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Old 09-18-2010, 03:22 AM #64
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Old 09-18-2010, 03:36 AM #65
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extreme metal is a stupid term, but its a very broad term that has a lot of subgenres, heavy metal being one of them. and the black dahlia murder classifies themselves as heavy metal. therefore, they are also extreme metal.
By your logic, Sabbath could be extreme metal

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The term usually refers to a more abrasive, harsher, underground, non-commercialized style or sound nearly always associated with genres like black metal, death metal, doom metal and thrash metal
The Black Dahlia Murder is metalcore/deathcore.
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Old 09-18-2010, 03:57 AM #66
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thats the logic that comes with the term "extreme metal." its too loose.
not only that but the black dahlia murder places themselves in a lot of different categories, for example: melodic death metal. im pretty sure any type of death metal would be an extreme type of metal. assuming "extreme metal" isnt only based off what the band sings about, but how they sound as well.
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Old 09-18-2010, 02:55 PM #67
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Originally Posted by PaInTeRjOe_BkO View Post
lol youd be suprised of the different types of music i actually listen to. i have songs by luciano pavarotti all the way up to the black dahlia murder.
Your taste in alexisonfire tells me that you do not at all like metal as it is dirty and uncompromising. It tells me that you DO like "metal" that "sounds" extreme without actually being extreme. It's nice and safe and doesn't put you off. Same with Protest the Hero, it sounds fancy and hard to play but is as pointless to listen to musically as most dark ambient.

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thats the logic that comes with the term "extreme metal." its too loose.
not only that but the black dahlia murder places themselves in a lot of different categories, for example: melodic death metal. im pretty sure any type of death metal would be an extreme type of metal. assuming "extreme metal" isnt only based off what the band sings about, but how they sound as well.
There is a clear distinction between extreme metal and metal. Iron maiden and judas priest are no Darkthrone or Blasphemy. The Black Dahlia Murder is cheap gimmicky "metal" that has all the bells and whistles coupled with a strong modern (see:overproduced, mechanical, lifeless, soulless) production. It's fake and we see right through it.

the fact of the matter is, if you were into punk, you'd be into bands like Bad Religion and Green Day.
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Old 09-18-2010, 03:14 PM #68
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for reference, some extreme metal:





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Old 09-18-2010, 03:49 PM #69
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the fact of the matter is, if you were into punk, you'd be into bands like Bad Religion and Green Day.
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Old 09-18-2010, 04:09 PM #70
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the fact of the matter is, if you were into punk, you'd be into bands like Bad Religion and Green Day.
Oh my. This thread...This is icing on the cake. Congrats. You win.
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Old 09-18-2010, 04:44 PM #71
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Originally Posted by Iamamartianchurch View Post
Your taste in alexisonfire tells me that you do not at all like metal as it is dirty and uncompromising. It tells me that you DO like "metal" that "sounds" extreme without actually being extreme. It's nice and safe and doesn't put you off. Same with Protest the Hero, it sounds fancy and hard to play but is as pointless to listen to musically as most dark ambient.



There is a clear distinction between extreme metal and metal. Iron maiden and judas priest are no Darkthrone or Blasphemy. The Black Dahlia Murder is cheap gimmicky "metal" that has all the bells and whistles coupled with a strong modern (see:overproduced, mechanical, lifeless, soulless) production. It's fake and we see right through it.

the fact of the matter is, if you were into punk, you'd be into bands like Bad Religion and Green Day.
that pretty much proved nothing. it gave me your opinion on extreme metal.

you got "dirty and uncompromising right," in other words, sounds like complete *** when put together. the black dahlia murder has the same base as incantation, morbid angel, and suffocation. and im sure some of the members even listen to them, and im sure they base some of their music off bands like that. the only reason its "gimmicky" is because they realized that bands like that sound like ****, so they need to clean it up and make it sound good. thus becoming less "underground."

if there were a clear spectrum of metal, with iron maiden or judas priest at the very lowest (per your example) im sure the black dahlia murder would be far enough in it to consider them "extreme" metal.

