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Old 08-22-2011, 10:49 PM #1
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MWXL 3 and all the confusion that happened.

ok so now that tempers have cooled and everything is done and over with i would like some more explanation as to what the hell happened. Im not *****ing or saying anything i would just like some answers to questions that were brought up and after everyone had time to figure out what happened.

to start off with. For quarter finals dont the top 2 teams out of each group of 4 move on? so theoretically it is a 50/50 shot of you getting into finals? then that would mean pekin paintball team should have moved on. they were in our bracket and lost only to us. so that would of meant that they would have moved on along with us.

if im mistake then im sorry but i thought that is how everything has gone in the past. and even if that is not the case, since i see that both chi-town fury and chi-town fury gold moved on when they were both in the same bracket. why did LSD move on and not pekin. they were higher rank and better record. just trying to figure what was going on.

now this brings me to the quarter final games moving to semi finals. The games between endemic and Cpx all stars. according to the scores posted on APPA we (endemic) had 3:12 as the time and Cpx had 3:18. NOW according to what nick said was that the stop watch counted up to 5 minutes. so that would meant that we (endemic) won the game in less time than CPX and therefore should have moved on but didnt. It needs to be figured out how the stop watch was taking time and what time nick was writing down was what was left on the clock or the game time.

This also brings up the fact that things need to be figured out before the teams are told. the decision was told to the teams about 4 times....... that is ridiculous that it kept changing. Yes the teams hovering around asking questions and bugging people for answers and i am sorry about that. but it still should not have been that difficult to determine who was moving on and who wasn't.
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Old 08-22-2011, 11:32 PM #2
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The clock runs down from 5 min. So we ended up beating endemic by 6 seconds. Nick had it on the rule sheet and showed us the clock which was set at 5:00. But I am also curious how some of the seeding worked if someone could shed some light that would be great.
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Old 08-22-2011, 11:39 PM #3
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Originally Posted by rjtjr View Post

now this brings me to the quarter final games moving to semi finals. The games between endemic and Cpx all stars. according to the scores posted on APPA we (endemic) had 3:12 as the time and Cpx had 3:18. NOW according to what nick said was that the stop watch counted up to 5 minutes. so that would meant that we (endemic) won the game in less time than CPX and therefore should have moved on but didnt. It needs to be figured out how the stop watch was taking time and what time nick was writing down was what was left on the clock or the game time.
I will address this as I can tell you how it works being that I do it for every game. The other stuff you posted I am looking into.

Now the stopwatch I have counts from 0-5:10. I start the clock and as soon as it hits 10 seconds I yell "GOGOGO". From here the game proceeds. As soon as the flag is hung or all players are eliminated the clock is stopped and the time on the clock is subtracted from 5 minutes. The ten seconds is taken off as well.

This means that the time remaining is what goes towards your scores. So in your case, Endemic, you won the game in 1 minute and 48 seconds...CPX won their game in 1 minute and 42 seconds. They won their match, hung the flag, 6 seconds faster than you did...making them move on.

I do apologize if I did not explain this very well but this is how it works.

I will look into the bracketing system and make sure it gets put on here to help you understand how teams move on from their respective brackets.

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Old 08-22-2011, 11:40 PM #4
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I'm confused as to how Fury, Fury Gold and Enemy all moved on.. Seeing as we played all three, we were all in the same bracket.

Not that it matters to my team (we got the **** beat out of us) I;m just curious.

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Old 08-22-2011, 11:44 PM #5
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The "Clock" is a stopwatch...we do not have the timers that the PSP has at events. So time is started and stopped. The time on the stopwatch is then subtracted from the 5 minutes of game time, as well as the 10 seconds used to get the game ready, and then recorded.
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Old 08-23-2011, 12:39 AM #6
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Hope This Helps

Q. ok so now that tempers have cooled and everything is done and over with i would like some more explanation as to what the hell happened. Im not *****ing or saying anything i would just like some answers to questions that were brought up and after everyone had time to figure out what happened.

to start off with. For quarter finals dont the top 2 teams out of each group of 4 move on? so theoretically it is a 50/50 shot of you getting into finals? then that would mean pekin paintball team should have moved on. they were in our bracket and lost only to us. so that would of meant that they would have moved on along with us.

if im mistake then im sorry but i thought that is how everything has gone in the past. and even if that is not the case, since i see that both chi-town fury and chi-town fury gold moved on when they were both in the same bracket. why did LSD move on and not pekin. they were higher rank and better record. just trying to figure what was going on.

