011, 12:46 AM #26
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Make some for gen3's!
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Old 11-09-2011, 11:04 AM #27
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as soon as payday hits and upon release the kodachi is where im headed for my g6r
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Old 11-09-2011, 11:39 AM #28
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Make some for gen3's!
I would LOVE to do this but sadly, the market/demand for previous Generations is simply not great enough to justify the costs involved in doing so.

If you are creative enough, you can have a Cam of sorts made to take the place of the Bearings that has an offset hole for the mounting screw that would allow you to position the GEN5 versions properly so they function perfectly. You would of course have to machine/grind out a small channel at the bottom of the the Trigger Guard towards the rear to create the clearance needed for free travel.


Here's a pic I took of a Dragon I built last year dawning a SABER just to show it can be made to work...



It's not perfect, but you can come darn close.
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Old 11-10-2011, 01:41 AM #29
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Oh Im sure your reputation will make people buy plenty of gen 3 triggers... how many roughly would need to be preordered before you could make them?
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Old 11-10-2011, 10:16 AM #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fallinher0
Oh Im sure your reputation will make people buy plenty of gen 3 triggers... how many roughly would need to be preordered before you could make them?
I'm wondering this as well. I want a power for my RL timmy.
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Old 11-10-2011, 10:45 AM #31
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Oh Im sure your reputation will make people buy plenty of gen 3 triggers... how many roughly would need to be preordered before you could make them?
Put it to you this way...

The Modeling and Machining alone (excluding anodizing) would be upwards of a couple thousand dollars. Then there is Ano, Bearings, Screws, and Packaging.

Calculate how many Triggers would need to be sold at $40 per in order to just break even?... That's how many it would take to have them made for GEN1-4 Timmys. And while I receive hundreds of requests for my Triggers, the reality is that most are fantasizing and will not spend the money on older generation Triggers, leaving me with stock I can't move which is money lost.

I have created a thread on another forum informing all that GEN5/MARQ Triggers are also in the works but will need a certain number of Pre-Orders filled before giving the green light on machining them and suddenly all those folks promising to buy "if and when" I decided to do another run of them are nowhere to be found. It's been 2 weeks and not one person who begged me to produce them has come through on their promise. I've already paid for Jig to re-run them so if no one buy's them, there's a few hundred I've lost.

I would personally love to have one of my KODACHI Triggers on all my Timmys but it simply is not cost effective unless there are several dozen units sold. And with Pre-GEN5 Timmys being out for as long as they have, I doubt I'd get 50 Pre-Orders before having stock in hand. It's a nice possibility, but not very likely to ever materialize.
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:19 PM #32
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Had a kodachi trigger on my old vice. Oh mah gawd it was nice.
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Old 11-10-2011, 09:42 PM #33
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Picking one up when they are in stock.
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Old 11-15-2011, 01:07 AM #34
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Looks like a techna. doubt it's the same quality though.
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Old 11-15-2011, 07:55 AM #35
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better maybe.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:29 AM #36
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Kind of an apples and oranges comparison. Techna's are finished by hand and each one has a different feel. Of the 15 or so I have, some are clearly better than others but they're well designed/balanced and snappy.

I prefer Rob's triggers for much the same reason that I liked techna triggers in older markers. They're light, well balanced and have a smooth pull and a snappy return off the spring. The sabre design is also comfortable for my fingers and enables me to have a smooth, natural rhythm.

Rob and Jason both use high quality bearings and both sets of triggers are well designed. Long story short, the quality is exceptional. I'm personally excited to get some for my G6R and Victory.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:54 AM #37
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Quote:
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Looks like a techna. doubt it's the same quality though.
NOTHING like a Techna other than the the fact they are of the highest Quality possible. FYI... I was introduced to Bob Long by none other than Ripper Machinist who is unquestionably one of the top 3 Machinists in the history of Paintball and is the man who changed the industry by moving everyone away from the Blocky hunks of alloy with holes machined into them, adorned with Barrels and all sorts of componentry to make them look more like Guns.

