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Old 02-18-2011, 02:08 AM #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by papaintballer15

even they wouldnt put these in budget for that price. Multiple reasons here.

1. Engler has alot of military contracts for paintball training, since he uses real firearm parts on his modded markers.
2. Rap4 for the most part covers the rest of the training market
3. The cost (assuming it is 1600, even if its canadian is still too high) and military wouldnt be using a PDW based marker for training purposes since very few actually use PDW's in the field.
True I think most military or law enforcement agencies would use simunition rounds instead of paintballs. Don't get me wrong, I hope this sells and performs well, the paintball industry needs fresh faces with new ideas
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Old 02-19-2011, 05:56 AM #65
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Quick info given by the mfr: tested with the minitank (8CC) the K1 seems capable to shoot at least 200 balls!
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Old 02-19-2011, 07:10 AM #66
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As far as the military weapon use for sub machine guns they use H&K weapons almost exclusively since there is an MP-5 platform for every need. The military and Secret Service are starting to adopt the newer MP-7 but they don't use the P90 because it doesn't use a standard round, chances are if you see one it was a unit purchase, which again they have budgets for.
As far as military and paintball units are given training budgets some use MILES gear exclusively others invest in paintball. Almost all large military purchases in paintball has been from Tippmann or BT, they're cheap and don't need cleaning ans the military is not concerned with clip/magazine functions, they only want the feel of an object coming at a soldier. Some smaller units buy from RAP4 but it's uncommon due to cost, complexity and availability, for the most part SWAT groups use RAP4.
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Old 02-19-2011, 09:17 AM #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kirlusodeb View Post
Quick info given by the mfr: tested with the minitank (8CC) the K1 seems capable to shoot at least 200 balls!
at what FPS + averge BPS? Still pretty impressive tho
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Old 02-19-2011, 03:47 PM #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigman1416 View Post
As far as the military weapon use for sub machine guns they use H&K weapons almost exclusively since there is an MP-5 platform for every need. The military and Secret Service are starting to adopt the newer MP-7 but they don't use the P90 because it doesn't use a standard round, chances are if you see one it was a unit purchase, which again they have budgets for.
As far as military and paintball units are given training budgets some use MILES gear exclusively others invest in paintball. Almost all large military purchases in paintball has been from Tippmann or BT, they're cheap and don't need cleaning ans the military is not concerned with clip/magazine functions, they only want the feel of an object coming at a soldier. Some smaller units buy from RAP4 but it's uncommon due to cost, complexity and availability, for the most part SWAT groups use RAP4.
From my understanding, army is actually trying to adopt the 5.7x28 bc its proven to be better then 9mm. Im kind of hoping so, bc Fn's pistols are superior to everything else out there. Also the new variations in 5.7 ammo theres a need for everything, ammo from simple ball and brass, to ballistic tip,fragmentation, so on. If the round becomes much more standard then currently then id suspect we can see the cost go from 48 cents a shot to about 30 a shot. Im only hoping bc im buying a Five-Seven with tax return, and i really dont wanna pay as much as I am on the gun just for a case of ammo

Anyway back on topic, I too hope this product takes off, however at speculated prices it wont happen. Im hoping though that the price is alot cheaper, rocks 50 rnd magazines just like the PS/P90/AR57 style and that extra mags are cheap.
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Old 02-20-2011, 06:56 AM #69
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:31 AM #70
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Does look nice and I might think about picking it up but with the $1600 price tag, I'll pass.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:39 AM #71
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Like anything it all depends what is included in the price which is TBD
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Old 02-21-2011, 09:55 AM #72
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As was said before this is a great innovation...as far as the price tag look at Milsig! THeir stuff is highly priced as far as markers go but they make good gear. As far as I know this will be the first Electro mag fed gun on the market...minus Rap 4's conversion kits for the X7 and Phenom. So we have innovation for the Mil Sim guys, I know I am looking forward to it! Lets see how things develop...it will be good to see a non-mechanical system for Mil Sim!