A. I can understand why you would feel this way however, there were 19 teams which were broken out into two (2) brackets. Field 1 was Bracket 1 and Field 2 was Bracket 2. Eight (8) teams go on which are the top four (4) teams from the overall Bracket 1 and 2. So looking at the Prelim scores http://www.paintball-players.org/sco...res/s5_r0.html From Bracket 1 it was Enemy, Chi-Town Fury, Chi-Town Fury Gold & LSD. From Bracket 2 it was your team (Endemic), Aggressive, Midwest Arson & CPX Allstars.


Q. now this brings me to the quarter final games moving to semifinals. The games between endemic and Cpx all stars. according to the scores posted on APPA we (endemic) had 3:12 as the time and Cpx had 3:18. NOW according to what nick said was that the stop watch counted up to 5 minutes. so that would meant that we (endemic) won the game in less time than CPX and therefore should have moved on but didnt. It needs to be figured out how the stop watch was taking time and what time nick was writing down was what was left on the clock or the game time.

A. The time recorded on the score card and then into APPA is that remaining on clock after the game has ended. In Quarter finals, youíre team (Endemic) played CPX Allstars. You stalemated one, won one & lost one. In this situation, it comes down to who won their game the fastest. Looking at the score card http://www.paintball-players.org/sco...res/s5_r1.html your team won with 3:12 remaining on the clock. CPX Allstars won with their game with 3:18 remaining on the clock. It is because of this that CPX Allstars moved on to Semi Final.


Q. This also brings up the fact that things need to be figured out before the teams are told. the decision was told to the teams about 4 times....... that is ridiculous that it kept changing. Yes the teams hovering around asking questions and bugging people for answers and i am sorry about that. but it still should not have been that difficult to determine who was moving on and who wasn't.[/quote]

A. I think four times maybe a reach but, it was more than twice. As you mention, the fact that I have everyone around me, over my shoulder waiting in anticipation plays its part but it is not an excuse. I should have just checked, checked and re-checked before announcing anything. I allowed the pressure from those around me to speak out of turn without doing my full due diligence. For this I am sorry. But as I stated at the event, thatís all I have to give and other than insuring it will not happen again, Iím not sure what more I can do.

Again, on behalf of the MWXL and myself I want to apologize to all of the teams for the confusion and thank you for your continued support of this series and hope to see you all at future events.
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Old 08-23-2011, 07:20 AM #7
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Originally Posted by jacapbinc View Post
Q. ok so now that tempers have cooled and everything is done and over with i would like some more explanation as to what the hell happened. Im not *****ing or saying anything i would just like some answers to questions that were brought up and after everyone had time to figure out what happened.

to start off with. For quarter finals dont the top 2 teams out of each group of 4 move on? so theoretically it is a 50/50 shot of you getting into finals? then that would mean pekin paintball team should have moved on. they were in our bracket and lost only to us. so that would of meant that they would have moved on along with us.

if im mistake then im sorry but i thought that is how everything has gone in the past. and even if that is not the case, since i see that both chi-town fury and chi-town fury gold moved on when they were both in the same bracket. why did LSD move on and not pekin. they were higher rank and better record. just trying to figure what was going on.

A. I can understand why you would feel this way however, there were 19 teams which were broken out into two (2) brackets. Field 1 was Bracket 1 and Field 2 was Bracket 2. Eight (8) teams go on which are the top four (4) teams from the overall Bracket 1 and 2. So looking at the Prelim scores http://www.paintball-players.org/sco...res/s5_r0.html From Bracket 1 it was Enemy, Chi-Town Fury, Chi-Town Fury Gold & LSD. From Bracket 2 it was your team (Endemic), Aggressive, Midwest Arson & CPX Allstars.


