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Old 07-28-2011, 09:53 PM #1
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House rep Luis Gutierrez arrested

http://www.mrctv.org/videos/rep-guti...de-white-house

"On July 26, 2011, Rep. Luis Gutierrez (D-Illinois) was arrested outside of the White House after refusing to move when asked by authorities.Gutierrez, who sat in front of a sign that read "Stop Separating Our Families" with a line of protesters, refused to leave when asked by the police. Gutierrez was in attendance at a rally urging President Obama to do more to stop the deportation of illegal immigrants.MRCTV caught up with Gutierrez before he was arrested in which he said, "I think (President Obama) should use the broad discretionary power that the laws have conferred upon him and make decisions, smart decisions" in regards to deportation. The arrest occurred around 4:40 pm"

While he makes a few valid points, he also is fully encouraging people to come here illegally and indirectly take no action to controlling our southern border if he defends illegal aliens. How often do Congressional members get arrested for "minor" **** like this? This is the stuff High School students get cuffed & stuffed for.

I wonder if he was a Senator, if he would get more favorable treatment. Senators seem to, due to being in office longer, be more revered. Congressional members get tied up in controversy, sex scandels, and misc things like that, not this.
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Old 07-28-2011, 10:13 PM #2
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"...he also is fully encouraging people to come here illegally and indirectly take no action to controlling our southern border if he defends illegal aliens."


I must have missed that part in the story.
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Old 07-28-2011, 10:32 PM #3
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He doesn't want people separated. He wants them to remain. He's defending people being here illegally. Nowhere did he state 'they shuld not be coming here illegally" because it's not an issue with him.

Seems he's been arrested for this before too. What a guy.
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Old 07-28-2011, 10:42 PM #4
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I'm okay with it.

Yeah, yeah "you're not an American" and all that.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:10 PM #5
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I'm okay with it.

Yeah, yeah "you're not an American" and all that.
You're American, just ignorant, misguided, and blinded by liberal and statist propaganda.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:12 PM #6
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Yeah, that's it.

Just listen to yourself. You have Rush's response bookmarked. Why would a statist promote more open borders?
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:18 PM #7
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Yeah, that's it.
Since you openly "don't have a problem with" people breaking the law its going to be pretty hard for you to say you have a sound understanding a respect for a civil, law based society. So instead you post dodgy faces etc. Thinking it will somehow justify your childish, simplistic views.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:27 PM #8
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And you just pull out Rush's rhetoric, revert to ad hom, and post nothing worthy of discussion.

Protip: calling someone's views childish and simplistic doesn't discredit them. You can call anything childish and simplistic, doesn't make it true or invalidate anything.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:32 PM #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swerve22 View Post
Since you openly "don't have a problem with" people breaking the law its going to be pretty hard for you to say you have a sound understanding a respect for a civil, law based society. So instead you post dodgy faces etc. Thinking it will somehow justify your childish, simplistic views.
So umami's a statist while you're the one arguing about how immaculate the law they're breaking is.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:34 PM #10
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I guess you missed the part where I explained exactly why your views ate childish and simplistic, bit why let actual debate and substance derail your strawman/rush limbaugh name drop strategy, right? Because of anybody has respect for the rule flaw and a civil society, it could only possibly be because zomg rush limbaugh brainwashed them and told them to, right?
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:35 PM #11
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:49 PM #12
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I have little respect for a rule of law that imprisons more people than nearly any other society in the world. I suppose we should congratulate ourselves for having an incarceration rate that's only slightly lower than that of post WWII USSR. Anyone that advocates unquestioningly following said laws is a true statist. The congressman here is excercizing his right to free speech, and advocating that we question our boarder policies. I have no problem with that, and agree that it must be re-examined.