i dont listen to punk.
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Old 09-18-2010, 05:18 PM #72
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you got "dirty and uncompromising right," in other words, sounds like complete *** when put together. the only reason its "gimmicky" is because they realized that bands like that sound like ****, so they need to clean it up and make it sound good. thus becoming less "underground."

i dont listen to punk.
The point of metal was to create a subculture and a sound that rebelled against the "nice" sounds of pop bands of the time. They wanted something heavier, something dirtier, something that appealed to them and if you didn't like it, you could **** off. Creating "metal" that's meant to appeal to the masses goes against the basic principal.

and it's clearly evident you don't listen to punk.
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Old 09-18-2010, 05:39 PM #73
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I meant appeal to metal fans. Not fans of other music because the black dahlia murder definitely doesn't appeal to most people who like other stuff. But their are exceptions. And there's no doubt that the black dahlia murder isn't heavy or dirty. They just cleaned the sound up a little tiny bit. In fact it could have even been a larger recording budget. You guys just have a higher standard for metal. You want the deeper sound. But it doesn't mean that bands like morbid angel can't be categorized with the black dahlia murder.
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Old 09-18-2010, 06:15 PM #74
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Originally Posted by edudcixlsyd View Post
The point of metal was to create a subculture and a sound that rebelled against the "nice" sounds of pop bands of the time. They wanted something heavier, something dirtier, something that appealed to them and if you didn't like it, you could **** off. Creating "metal" that's meant to appeal to the masses goes against the basic principal.

and it's clearly evident you don't listen to punk.
Which is why new metal sub-genres keep popping up seemingly overnight.

Metal fans care more about if no one knows who their favorite band is in some obscure metal genre no one ever heard off more than if the ****ing music sounds good and the band is talented.
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Old 09-18-2010, 06:50 PM #75
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Which is why new metal sub-genres keep popping up seemingly overnight.

Metal fans care more about if no one knows who their favorite band is in some obscure metal genre no one ever heard off more than if the ****ing music sounds good and the band is talented.
That's a huge part of why these guys only let the lesser known extreme metal bands into their little society they've created. Give me a reason the black dahlia murder can't be extreme metal when the only difference between them and other extreme bands is the fact that they cleaned up their music slightly/had a better recording budget and they actually have a fanbase.
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Old 09-18-2010, 11:07 PM #76
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Originally Posted by PaInTeRjOe_BkO View Post
That's a huge part of why these guys only let the lesser known extreme metal bands into their little society they've created. Give me a reason the black dahlia murder can't be extreme metal when the only difference between them and other extreme bands is the fact that they cleaned up their music slightly/had a better recording budget and they actually have a fanbase.
How about the fact that despite their marketability, they still sound like **** being sucked through a straw?

The problem isn't categorical, nor is it production value like you seem to think. It's that you can't accept that people like to take cult-based music, shine it up so they can make money, and rape the masses with a watered down, easily accessible, and completely laughable version of music that not only ruins its own integrity amongst the REAL music culture, but fails to accomplish anything new or even remotely emotional.

Music is created by different branches of emotional-expressive culture. When you try to bridge cultural gaps by simplifying and making semi-listenable punk sound like "metal", you've missed the ****ing point. It's about expression, not "hey how can I make this sound 'good' and sell it to 15 year old ******s in skinny jeans"? Who gives a flying **** if they have a fan base? Music isn't about fame. It's about making the music that you feel deep inside of you and sharing it with those who you know can listen to and appreciate it.

Making something appealing and capable of instant acceptance by the widest audience possible doesn't make anything "good". Real music takes appreciation. Real music takes actual thought and emotional control to really put yourself into the music and feel what the musicians are feeling and basing their music off of. And if you really liked metal, you wouldn't have just said that any, much less all of the bands that church posted sounded like ****. Guess what? That's real metal.

*EDIT* And for the most part, metal is supposed to sound awful and unappealing. That's what makes it metal. You can't "clean it up".
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Old 09-19-2010, 12:00 AM #77
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I agree almost entirely with you except metal isn't supposed to sound awful/unappealing.
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Old 09-19-2010, 01:11 AM #78
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Well, to the people trained to pop culture it sounds awful and unappealing.
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Old 09-19-2010, 01:20 AM #79
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Well, to the people trained to pop culture it sounds awful and unappealing.
That's different from saying it's supposed to sound bad.
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Old 09-19-2010, 01:38 AM #80
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You knew what the **** I meant ******.
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Old 09-19-2010, 01:46 AM #81
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Which is why new metal sub-genres keep popping up seemingly overnight.