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Old 02-22-2011, 04:20 PM #73
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Any idea of the weight for this one ?
As the way it look like, I can't really see how to do it strong/resistant and light.
It seems a bit bulky.
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Old 02-22-2011, 08:57 PM #74
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That looks amazing and Sick pic too.
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Old 02-22-2011, 09:15 PM #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Paintball View Post
does the US military even use the FN P90? I searched and could only find 9 police/swat forces in the US that use them and no mention if the army/navy uses them. If not, then something like this is 100% useless to them. You want to train with a weapon that has identical ergonomics to your real weapon. Quick reaction pointability has a lot to do with the familiarity and the last thing you'd want to do is train with a bullpup smg if thats not what you'll be using.
No, SS has, but for very specific reasons and often times they use other guns too.


Quote:
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Right, cause clearing an urban setting or building where the shots are 20 feet or less and the focus is on movement, reaction time, and covering fire is so much different if i am shooting a paintball or a bullet....

If you want to have large field battles, paintball makes no sense, if you are fighting in close quarters, paintball is pretty much interchangeable, hence why its so popularly used for training police etc.

Also as was said, the FN is used heavily by the secret service.
It is my understanding that sims and airsoft is used more than paintball simply because of the mess.


Quote:
Originally Posted by papaintballer15 View Post
From my understanding, army is actually trying to adopt the 5.7x28 bc its proven to be better then 9mm. Im kind of hoping so, bc Fn's pistols are superior to everything else out there. Also the new variations in 5.7 ammo theres a need for everything, ammo from simple ball and brass, to ballistic tip,fragmentation, so on. If the round becomes much more standard then currently then id suspect we can see the cost go from 48 cents a shot to about 30 a shot. Im only hoping bc im buying a Five-Seven with tax return, and i really dont wanna pay as much as I am on the gun just for a case of ammo

Anyway back on topic, I too hope this product takes off, however at speculated prices it wont happen. Im hoping though that the price is alot cheaper, rocks 50 rnd magazines just like the PS/P90/AR57 style and that extra mags are cheap.
Interesting, have not read that anywhere, and the 5.7 is not that great considering that AP 9mm can do most of what folks want out of the 5.7. The 5.7 was designed for a PDW role though, spewing lots of rounds out fast, not a handgun replacement.
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Old 02-22-2011, 09:19 PM #76
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the 5.7 allows for more damage without risk of penetration, along with lighter weight, higher velocity, higher capacity.

It was in a article I saw a couple weeks ago while I was searching through some sites for ammunition. Elite ammunition also has a video somewhere that I saw where they were talking about their custom 5.7' ammunition and military looking into using it as a primary alternative to 9mm.

though this isnt a thread to argue over what types of ammunition is better, everyone has their preference. I grew up loving 9mm weapons and loved to shoot my cousins beretta.
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Old 02-22-2011, 09:36 PM #77
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the 5.7 allows for more damage without risk of penetration, along with lighter weight, higher velocity, higher capacity.
I would suggest you read up on the LE agencies that have used them in Miami ( I believe) and dumped them after using them.
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Old 02-22-2011, 09:43 PM #78
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:48 PM #79
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:54 PM #80
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:56 PM #81
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Looks great! I struggle with the fact that I have become so used to aiming down the barrel, but if it is indeed FS compatible than slap a nice sight on it and you will pick off people all day.

Just hard to be thrilled about the lack of a loader, when the top assembly is nearly as tall as a loader.

Regardless I cannot wait to see how it operates.
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Old 03-04-2011, 09:18 PM #82
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It s real and being made
Wow, definitely standing by my comments on ergonomics.

That frame needs to go on a diet.
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Old 03-05-2011, 02:18 AM #83
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that trigger looks like sh!!!!t.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Element Paintball View Post
does the US military even use the FN P90? I searched and could only find 9 police/swat forces in the US that use them and no mention if the army/navy uses them. If not, then something like this is 100% useless to them. You want to train with a weapon that has identical ergonomics to your real weapon. Quick reaction pointability has a lot to do with the familiarity and the last thing you'd want to do is train with a bullpup smg if thats not what you'll be using.
UN , Nato, and a few other euro countries use them...

++both righty and lefty user friendly
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Old 03-05-2011, 05:14 AM #84
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