Q. now this brings me to the quarter final games moving to semifinals. The games between endemic and Cpx all stars. according to the scores posted on APPA we (endemic) had 3:12 as the time and Cpx had 3:18. NOW according to what nick said was that the stop watch counted up to 5 minutes. so that would meant that we (endemic) won the game in less time than CPX and therefore should have moved on but didnt. It needs to be figured out how the stop watch was taking time and what time nick was writing down was what was left on the clock or the game time.

A. The time recorded on the score card and then into APPA is that remaining on clock after the game has ended. In Quarter finals, youíre team (Endemic) played CPX Allstars. You stalemated one, won one & lost one. In this situation, it comes down to who won their game the fastest. Looking at the score card http://www.paintball-players.org/sco...res/s5_r1.html your team won with 3:12 remaining on the clock. CPX Allstars won with their game with 3:18 remaining on the clock. It is because of this that CPX Allstars moved on to Semi Final.


Q. This also brings up the fact that things need to be figured out before the teams are told. the decision was told to the teams about 4 times....... that is ridiculous that it kept changing. Yes the teams hovering around asking questions and bugging people for answers and i am sorry about that. but it still should not have been that difficult to determine who was moving on and who wasn't.


A. I think four times maybe a reach but, it was more than twice. As you mention, the fact that I have everyone around me, over my shoulder waiting in anticipation plays its part but it is not an excuse. I should have just checked, checked and re-checked before announcing anything. I allowed the pressure from those around me to speak out of turn without doing my full due diligence. For this I am sorry. But as I stated at the event, thatís all I have to give and other than insuring it will not happen again, Iím not sure what more I can do.

Again, on behalf of the MWXL and myself I want to apologize to all of the teams for the confusion and thank you for your continued support of this series and hope to see you all at future events.
[/quote]


ok so that makes more sense. It being 2 brackets and just doing it that way. Then i have a question of how a team who has a better average time, same points and a lower time all together doesnt move on. Take a look at the scores of pekin they only lost to our team and had a tie with us. yet aggressive, midwest arson and cpx allstars had 3 losses and two of the teams had a tie. Pekin had a better average time and total time with the same scores. it doesnt make any sense that they didnt move on.

Thanks for answering questions guys. It makes us feel like you really care and that you are the right people for the job.


-Ron
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Old 08-23-2011, 09:10 AM #8
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ok so that makes more sense. It being 2 brackets and just doing it that way. Then i have a question of how a team who has a better average time, same points and a lower time all together doesnt move on. Take a look at the scores of pekin they only lost to our team and had a tie with us. yet aggressive, midwest arson and cpx allstars had 3 losses and two of the teams had a tie. Pekin had a better average time and total time with the same scores. it doesnt make any sense that they didnt move on.

Thanks for answering questions guys. It makes us feel like you really care and that you are the right people for the job.



-Ron
Ahhhhh Ron... I thought this was the little girl (I mean size not age) that jump all over me like a spider monkey... keep her around, she's a tough one!

To answer your question, it all comes down to average time again. What really hurt Peking was the stalemate game they had. This totally messed up their average time because, there was no time to record. So yes, tie games are worse than losses in 5-Man Race to 2. Remember, it all comes down to wins, how fast you win and losses.

I hope this helps.
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Last edited by jacapbinc : 08-23-2011 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 08-23-2011, 10:51 AM #9
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Thanks for clearing all that up so quickly Big Black

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Old 08-23-2011, 10:55 AM #10
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Haha big black that girl made the whole event that was hilarious!
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Old 08-23-2011, 12:08 PM #11
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Haha big black that girl made the whole event that was hilarious!
What girl?
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Old 08-23-2011, 12:59 PM #12
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Which ever one came to the tent telling big black he shouldn't run the events anymore. Everyone just laughed..
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Old 08-23-2011, 07:47 PM #13
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Ahhhhh Ron... I thought this was the little girl (I mean size not age) that jump all over me like a spider monkey... keep her around, she's a tough one!