Not that I'm conceding anything here, but if my views are childish and simplistic, please explain to us how building a wall isn't.
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Old 07-28-2011, 11:52 PM #13
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public execution is the only answer for this anti-american scum

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Old 07-28-2011, 11:57 PM #14
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statist
You're really trying for a troll job, aren't ya. Let me educate you on the subject. Those that understand the idea of a constitutional republic and a civil society also understand the importance that respect and obedience to the rule of law play in the preservation of that society. There is a specific balance between the two ends of the political spectrum that supporters of the civil and free society seek to strike. One end is this spectrum is anarchy, where law us nonexistent, ineffectual, or ignored and the other is statism, which tales many forms including communism, racism, and totalitarianism but generally represents any system where government power is elevated above the liberty and rights of its constituents. Those that hold statist beliefs are those that look to the state as a means to create or modify a society in order to fit their vision of how it should be, to the point of denying the constitutionally guaranteed rights of the society. Umami has showcase many of these views on this forum and to my knowledge is also supportive of the political ideas of the ultimate statist, barack obama. Statism has nothing to do with border security, which is a necessary aspect of any civil society. However what is truly interesting is that tyrannical and oppressive statist regimes often arise from the ashes of anarchy, chaos, and revolution "in the name of the people". So by Umami's act of supporting lawlessness he is also directly supporting the kind of conditions under which statist agendas are most likely to be carried out. That's the cold hard truth right there in a nutshell for you, do with it what you will.

Also if there's a bunch of spelling storage in here just ignore them, I'm posting from my phone.
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Old 07-29-2011, 12:17 AM #15
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I have little respect for a rule of law that imprisons more people than nearly any other society in the world. I suppose we should congratulate ourselves for having an incarceration rate that's only slightly lower than that of post WWII USSR. Anyone that advocates unquestioningly following said laws is a true statist. The congressman here is excercizing his right to free speech, and advocating that we question our boarder policies. I have no problem with that, and agree that it must be re-examined.

Not that I'm conceding anything here, but if my views are childish and simplistic, please explain to us how building a wall isn't.
I would agree the process needs to be re-examined. And we do put too many people in prison. A lot of them are for drugs, yes. Some are also illegally here, and if someone mentions the drug folks in jail, I'd also bring up the illegals. Now, I'm not sure people need to be in jail for having done coke before or smoked weed and had a joint here and there, but if someone is shipping a truckload of blow into the country, then yeah, toss the ****er(s) in jail for a while.

In order to best answer our overflowing prison issue, one would have to have a large, thorough list of what offenses are landing Americans (and illegals I guess) in jail, and see if any of those offenses is permissible and passable to a fine or community service. With so much cultural and religious diversity here, we're more prone to having people be in jail in the first place. I think that is a large part of the problem. I'm just not big letting people run amuk who are a detriment to society.

As far as Luis here goes, he's championing immigrants part as his belief, and part as his appeal and to keep getting elected I imagine. He can claim he stands up for immigrants all he wants I suppose. I would rather just look at people legally here as "citizens" and not give a **** where they immigrated from as long as they A) Learn English and B) Be loyal to America which is that same ol argument people have used with me before being "Hitler like" and a "Nationalist" but I'm sticking by that. If I'm viewed as a Nationalist, then **** it I could care less. I do after all, cite Theodore Roosevelt as my favorite president, (and one of the three best ever) so shouldn't be surprises on that. I'm more of a "Bill Bennett" guy (http://www.billbennett.com/) than a Rush Limbaugh one.

Not sure how building a wall is "childish" Umami, but that's more an argument with you and Swerve.
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Old 07-29-2011, 12:21 AM #16
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And before the "less criminals if we legalize pot" argument rears

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?p...Uc0k4&refer=us

But it's not really what I am discussing, just anticipating a possible reply. This would be a great thread if someone wants to discuss this further. It just happened via answering about people and jail.

Rep Gutierrez going to jail multiple times is a bit strange for a Congressional member. I wonder what the record is?
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Old 07-29-2011, 12:25 AM #17
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I don't think going to jail for promoting your campaign issues really matters in the eyes of your constituents.
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Old 07-29-2011, 01:39 AM #18
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Circular logic is strong with this thread.
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Old 07-30-2011, 11:35 AM #19
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i think i read something similar to this thread in politics about a week ago.
and the week before that,
and the week before that,
and the week before that, etc.

just let it go tuff, just let it go
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Old 07-30-2011, 02:01 PM #20
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IS

You're American, just ignorant, misguided, and blinded by liberal and statist propaganda.
Ironic.
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Old 07-30-2011, 04:15 PM #21
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Ironic.
No, not really.
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