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Old 04-17-2011, 10:02 AM #1
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Psp needs to learn something...

that they need to go back to the old x-ball style of as many points as possible in a given time frame. A lot more fun to watch and it would make tournaments more worth going to if you knew you would be able to play a ton there instead of paying a bunch to travel/stay at a tournament and not get to play a ton.
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Old 04-17-2011, 10:14 AM #2
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yeah this format is really good. Very fun oto watch and fun to play especially if a team makes a run from a being down
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Old 04-17-2011, 10:18 AM #3
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Well the PSP mindset is "lets save the players some money by making them play a lot less".... definitely the wrong thing players want to skimp on at a tournament...
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Old 04-17-2011, 11:48 AM #4
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Originally Posted by Feloniousnick View Post
that they need to go back to the old x-ball style of as many points as possible in a given time frame. A lot more fun to watch and it would make tournaments more worth going to if you knew you would be able to play a ton there instead of paying a bunch to travel/stay at a tournament and not get to play a ton.
The problem with your argument is that most (if not all) of the college teams have funding from their schools to help pay for the hotel and paint at the event. Most of the PSP teams don't have that funding, so to return to full matches would mean a huge increase in tournament costs for the individual players on top of airfare and hotels.

Don't get me wrong, I would be all for the return to full matches but I don't see it happening in the near future unless paint costs plummet.
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Old 04-17-2011, 11:51 AM #5
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The problem with your argument is that most (if not all) of the college teams have funding from their schools to help pay for the hotel and paint at the event. Most of the PSP teams don't have that funding, so to return to full matches would mean a huge increase in tournament costs for the individual players on top of airfare and hotels.

Don't get me wrong, I would be all for the return to full matches but I don't see it happening in the near future unless paint costs plummet.
i dont see how longer games will increase airfair, unless youre talking about week long tournaments.
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Old 04-17-2011, 11:52 AM #6
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Actually most college teams are just clubs that don't really get any funding/support from the schools. Perhaps some do but most don't.

My point mainly is that I'd rather spend a little more per tournament to play a ton more than to pay all of the costs of travel/hotel etc... only to get to play a few games.
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Old 04-17-2011, 01:10 PM #7
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i dont see how longer games will increase airfair, unless youre talking about week long tournaments.
Where did I ever say it would increase airfare? I said the longer full length matches would increase paint costs, on top of the airfare and hotel costs that players already have to pay.

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Actually most college teams are just clubs that don't really get any funding/support from the schools. Perhaps some do but most don't.

My point mainly is that I'd rather spend a little more per tournament to play a ton more than to pay all of the costs of travel/hotel etc... only to get to play a few games.
Having played in the AXBL I can tell you that paint costs rise substantially when you're playing 2 full halves. Like I said before, I personally would love for the PSP to go back to that but I really feel the cost is too prohibitive for a lot of teams out there. With a league like the AXB all the teams were generally from the same area and travel costs were comparatively low so there was more money to be spent on paint. The problem with a league like the PSP doing it is that you have teams traveling from all over the country and therefore spending more to even show up to an event. I'm sure a number of teams would prefer the return to the old XBall format, but I think you'd see a bunch of teams stop playing because they can't afford it anymore.
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Last edited by ThatGuy86 : 04-17-2011 at 01:23 PM.
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Old 04-17-2011, 02:34 PM #8
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The problem with your argument is that most (if not all) of the college teams have funding from their schools to help pay for the hotel and paint at the event. Most of the PSP teams don't have that funding, so to return to full matches would mean a huge increase in tournament costs for the individual players on top of airfare and hotels.

Don't get me wrong, I would be all for the return to full matches but I don't see it happening in the near future unless paint costs plummet.
Like feleniousnick said, many college teams have ABSOLUTELY NO FUNDING. There are teams (clubs) that do receive funding but those are not necessarily the top teams. If clubs do get funding, it is really only enough to cover travel/hotels or just paint or just entry.

And since many clubs dont get funding, many divisional teams arent sponsored. But there are few clubs that do get funding and there are few divisional teams that are sponsored. So I really dont get your arguement..
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Old 04-17-2011, 02:44 PM #9
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^^^^^^ truth, no funding here lol...

PSP pro could maybe move back to xball instead of Race to 7; but the fact is with so many teams playing, there comes a time constraint as well.
If you have ever been to a PSP event, there are always a few fields lagging on time and people complaining about playing in the dark or too late... and these are only Race to 4 and D1 Race to 5.
There comes a point where there is only so much you can do.... given the amount of resources you have as well as taking into account the amount of resources and number of the people who are playing in your event. Simple resource management principle there.
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Old 04-17-2011, 02:58 PM #10
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Yeuppp no funding here really...
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Old 04-17-2011, 03:22 PM #11
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If you're talking about PSP costs vs NCPA, you're comparing apples to oranges. There are 4 times as many PSP events as there are NCPA nationals per year. If you were to, for example, double the paint costs of a PSP event by switching back to classic xball, you have actually increased paint cost to 8 times as much as it was. This is not an increase the industry can tolerate.
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Old 04-17-2011, 04:18 PM #12
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Okay, so I was wrong about the college teams being funded. I have a few friends that have played on/still play on college teams, and their individual clubs are supported by the school so I'm just speaking from my own knowledge. My bad. I still don't see it happening for the PSP though.
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Old 04-17-2011, 04:33 PM #13
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Quote:
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The problem with your argument is that most (if not all) of the college teams have funding from their schools to help pay for the hotel and paint at the event. Most of the PSP teams don't have that funding, so to return to full matches would mean a huge increase in tournament costs for the individual players on top of airfare and hotels.

