Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-04-2011, 09:52 AM #1
J. Stein
 
J. Stein's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
J. Stein is a Supporting Member
J. Stein is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
J. Stein plays in the PSP
J. Stein donated to help Peyton Trent
Thread of the Week: Statistics

Over at ProPaintball, there has been some discussion about the top players in Dq and Pro and one tangent coming off that conversation is that there are no statistics in paintball.

Some people suggested possible statistics: Winning % while on the field, Kills OTB, Kills to Killed Ratio (actually, those were all suggested by Dave P).

This sort of dovetails with a converation I was having with some people and so I thought this could be an interesting topic.

Let's say Topps Baseball Cards (I assume they are still around) decided to make a paintball player card, and they needed a host of statistics for the card and for their new book, Moneypaintball, what statistics are possible, meaningful and interesting for people.
__________________
Warzone Paintball & Airsoft
1-401-228-6366

Warzone Facebook
www.warzoneri.com

RIP Ronnie
J. Stein is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 11-04-2011, 11:22 AM #2
Seekey
Dave
 
Seekey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Clinton, MA
Seekey plays in the PSP
Seekey plays in the APPA D3 division
Seekey supports Empire
Win % is def the big one in my mind.

Perhaps Runthrus (kinda like the stolen bases of paintball)

Survive the Break %....you could see whos that guy that never gets killed off the break and whos the guy who trys to take too much.

Perhaps you could track bunker moves. Kinda the "total yards" of paintball. Where we dont move down field all the time linear yards isnt really a accurate represnetation. Especially for say a snake player.

All I can think of right now.
__________________
Fotron/Invasion
PSP | NEXL | foxBall
Seekey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2011, 12:35 PM #3
zballer69
R.I.P Philly
 
zballer69's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Pennsylvania
zballer69 owns a Planet Eclipse Ego
zballer69 is an NCPA player
Wasn't the Psp talking about starting to keep track of statistics a few years ago (09ish)? It doesn't seem like they ended up doing anything with it, but it would be a cool thing to see happen.
zballer69 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2011, 12:45 PM #4
sumorai
FRENCHIE
 
sumorai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: New England
Annual Supporting Member
sumorai is a Supporting Member
sumorai plays in the PSP
sumorai is playing at Living Legends VII
sumorai supports our troops
sumorai has perfected Level 5 in PbNation Pursuit
They did for one season, for the Pro teams.

How many people were involved in tracking those stats? That seems like the real problem with doing paintball stats. You'd have to have a lot of people on the field watching the game. Either that, or record it from as many angles as possible and have someone go over the footage later.
__________________
Inception Designs - Clockwork Clothing - NEPb - Destructive Customs

Feedback: Old New - Stuff for sale

I am not a MacDev tech. Please do not PM me about their products. Click here instead
sumorai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2011, 03:06 PM #5
MagicBuss
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: NH
 has been a member for 10 years
I think a few would have some real meaning, be somewhat easy to track, and would be fair measures of players regardless of position:

- Kill : Death Ratio (it doesn't matter if you "die" each game, as long as you take a few bodies with you)
- Survived break (first 20 seconds of game)
- Winning % (what percentage of the time does their team win when the player starts the game)
- total distance moved (they track this in soccer. it would be hard to be exact, but precision isn't necessary. this stat would illustrate mobility and some insight into who the "closers" are)
- Final kills (again meant to highlight the closers, might be hard to track)

There are other possible stats out there, but most of them would be very hard to track.

Jesse
__________________
MagicBuss
Synergy, Sponsored by:
Granite State Paintball
NEXL


PB Nation Feed Back

Last edited by MagicBuss : 11-04-2011 at 03:07 PM. Reason: get rid of smiley face.
MagicBuss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2011, 04:29 PM #6
Shecki
Clockwork Clothing
 
Shecki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: New Hampshire
Annual Supporting Member
Shecki is a Supporting Member
Shecki plays in the PSP
Shecki owns a Planet Eclipse Geo
Shecki owns a Planet Eclipse Lv1
Shecki supports our troops
Shecki plays in the APPA D3 division
Can you really "confirm" a kill though? Some, sure. But I'm sure there'd be a fair amount where you have two players shooting at the same guy/lane. Who's to say who shot who? Not an accurate stat....and if you can't track every kill, then what's the point of tracking any at all really when it isn't accurate.

