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Old 07-05-2011, 05:24 PM #1
ctpaintballa42
 
 
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PSP/NPPL Merger

http://www.propaintball.com/2011/07/...league-merger/ For those of you who haven't read it. Please feel free to delete Jeff if I am just being a dead horse, as I know these threads seem to pop up every year or so, but this is the first time there is actual leverage in the industry to push for one national league.

Ive been pushing for one national league for years, anytime they have come up for discussion, my belief is that one national format will not only be better for the industry, but teams and players (especially divisional) who have been hurting the past few years. Also the cost to the industry (paint) will drop tremendously with much less events to travel to, so I see this as money companies can invest into sponsorships and marketing. It is my believe that this needs to happen on the national level soon, or tournament paintball will continue to decline rather than grow.

Jeff/Dave/whoever- Obviously you guys would stick to Xball if both leagues were around next year, but if not:
1.) Do you believe this is good for tournament paintball or paintball in general?
2.) Will this help to expose paintball further, one unified league with a single format (or few similiar ones, race to 5 man etc)?
3.) Will sponsorships get better/offered to more teams if this were to occur?
4.) Does the industry (more paint companies) have the leverage or will to unify the PSP/NPPL?
5.) What would be your ideal format, or variation of formats?

Obviously I know Propaintball is not a very reliable source when it comes to rumors and such, but I figured this would make for an interesting topic.
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Old 07-05-2011, 05:53 PM #2
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Why not continue with both styles of PB at one event. It will attract spectators of both, increase the spectators and cut the cost of vendors and sponsors which would eventually reduce the cost's of the sponsors.
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Old 07-05-2011, 06:04 PM #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctpaintballa42 View Post
http://www.propaintball.com/2011/07/...league-merger/ For those of you who haven't read it. Please feel free to delete Jeff if I am just being a dead horse, as I know these threads seem to pop up every year or so, but this is the first time there is actual leverage in the industry to push for one national league.
Jeff: Well, there’s been industry push for one league before, but the industry ultimately decided not to push too hard, lest taking a stand alienated some piece of their customer base. And, to be fair, I’m not sure there is ‘actual leverage’ or any increased ‘industry push[ing]” now.

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… my belief is that one national format will not only be better for the industry, but teams and players (especially divisional) who have been hurting the past few years. Also the cost to the industry (paint) will drop tremendously with much less events to travel to, so I see this as money companies can invest into sponsorships and marketing….
Jeff: The cost to the industry is not paint so much as it is the actual cost of attending events. Driving the DYE truck across country costs money. Sending your sales staff out to man the truck at events costs money. That’s the cost to the industry. And when you start off marginalizing your return by splitting your potential customer base in half, it is nonsensical.

And the money saved is very unlikely to be invested into sponsorship (although, maybe marketing). I think this is another cost-saving move for the industry, much as the drastic decrease in sponsorship was a cost-saving measure. This won’t open up any purses for teams.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ctpaintballa42 View Post
1.) Do you believe this is good for tournament paintball or paintball in general?
2.) Will this help to expose paintball further, one unified league with a single format (or few similiar ones, race to 5 man etc)?
3.) Will sponsorships get better/offered to more teams if this were to occur?
4.) Does the industry (more paint companies) have the leverage or will to unify the PSP/NPPL?
5.) What would be your ideal format, or variation of formats?
Jeff:
1. It depends on how it happens. I think it could be very good for the sport.
2. No. We lack the numbers to garner more exposure through the channel of ‘national events’.
3. No. Maybe even less sponsorship, because now half the teams can give all the necessary representation.
4. Leverage; yes, if they acted collectively. Will; no. And they are very unlikely to act collectively.
5. Raceto. Uncapped semi (i.e. “cheater mode”). Coaching on snake side as it is today.
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Old 07-05-2011, 07:14 PM #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctpaintballa42 View Post
Jeff/Dave/whoever- Obviously you guys would stick to Xball if both leagues were around next year, but if not:
1.) Do you believe this is good for tournament paintball or paintball in general?
2.) Will this help to expose paintball further, one unified league with a single format (or few similiar ones, race to 5 man etc)?
3.) Will sponsorships get better/offered to more teams if this were to occur?
4.) Does the industry (more paint companies) have the leverage or will to unify the PSP/NPPL?
5.) What would be your ideal format, or variation of formats?
Here's my quick answer:
1 - Yes - I believe a merger would be good for paintball (locally) and tournament paintball (nationally). A larger "Show" will help attract more customers (both in the form of teams and spectators).

2 - No - Paintball is a sport played with a gun where you shoot your opponents - tough to get the positive publicity we need.

3 – Yes – sponsorship to some teams will get better. The industry currently sponsors 26 pro teams – ok – some of those are the same team playing in both leagues. In a merged world maybe that number is down to 14 or 16 total teams. It would stand to reason that there might be additional funds available for the top of the stack (pro teams). However, I think divisional teams will continue to get what they get or less. Most of the divisional support actually comes through stores and fields – or their connection to vendors. I don’t see why this would change, but the industry as a whole would save some money. Take paint for instance – let’s say KEE supplies paint to 10 teams in each league (for free). Now they only have to supply 15 teams in one league free paint and they save a little while still covering the same amount of teams (I’m assuming some overlap in teams from both leagues). Do they turn around and give out more paint to more teams – most likely not – they improve their bottom line.