Metal fans care more about if no one knows who their favorite band is in some obscure metal genre no one ever heard off more than if the ****ing music sounds good and the band is talented.
yeah which is why iammartian posted morbid angel and suffocation...
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Old 09-19-2010, 02:37 AM #82
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You knew what the **** I meant ******.
No, that's why I brought it up. Take a chill pill.
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Old 09-19-2010, 03:15 AM #83
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How about the fact that despite their marketability, they still sound like **** being sucked through a straw?

The problem isn't categorical, nor is it production value like you seem to think. It's that you can't accept that people like to take cult-based music, shine it up so they can make money, and rape the masses with a watered down, easily accessible, and completely laughable version of music that not only ruins its own integrity amongst the REAL music culture, but fails to accomplish anything new or even remotely emotional.

Music is created by different branches of emotional-expressive culture. When you try to bridge cultural gaps by simplifying and making semi-listenable punk sound like "metal", you've missed the ****ing point. It's about expression, not "hey how can I make this sound 'good' and sell it to 15 year old ******s in skinny jeans"? Who gives a flying **** if they have a fan base? Music isn't about fame. It's about making the music that you feel deep inside of you and sharing it with those who you know can listen to and appreciate it.

Making something appealing and capable of instant acceptance by the widest audience possible doesn't make anything "good". Real music takes appreciation. Real music takes actual thought and emotional control to really put yourself into the music and feel what the musicians are feeling and basing their music off of. And if you really liked metal, you wouldn't have just said that any, much less all of the bands that church posted sounded like ****. Guess what? That's real metal.

*EDIT* And for the most part, metal is supposed to sound awful and unappealing. That's what makes it metal. You can't "clean it up".
You just killed it with this post.

Edit: I'd also like to note that other ****** only knows that Luciano Pavarotti exists because he died recently. Dude, you only have that **** in your library because it makes you feel better when other people look at it and are like, "oh my god this guy must be legit cause he's got opera and **** omg omg lol sweet." **** that. Grow some balls and listen to what you really like, not what other people think is cool.

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Old 09-19-2010, 05:26 AM #84
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You just killed it with this post.

Edit: I'd also like to note that other ****** only knows that Luciano Pavarotti exists because he died recently. Dude, you only have that **** in your library because it makes you feel better when other people look at it and are like, "oh my god this guy must be legit cause he's got opera and **** omg omg lol sweet." **** that. Grow some balls and listen to what you really like, not what other people think is cool.
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how can you even come up with such a rediculous opinion. that is the dumbest thing ive ever heard in my entire 20 years of existence. im actually amazed at how unbelievably retarded that post was.

if you really want to know the reason i listen to him, its because ive grown up with his music all my life. he was my grand mothers favorite singer. so for all i care you can gladly fall off a rocky cliff.

komodo, how does the black dahlia murder sound like **** through a straw but the three bands that were posted sound good? that doesnt make a bit of sense. your going to have to explain that. i mean, i know its all "heart and soul" and "we do it because its how we feel." ok so does ****in BDM and countless other bands.

your absolutely right about the categorizing and the production value thing. you misunderstood. the only reason the production value subject came up is because i said that the black dahlia murder SOUNDS like they have a higher budget, which is probably true because of the bigger fan base. the categorizing subject came up because i think that BDM can be categorized as extreme metal. the only reason you people think they cant, is because they sound cleaner (which yes, its entirely possible to clean up that music. its called re-writing the music so it actually plays out, adding solos and breakdowns. not just pointless blast beats every two ****in seconds.) in fact, BDM is a perfect example of this. they have the same basis as bands like morbid angel, they just make it sound better to themselves. it doesnt put it at all into a different category, because its not such a huge change that it can be kicked out of the extreme metal genre.

i agree with pretty much everything you said.
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