Don't get me wrong, I would be all for the return to full matches but I don't see it happening in the near future unless paint costs plummet.
we get zero, absolutely no funding whatsoever
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Old 04-17-2011, 04:45 PM #14
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If you're talking about PSP costs vs NCPA, you're comparing apples to oranges. There are 4 times as many PSP events as there are NCPA nationals per year. If you were to, for example, double the paint costs of a PSP event by switching back to classic xball, you have actually increased paint cost to 8 times as much as it was. This is not an increase the industry can tolerate.
So you would rather pay 4x the hotel/travel etc... expenses to play around the same amount of games you could in 1 tournament throughout 4 tournaments?
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Old 04-17-2011, 07:41 PM #15
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we get zero, absolutely no funding whatsoever
That sucks, I thought a good number of the college programs had at least some funding from their schools.

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So you would rather pay 4x the hotel/travel etc... expenses to play around the same amount of games you could in 1 tournament throughout 4 tournaments?
I see where you're going with this argument and I think it would be great to get in more paintball at each event, but unfortunately the reality is the opposite. It would be great if there were individual regional XBall leagues set up across the country for teams to compete in with the goal of earning an invitation to one final championship event similar to the NCPA. It would help local fields, reduce travel costs through the season that could be reallocated to buying paint, players would get more play time for their money, and give teams an end of the season goal to work towards. Even though the PSP has tried to set up regional leagues in the last few years, the infrastructure just isn't there yet.

Just to be clear, I'm not trying to argue against you. I'm sure everyone would agree that switching back to full XBall matches means more paintball played for everyone and more fun. I think we're all just pointing out that the way the PSP has their tournament structure set up with 4 events spread throughout the country it limits player funds, a point you seem to be missing.
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Old 04-17-2011, 07:48 PM #16
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The costs and play time between PSP and NCPA are actually very similar - on a per-player basis. PSP has shorter matches (but more of them), and also smaller rosters. It's really just 6 of one, half dozen of the other. The smaller roster requirements do make it easier to field a PSP team.

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Old 04-17-2011, 07:55 PM #17
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Old 04-17-2011, 08:14 PM #18
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The problem with your argument is that most (if not all) of the college teams have funding from their schools to help pay for the hotel and paint at the event.
Absolutely false.
The class A teams and teams that are well known for paintball (UConn, Drexel, Pitt, Ohio) sure, but %90 of the other college teams aren't funded by the school.
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Old 04-17-2011, 08:40 PM #19
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That sucks, I thought a good number of the college programs had at least some funding from their schools.



I see where you're going with this argument and I think it would be great to get in more paintball at each event, but unfortunately the reality is the opposite. It would be great if there were individual regional XBall leagues set up across the country for teams to compete in with the goal of earning an invitation to one final championship event similar to the NCPA. It would help local fields, reduce travel costs through the season that could be reallocated to buying paint, players would get more play time for their money, and give teams an end of the season goal to work towards. Even though the PSP has tried to set up regional leagues in the last few years, the infrastructure just isn't there yet.

Just to be clear, I'm not trying to argue against you. I'm sure everyone would agree that switching back to full XBall matches means more paintball played for everyone and more fun. I think we're all just pointing out that the way the PSP has their tournament structure set up with 4 events spread throughout the country it limits player funds, a point you seem to be missing.
I get that funds are limited but I just think it discourages some players because they don't want to spend all of the money to go and potentially only play a very small amount of games. For example a couple of years ago my old team went to cup and sent three 5 man squads (had some newer/less experienced players so we didn't wanna do x-ball at the time) and spent all of the money to go down there and stay etc... The problem though is besides my squad the other 2 squads only got to play around 10 points because they didn't make it out of the friday/sat prelims even though they spent all of the travel/house money etc.. while we moved on to sunday and played a lot more games for not much more cost in paint. Even making it to sunday, the amount of points we played was pretty close to the amount of points played in one of these NCPA matches that I saw today.

Basically I'm just stating that if I'm gonna be spending all of the money on hotel/travel and stuff I'd rather spend relatively a little extra to get to play a ton more to really make the trip worth it fun wise even if we don't win or w/e. Either way it's going to be expensive but I think the extra paint cost would be worth it to make the events a ton more worth going to for a relatively small extra cost compared to what is being spent as it is now.
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Old 04-17-2011, 08:46 PM #20
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The costs and play time between PSP and NCPA are actually very similar - on a per-player basis. PSP has shorter matches (but more of them), and also smaller rosters. It's really just 6 of one, half dozen of the other. The smaller roster requirements do make it easier to field a PSP team.

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Yea, I haven't done any real calculations and I'm sure you have so maybe I'm just flat wrong that they got to play more than they would at a psp given that there may be more matches at a PsP. It just seems in a format like race-to-2 that each team wouldn't get that many points in for what they are spending.

Either way GJ with the tournament, I watched what I could and the videos + casting were excellent and more consistent with quality (and less technical difficulties) than normally seen at the Psp tournaments.
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Old 04-17-2011, 08:49 PM #21
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