4 – I agree 100% with Jeff’s answer – they have the leverage but not the will to use it as one voice. Meaning KEE might say I’m not sponsoring your events any more (pick your league) but as soon as GI Sportz says they’ll supply paint to that league what do you think KEE will do?

5 – Pretty much what we already have in the PSP – A Race-To format with no pit side/d-side coaching and allow spectator participation. However, I wouldn’t mind seeing them push the sidelines back further so the spectator participation was really just that – spectators – not coaches.
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Old 07-05-2011, 07:35 PM #5
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I think paint companies will pick a league.
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Old 07-05-2011, 07:36 PM #6
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Also this may be the view of only one company. Remember this website once said 187 crew was going to be playing pro in the nppl this year…
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Old 07-05-2011, 10:14 PM #7
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No one listen's to the spectator!!!!! HHHMMmmmmm!!!!!!!
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:06 AM #8
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why cant they merge and offer a combo of both formats, obviously the pro division will have to decide but there can be room for both formats to an extant
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Old 07-06-2011, 11:22 AM #9
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Bring back d side coaching and the smaller field dimensions. Watching games this year is like watching paint dry
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Old 07-06-2011, 04:41 PM #10
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This is something I have been thinking about since last year... We have these feeder leages, we want to help grow paintball.. Why not truely make this regional.. where you win the feeder league and from there the top 4 from each feeder goes and plays World Cup for PSP Vegas for NPPL. This allows for your local fields to build a following. This saves teams money and company's money.. Ok so I might have holes and not all the details figured out but I think we can work a system where teams earn the rights to go to cup and vegas. Bring top teams back to the local level and build up paintball..
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Old 07-06-2011, 04:50 PM #11
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Who's gonna ref?

If 187 is reffing the FoXball series and NEH the NEXL and those are the two regional leagues, does that mean that we each have 1/2 the chance of advancing? Or what if only one league is the feeder, who will want to ref it?
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Old 07-06-2011, 05:24 PM #12
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I really nead to sit down and break it down.. It was an idea I had that I never really broke down.. I have always thought you take the top 2 from each region/feeder who ever... I also feel it should be an overal champ. 4 events then the 5th be cup or vegas... Reffs there should be a regional pool of them so there is no obligation to one team...
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Old 07-06-2011, 07:24 PM #13
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Kinda sounds like the NCPA but any team can go to our cup.
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Old 07-06-2011, 07:53 PM #14
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Quote:
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Kinda sounds like the NCPA but any team can go to our cup.
Agreed. World cup should only be the top x% of the teams qualifying.
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:02 PM #15
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Thats the Idea to make a true championship.. Teams are complaining about cost. Companies complaining about cost.. So why cant we create a national program where teams fight it out in there local area for the chance to world cup.. Then with that You can have the pros go to 4 events and move that around the regional areas.
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:33 PM #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMSGuy24 View Post
Thats the Idea to make a true championship.. Teams are complaining about cost. Companies complaining about cost.. So why cant we create a national program where teams fight it out in there local area for the chance to world cup.. Then with that You can have the pros go to 4 events and move that around the regional areas.
Because the leagues are a business. Divisional players are the customers. More teams = more revenue. Limiting that will have to mean that a lot of teams will need to qualify in order for there to be justification to hold the event with regard to overall cost associated with running a national level event.
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Old 07-06-2011, 08:41 PM #17
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Actually you will be bringing more teams to local fields because they wont be traveling to National events. So more teams there.. Then for cup you will have the team that have auto invites to cup.. then from there you have open slots for other teams, but it will be based on there ranking in there region. Now for making money.. Vendors will be all over this. 1 major event they will break out the big guns. Now TV markenting, You are now able to promote a true world championship. All Divisions. You are not trying to hold down tv for 4 -5 events but just 1. All the top teams from around the world are here...
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Old 07-07-2011, 10:33 AM #18
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Cups the biggest event for the PSP and you guys are talking about limiting the people who can enter?...Thats crazy. The Pro division is the only one you should worry about true world champs and they are already there.

If the PSP is only a traveling circus only for the PROs theres no possible way it could be profitable. You need divisional teams at the events to keep the thing floating. Theyve been saying for a while now that the Pro division is a money sink.

Merger would be good for us because it would put all the teams in one basket and allow more marketing and potentially outside sponsorship. Companys like Intel may show interest again if they see a venue full of FPS hungry paintball players. However with 2 less than stelar events I can see where they wouldn't be tickled.

Bottom line is more focus on 4 events a year rather than splitting focus on 8. However It could probably be run with only one set of staff so your talking about people losing jobs.

Im for it.
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Old 07-07-2011, 10:37 PM #19
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Am I totally misguided here because I seem to remember the PSP and NPPL used to be one event series? I don't see any solutions in a merger. What I see is these two national series consolidating in a weak economy to prevent extinction. I doubt much will change if they do merge. Divisions will be reorganized, sponsors will be solicited, and things will get back to normal quickly. These national series are for profit. Jus sayin.
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Old 08-01-2011, 09:44 PM #20
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I think this merger is a great idea for the sport that would bring more money to the sport and less headache bigger reigonal events . I say they do a vote between all the fields that host a event and the teams and make a player commitee.
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Old 08-03-2011, 05:04 PM #21
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The tried limiting the amount of pro teams at cup before.. and it basically killed a franchise team.
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