I liked the axbl's points won and lost stat. It had better meaning on how effective you were on the field.
__________________
Shipyard Ale Paintball

Original Feedback

Clockwork Clothing

For all of your printed apparel needs ! ! !
Shecki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2011, 04:33 PM #7
sumorai
FRENCHIE
 
sumorai's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: New England
Annual Supporting Member
sumorai is a Supporting Member
sumorai plays in the PSP
sumorai is playing at Living Legends VII
sumorai supports our troops
sumorai has perfected Level 5 in PbNation Pursuit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shecki View Post
I liked the axbl's points won and lost stat. It had better meaning on how effective you were on the field.
I agree. That was easy to track (refs called in each players number to the score tower at the start of each point), and a meaningful stat.
__________________
Inception Designs - Clockwork Clothing - NEPb - Destructive Customs

Feedback: Old New - Stuff for sale

I am not a MacDev tech. Please do not PM me about their products. Click here instead
sumorai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2011, 01:29 PM #8
brawnpb
 
 
brawnpb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Spring,TX
brawnpb plays in the APPA D4 division
I'd like to see:
- a track of points played over the year.
- on field win %
- flag hangs
- confirmed kills/death ratio
- confirmed 1 v 1 wins/losses
- average of time alive

Now for a team I'd like to see:
- team kills/deaths ratio
- flag hangs
- points conceded
- win/loss record and win%
- average time per point
- deaths otb (20 seconds)
- kills otb (20 seconds)
- average bodies alive per point won
- win/loss man up vs man down
- win/loss 2 man down
- successful penalties killed off (time expired and player returned to the field)
__________________
Houston Horde
brawnpb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2011, 02:06 PM #9
JJRoth
 
JJRoth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: CANADA
JJRoth is a Professional paintball player
CXBL tracks stats.
games played
flag hangs
points for
points against
+/-
penalty minutes
JJRoth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2011, 03:10 PM #10
brawnpb
 
 
brawnpb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Spring,TX
brawnpb plays in the APPA D4 division
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJRoth
CXBL tracks stats.
games played
flag hangs
points for
points against
+/-
penalty minutes
I know. I always thought that was cool. Just wished they expanded on it
__________________
Houston Horde
brawnpb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-05-2011, 11:22 PM #11
EMSGuy24
no
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
EMSGuy24 plays in the PSP
EMSGuy24 plays in the APPA D4 division
Why do we need stats in paintball? I have been one that never thought that individual stats are important or needed... I know people like to see it cause it makes them feel good, but I have seen it make people think they are better than the team.

But to go with this, does anyone feel team stats are lacking... I would like to know team avg wins v loss. Avg time of win. Boddies alive avg stuff like that?

I also think there are jobs in paintball that are big that there is no stats for.. Some people just lane the **** out of a game that allows the rest of the team move up and win a match.. Yes he will get kills but the job he does is huge for his team...

Last edited by EMSGuy24 : 11-06-2011 at 06:53 AM.
EMSGuy24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2011, 08:52 AM #12
ShadowFiend
pH Squared Clothing
 
ShadowFiend's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Vermont
 has been a member for 10 years
ShadowFiend plays in the APPA D5 division
We need stats to be a real sport IMO. What sport out there has no stats? There are people who watch sports for the stats and numbers.

Some good stats I feel could help are:

Total Games played - Easy enough
Kills - Done with .5 or some form of assist for players who may have been shot but multiple persons.
Deaths - Easy enough, call "killed" number to stat trackers.
Kills OTB - Discussed
Penalties for individuals - # of and time served (could get tricky I suppose with minors when losing the point)
Total team penalties - Again number of, time served, and maybe number of PP wins/losses

Just ideas. Who reads these, who knows, but maybe they will garner a few ideas from the collective sooner or later.
__________________
Play for fun or don't play at all.

Practice Hard, Play Harder
pH Squared Clothing
ShadowFiend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2011, 01:32 PM #13
EMSGuy24
no
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
EMSGuy24 plays in the PSP
EMSGuy24 plays in the APPA D4 division
Stats do not make you a sport. Athletes and competition make you a real sport. Statistics where created by non athletes so that they could have something to talk about.

Let's be honest who is going to sit at the field and talk about JRabs bunkering rate or Ollie's major penalty rate... We don't do that we talk about the match the moves the game it's self.
EMSGuy24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-06-2011, 02:35 PM #14
ShadowFiend
pH Squared Clothing
 
ShadowFiend's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Vermont
 has been a member for 10 years
ShadowFiend plays in the APPA D5 division
Well I'd imagine a good team or even a mediocre team could use some of the stats against whichever team. So no while you might not be talking about jrabs bunker rate or Ollie's run through whatever, there will be teams that use those stats to their advantage. If you knew one of their guys had 35 snake kills on the season I'd imagine your laners are focusing on said individual OTB. If you know a team has a horrible OTB kills percentage you might push harder up the field early, likewise if they are 65% shooting OTB you may not be pushing very hard at all. Stats can tell you a lot about a team before you even meet up with them. Then again this is paintball a sport of inconsistencies.

I'm not trying to bicker back and forth, just present my point, but honestly if you can name me a sport without traceable stats I'll tell you about something I would never watch on TV.
__________________
Play for fun or don't play at all.

Practice Hard, Play Harder
pH Squared Clothing
ShadowFiend is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2011, 01:11 AM #15
shock2k3
get hostile
 
shock2k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: NH
shock2k3 is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
shock2k3 plays in the APPA D4 division
I wanna know how fast the pros shoot in semi just to piss reahl off!

