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Old 05-23-2011, 09:31 PM #1
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Thread of the Week: What do you want most...

out of a tournament.

Word on the internet is that the reffing at the Chicago NPPL event left something to be desired. I'm not saying that was the case or wasn't; i wasnt there & don't know. But that's what people are saying.

And that got me to thinking about something Lane once asked me (when the 'Canes were an NPPL team), "These guys [the NPPL] have a lot of flash, they spend $300,000 a year on promotions. I don't have that much to spend on promotions, I can't do what they do. BUT, I do spend $300,000 on reffing and these guys only spend one third that. So what matters more to you, a good tournament or playing in an NFL parking lot?"

So... what matters most to you, for events (and for series, and it could well be different)? Good reffing? Good prizes? The format you prefer? Cost? Competition?
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Old 05-23-2011, 10:22 PM #2
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1. A format I enjoy playing
I'm playing because it's something I enjoy, so the primary concern for me is playing a format that I actually like playing.

2. Quality paint
3. Quality reffing
There are many factors involved in success at paintball tournaments. I'll take responsibility for the factors I can control. The people running the tournament should take responsibility for the factors they control. Paint and reffing are the two main ones. Crappy paint / reffing make a major impact on a team's success.
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Old 05-24-2011, 07:27 AM #3
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1) Quality reffing
2) The format I prefer (xball)
3) A league managed by professionals (NPPL?)
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Old 05-24-2011, 08:47 AM #4
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1. Good Paint Paint
1. Quality Reffing.

Personally I like any format, or if. And honestly the day sucks if either of thoes are lacking.
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Old 05-24-2011, 08:58 AM #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox4paintball View Post
1) Quality reffing
2) The format I prefer (xball)
3) A league managed by professionals (NPPL?)
Dave, are you saying that the NPPL has a leg up on the PSP for item #3?
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Old 05-24-2011, 10:12 AM #6
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Yes - I don't believe in the PSP management - Not very business like in my opinion.

Have you watched the on-line interviews?
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Old 05-24-2011, 11:10 AM #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fox4paintball View Post
1) Quality reffing
2) The format I prefer (xball)
3) A league managed by professionals (NPPL?)
I agree with Dave,but I dont really care about the format. Its ever changing. im sure next season there will be something new to throw into things.
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Old 05-24-2011, 11:36 AM #8
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1. good refs
2. good paint (problem i had at nepl e2 2010, that was a travesty)

Last edited by marzipanHH : 05-24-2011 at 11:39 AM.
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Old 05-24-2011, 11:47 AM #9
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To be clear - my desire around a format is something that allows the better team to win a large majority of the time. A bad call or one bad play should not necessarily doom you to lose.

Maybe something like Gridfighters is the answer...I just know that I left the NPPL for two reasons - first, it looked like they weren't going to make it and second, the refs seemed to affect the outcome more often then not. In the PSP the better team might lose a point due to a call (good or bad) but if they can't overcome that to win more points then the other team then they most likley didn't deserve to win.
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Old 05-24-2011, 12:02 PM #10
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1) Good paint
2) Good reffing - or atleast consistent for all teams
3) Organized pits/staging area - sometimes I feel like that part goes overlooked
4) Working air - having the air go down in your pit is annoying
5) Format I enjoy playing - Right now that is "race-to". I agree with Dave, a format where the better team will usually win is more enjoyable. Also I don't care what format they come up with in the future or what changes they make, just keep it fun.
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Old 05-24-2011, 12:11 PM #11
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call me greedy but for the money you spend to play you should get it all.
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Old 05-24-2011, 05:54 PM #12
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1. Good reffing
2. Consistent format in all of tournament paintball (possibly just one national league with a ton of tournaments throughout every region).
3. Great prizes
4. Proffessional Staff on the field and off (not just the refs, but the behind the scene guys such as score keepers, owners, etc.)
5. Good paint at a good price (paint is last on my list because my motto is if it doesn't shoot good, get even closer to them.
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Old 05-24-2011, 06:17 PM #13
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1: Good reffing
2: Good Location (Ie: Field that is maintained, Space in the pits, Area for vendors, good area for spectators)
3: Well orginized event.
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Old 05-24-2011, 06:30 PM #14
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1. Good paint
2. Quality, unbiased, seasoned refs
The format: 50 min matches ideally but if I had to choose from what's available I would say PSP. The NPPL is looking more appealing though, due to the chance of an actual return for placing.
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Old 05-24-2011, 06:48 PM #15
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A progression system that requires a player to work to get to upper levels.
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Old 05-25-2011, 07:13 AM #16
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Format, paint, then reffing
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Old 05-25-2011, 07:38 AM #17
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1. good reffing and good staff- easy to deal with, unbiased, run a smooth show
2. good paint- consistency is the key. not one day good paint, next day not.
3. good prizes- if your paying 2+ grand in entry alone, a good chunk of change back would be nice. especially considering the cost of other factors when your traveling to nationals. locals within 5 hrs isn't too bad however.
4. venue- ill play anywhere, but when it comes down to a lot of money, good grass or turf and a good surrounding area (hotels, night life, etc)
5. format- honestly i love both 7 man and xball. i would rather play xball because like dave says, the better team wins, you wont get fluke calls/bad calls that could cost you making it to sunday.
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Old 05-25-2011, 09:49 AM #18
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Quote:
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NPPL is looking more appealing though, due to the chance of an actual return for placing.
Considering prizes when picking a league to play is just plain silly.