To answer your question, it all comes down to average time again. What really hurt Peking was the stalemate game they had. This totally messed up their average time because, there was no time to record. So yes, tie games are worse than losses in 5-Man Race to 2. Remember, it all comes down to wins, how fast you win and losses.

I hope this helps.
ok im still confused. pekin had 1 tie and two losses. when both aggressive and arson had 3 losses and a tie. so how does that work. pekin also came out with a lower average time and time over all. Just trying to figure out how a team with 3 losses and a tie is better than a team with 2 losses and a tie. that makes no sense what so ever.
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Old 08-23-2011, 08:48 PM #14
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ok im still confused. pekin had 1 tie and two losses. when both aggressive and arson had 3 losses and a tie. so how does that work. pekin also came out with a lower average time and time over all. Just trying to figure out how a team with 3 losses and a tie is better than a team with 2 losses and a tie. that makes no sense what so ever.
I have no problem explaining this as many times as it takes for everyone to have a clear understanding

The scorecard is read up and down, not straight across (i.e. columns 1-4). The difference between Midwest Arson’s stalemate game and that of Pekin’s is Midwest Arson won that race to 2 match. Remember, it’s a race to 2 wins. Also, in looking at the best average time… the more time on the clock the better. Again, they both had the same wins (race to 2 wins) and points, which brought it down to best average time.
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Old 08-23-2011, 09:06 PM #15
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ok so does that mean that the time that is on APPA as "Time" is the total time that they had remaining on the clock?

if thats the case then Aggressive time of 33:38 is not true considering one of their times is 22:40 left on the clock. so what kind of a roll can that play in the ranking of teams.
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Old 08-23-2011, 10:41 PM #16
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Aggressive went 3-1 overall in prelims for race to two.. They lost to arson twice and reapers once. They then beat reapers for the third round... I don't think how many you lost really matters from what I understand it's all about time.
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Old 08-24-2011, 12:55 AM #17
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ok so does that mean that the time that is on APPA as "Time" is the total time that they had remaining on the clock?

if thats the case then Aggressive time of 33:38 is not true considering one of their times is 22:40 left on the clock. so what kind of a roll can that play in the ranking of teams.
Scores and times are entered into the system (APPA). The system then takes all the times entered for each team and produces an ďAverage TimeĒ or ďAvg TimeĒ as indicated in APPA. This is the column you are refusing to recognize. Advancement is determined by Wins, on an ďAverageĒ how fast you are winning your games and loses.
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Old 08-24-2011, 11:10 AM #18
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Q.

A. I think four times maybe a reach
Four times is not a reach. First CPX Allstars moved on, then you told us that Endemic moves on, then third guessed yourself and had us wait again and said that you were correct it is Endemic moving.. then ultimately checked a 4th time and decided that CPX Allstars goes on.

We all make mistakes, but telling the waiting teams that you have a new answer to who moves on a total of 4 times within 5 or 10 minutes is a little ridiculous.
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Old 08-24-2011, 11:30 AM #19
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Four times is not a reach. First CPX Allstars moved on, then you told us that Endemic moves on, then third guessed yourself and had us wait again and said that you were correct it is Endemic moving.. then ultimately checked a 4th time and decided that CPX Allstars goes on.

We all make mistakes, but telling the waiting teams that you have a new answer to who moves on a total of 4 times within 5 or 10 minutes is a little ridiculous.
We get it...it is over. It was resolved and the correct teams moved on.
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Old 08-24-2011, 11:49 AM #20
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Four times is not a reach. First CPX Allstars moved on, then you told us that Endemic moves on, then third guessed yourself and had us wait again and said that you were correct it is Endemic moving.. then ultimately checked a 4th time and decided that CPX Allstars goes on.

We all make mistakes, but telling the waiting teams that you have a new answer to who moves on a total of 4 times within 5 or 10 minutes is a little ridiculous.
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Old 08-24-2011, 11:50 AM #21
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We get it...it is over. It was resolved and the correct teams moved on.
Thanks Nick!
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