Furthermore, I know Jason Watson (owner of Techna) and as the honorable person I am, the approach I took when designing my Triggers is unique to anyone else in the industry. I didn't draw out a shape until AFTER I did many preliminary tests on the human hand, all of which were dedicated players and I took pictures of their hands wielding their Markers in the firing position with a multitude of different setups and markers and then averaged out the positions of the index and middle fingers. From there, I cut High density foam into rough shapes that fit the natural contours of the hand and tested them until the feel was what I felt was just right. Then I had many of those same people hold my Marker with each design and noted their critiques and made adjustments according to how accurate their criticisms reflected on the designs and reworked my ergonomics to accommodate those findings. I then cut new shapes and retested, went back a third time and the final results were set in stone. I then traced the shape precisely on paper at actual size and scanned it and then brought it into Adobe Illustrator and worked my shapes for almost 2 full days to come up with what I felt was correct. Upon supplying Jim with the files, he machined the first prototype for each Trigger which were both poorly executed. From there I realized the pitch was where I went wrong and I redesigned them (again, around the ergonomics), gave jim the new files and the final shapes were done.

From there I knew what issues were among the most common on the MARQ, Vice & Protege and set out to address and remedy them all as best as possible. The solution to most of them was my WRC (Weight Reduction Channel) as that alleviated most of the bouncing issues people were experiencing and form there, I had Jim move the position of the Microswitch Activation Screw to as low as we could possibly go around the design of the Marker and the results were phenomenal.

If you compare any Triggers on the Market to Techna Triggers, the 2 that come closest are my POWER Triggers and Prostar/Violent Triggers.



Are my Triggers Techna's?... No.

Is the Quality of my Triggers on par with Techna?... Absolutely... On every level.


However, it's your right to speculate regardless of how baseless your opinions may be. All I can say is that POWER Triggers were born out of my desire to have a Trigger that, as a Player, I was always looking for but never really found outside of Techna's, and even then, the shapes weren't exactly perfect. Quite close, but not quite. And out of that same experience as a Player, I was all too familiar with what characteristics a Trigger should not have and all that players expect. I feel that is precisely what I delivered. Nothing more, nothing less. Are they for everyone?... I feel I can say with all certainty, nothing is right/perfect for everyone.

In the end, their performance and feel, coupled with their aggressive and aesthetically pleasing designs speak for themselves, and most anyone who has one of my Triggers can attest to their quality as a whole.
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Old 11-15-2011, 10:10 AM #38
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picking up one of each when they are in stock for sure!!!!! (now to decide which colors!!!!)
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Old 11-15-2011, 06:32 PM #39
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What manufacturer takes the time to respond to posts on pbnation?
What manufacturer releases in depth information about how the trigger was designed and the thought process in creating the product?

I might be wrong but I am yet to see someone stand behind their product and release information like the creator of POWER triggers just did. I respect the fact that he did this because i don't see manufacturers taking the time and risk to tell you this much information about their product. I have never used a power product to my knowledge but I can say it is in serious consideration.

With that said stop the flaming and bashing, its useless. He is a manufacturer, you are most likely not. Once the triggers are released and put to the test then feel free to submit your comments. Until then respect this guy and stop driving this sport into the gutter with immature, uneducated, discouraging comments towards people who are only trying to help us the players

Good luck POWER

Edit: Depending on the price and availability, I will most likely try to scrape up extra practice money to put towards the clear kodachi trigger for my g6r. This is the only upgrade I am considering putting into my g6r. The shape seems to be exactly what I have been hoping to find for all these years of playing lol.

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Old 11-15-2011, 10:04 PM #40
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Quote:
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What manufacturer takes the time to respond to posts on pbnation?
What manufacturer releases in depth information about how the trigger was designed and the thought process in creating the product?
hmmm Power pb, Tech PB, Ninja, o wait USA made products
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Old 11-16-2011, 12:40 PM #41
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cool, now make some for ego/geo's and you will be in business
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Old 11-16-2011, 12:58 PM #42
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cool, now make some for ego/geo's and you will be in business
That is the Plan!

I was fortunate enough to have spoken with Jack Wood about me developing my Triggers for his Planet Eclipse Markers and he was gracious enough to send me 2 Raw Triggers (both Styles) for me to start working on them. However, design and modeling are costly steps and in order for me to finance POWER Triggers for PE Markers I have to do so by recouping some of the monies invested in the G6R/VICTORY Triggers.

Trust me, I know how much some of of the PE Faithful have been wanting for, and patiently waiting for me to release my Triggers for their Platform, and I am determined to come through for them. I will announce in PE Forums once the modeling is done which I'm optimistically hoping will be by February 2012. [fingers crossed]
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GEN5/MARQ POWER Series Triggers will be run in VERY LIMITED Quantities! Currently Sold Out but can be run again with 25 Pre-Paid Orders!!!

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