For starters, overall, NPPL doesn't even have better prizes than PSP.

Comparing Chicago Opens, NPPL prizes are only significantly better than PSP prizes for D2, and a little bit in D3. Overall, PSP's prize package is higher than NPPL's, not even counting the Pro prizes.

Hell, in NPPL D1 or D4, winning Chicago didn't even get your entry fee back. PSP at least gives every winner an entry fee.



Also, even in the BEST of circumstances, the biggest return a player gets in prize money for WINNING is about $200, assuming winning also gets you fee paint and you have NO travel costs. So even in the best case scenario, you're not going to leave a paintball tournament with more money than if you just had not played at all.


If you're playing Pump, PSP has better prizes. If you're playing 5-man, PSP has better prizes. If you're playing 7-man or RaceTo-4/5, even if you pick the league that has the better prize package for your division, your "expected value" out of that better prize package is less than $20. It's not likely that that $20 in prize value outweighs any other factor when choosing where to play.


Hell, if you're REALLY concerned about having the most money left over when playing, just play the events closest to you. (And for 95% of teams, location is the #1 consideration.)


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Old 05-25-2011, 10:12 AM #19
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Quote:
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Yes - I don't believe in the PSP management - Not very business like in my opinion.

Have you watched the on-line interviews?
haha I think a few people in this video work or run parts of the NPPL. I am not saying play or do not play PSP or NPPL as I could care less as both seem like they we be around for some time.
I think both leagues could use a little work but thats just me. I must say that the event we were just at in Germany was very well run maybe I can find some on-line videos of those people for you to watch also lol.

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Old 05-25-2011, 01:00 PM #20
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Ref's are not often "perfect".. Chicago ref's were not all verry seasoned or maybe off there game a little since the damn nets were the boundary on field 2 so they were basically lined up as targets down the tape line. Some of the regular guys that were there did well as usual but (not that I counted) I think their was less ref's (Six? Another coach had said six but idk). Kinda makes me think they just wanted to save some money on this event considering they have to fund another HB tourney just for the pro's in a couple months or so.
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Old 05-25-2011, 01:27 PM #21
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Quote:
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Ref's are not often "perfect".. Chicago ref's were not all verry seasoned or maybe off there game a little since the damn nets were the boundary on field 2 so they were basically lined up as targets down the tape line. Some of the regular guys that were there did well as usual but (not that I counted) I think their was less ref's (Six? Another coach had said six but idk). Kinda makes me think they just wanted to save some money on this event considering they have to fund another HB tourney just for the pro's in a couple months or so.
It is very hard to find 6 to 10 reff's that really care and can do a good job for the pay they get. I am glad we are able to have our team reff and that we do not have to go out and try to hire reff's I can not see that being a fun thing.
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