Just kidding but seriously, although we lack the people to track stats and the cameras to legitimately enforce some stats like k/d ratio, some simple stats would be great.

how many were laned otb
who was laned out
something like a player yardage per game and otb distance
maybe how much paint teams shoot
penaltys per team and per person


With this you could look and say team X cheated alot but still had good turnout or team A took alot of ground but didnt do **** with it.

Knowing things like how much paint over say a year would be good to get a roundabout number that winning teams are using. You could see how format changes are effecting paint usage and what winning teams do under these changes.

The list of things you could 'assume' from these stats is infinite and mostly useless but creating a buzz in paintball is always a good thing.
__________________
Old feedback
shock2k3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2011, 04:36 PM #16
MagicBuss
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: NH
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shecki View Post
Can you really "confirm" a kill though? Some, sure. But I'm sure there'd be a fair amount where you have two players shooting at the same guy/lane. Who's to say who shot who? Not an accurate stat....and if you can't track every kill, then what's the point of tracking any at all really when it isn't accurate.
Good point...quick fix - give out .5 kills when its "uncomfirmable" like football gives out .5 sacks and tackles.

Jesse
__________________
MagicBuss
Synergy, Sponsored by:
Granite State Paintball
NEXL


PB Nation Feed Back
MagicBuss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2011, 04:47 PM #17
raehl
NCPA President
 
raehl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Chippewa Falls, WI
Annual Supporting Member
raehl is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
raehl plays in the PSP
raehl supports our troops
raehl is an NCPA National Champion
raehl plays in the APPA D5 division
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMSGuy24 View Post
Stats do not make you a sport. Athletes and competition make you a real sport. Statistics where created by non athletes so that they could have something to talk about.
Maybe, but it's those non-athletes who tune in who drive the advertising dollars.

And it's the advertising dollars that get people paid.

So, you don't need stats, as long as you don't mind never getting past being a poor paintball player.

- Chris
__________________
Check Out Paintball on TV!

National Collegiate Paintball Association, President - http://www.ncpapaintball.com

American Paintball Players Association - www.paintball-players.org
raehl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2011, 05:58 PM #18
4x4 rider
Armageddon 2013
 
4x4 rider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Lakeville, MA
 has been a member for 10 years
4x4 rider plays in the PSP
4x4 rider plays in the APPA D3 division
If there could be a feasible way to keep the stats I think that would improve the viewablility <---i dont think thats a word, I would infact talk about peoples stats while they are playing. And yes, that would help the sport grow greatly, thus being why someone came up with stats in every other sport and made fantasy leagues possible

Plus if there were stats, you could identify who the key players on the opposing team were and it would help to create a game plan against other teams.
__________________
Josh DeYoung #01
NEAA 2014


NEAA-2011 foXball Champs!

Aftermath fan club member #80
UpTon 187 cRew fan club member #15

Last edited by 4x4 rider : 11-10-2011 at 06:00 PM.
4x4 rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2011, 07:37 PM #19
EMSGuy24
no
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
EMSGuy24 plays in the PSP
EMSGuy24 plays in the APPA D4 division
Chris

I think for NCPA and your broadcast on fox sports it's would be great for the non player. If nppl or psp ever got a mainstream television program it would be great for the non player. I know for myself player stats are not going to change how play or get ready for a team. I guess in a way I do, do a form of stats, cause I look at how they break out and where they tend to go to more also how they play when the are up bodies or down bodies... I look more at the team as a whole then certain players... But hey that's me...
EMSGuy24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2011, 12:22 AM #20
Seekey
Dave
 
Seekey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Clinton, MA
Seekey plays in the PSP
Seekey plays in the APPA D3 division
Seekey supports Empire
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMSGuy24 View Post
Chris

I think for NCPA and your broadcast on fox sports it's would be great for the non player. If nppl or psp ever got a mainstream television program it would be great for the non player. I know for myself player stats are not going to change how play or get ready for a team. I guess in a way I do, do a form of stats, cause I look at how they break out and where they tend to go to more also how they play when the are up bodies or down bodies... I look more at the team as a whole then certain players... But hey that's me...
Your only watching a half dozen games.....stats would give you a season of breaks to get a much more reliable trend.

Stats would benefit everybody except the people who don't use them.

How much would it realistically cost to track stats for a year. Personnel to watch and record and the database to hold the information?
__________________
Fotron/Invasion
PSP | NEXL | foxBall
Seekey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2011, 12:28 AM #21
ShadowFiend
pH Squared Clothing
 
ShadowFiend's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Vermont
 has been a member for 10 years
ShadowFiend plays in the APPA D5 division
I'll ldo it for free paint...
__________________
Play for fun or don't play at all.

Practice Hard, Play Harder
pH Squared Clothing
ShadowFiend is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
Forum Jump