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Old 03-06-2015, 08:26 PM #1
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Question We're is the field owners tournament series?

Maybe we could get some of the local field owners to start a new league?
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Old 03-06-2015, 09:15 PM #2
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Plenty of leagues

If u want to play five man nothing is better then the MiLP

PiG paintball has a beginners and intermediate 3 man league

If u want more info u r welcome to PM me
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Old 03-06-2015, 10:36 PM #3
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I don't think you understand the question?

Paintball isn't what you guys play today, it's field owners in each state that each month host a less expensive family friendly atmosphere.

I'm trying to help bring paintball back.

We need the field owners and they need us.

Thanks, but not looking for what your offering!
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Old 03-07-2015, 09:38 AM #4
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I'll step out on a limb here.....

As far as "less expensive", it's not gonna get any cheaper (and doesn't need to imo) than it is now. Paint is the cheapest its ever been, and the rof has even been lowered, which helps with how much you shoot. I played a 3 man last weekend, and nobody on our team pulled 1 pod, all day.

Now, to the other HUGE point, imo, "FAMILY FRIENDLY" :
I would not have taken my family to the tournament last weekend. Excessive profanity, and no "non player" bathroom facilities. These are 2 common factors at tournaments and fields. I can take my family to my softball games, my basketball games, etc., because it's a family friendly atmosphere, that still has high level competition. Try walking off the softball field, cussing at the other team, and see how fast you get sent to the parking lot. OR, try sitting in the stands, cussing at the other teams, and see how fast you get escorted to the parking lot. You won't, because there's a sign on the fence, when you walked in, that tells you the rules and things that won't be tolerated.

Family friendly? Is there bathroom facilities for my family (we don't do primitive camping...)? Is there concessions for my family (most fields aren't right beside mcdonalds) ? Is there adequate parking, seating, etc. for the family?

Currently, I know 1 field in the state where these things apply, and they don't currently do tournament paintball, partly because of having to deal with the "no rules apply to me" thug mentality that we've allowed players to adopt, where no other recreational sport would allow. I'm not impressed, or intimidated by your filthy mouth, and I'm not into letting my family see or hear it.

Basically, clean up the sport (with facility rules), put some effort into your facility (player bathrooms should be separate from spectator bathrooms...duh....), and you can truly change the tournament atmosphere to something I would travel multiple states to be a part of, with my family, which = more revenue for the local field.
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Old 03-08-2015, 12:27 AM #5
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Good comment, when I started in 96 it was a sport with great men you looked up to.

We intend to bring ethics and commen goal of achievement of success back to paintball.

A case of paint was $40 for Premium and it was a bigger bore and ten times the weight and fill.

Paintballs are very cheap to make, I still have my paint made by Nelson in Michigan.

Bottom line everyone brags about technology, but the outside world sees a bunch of idiots with no respect shooting the piss out of everyone!

This turn around has to start at the bottom and work up, I have talked to many of the guys that still build and comitate for paintball and this is what there saying we need more fields with hosting tournament series.

If we don't make a change soon there will no more paintball.
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Old 03-11-2015, 09:46 AM #6
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I too wish the tournament side of paintball were more family friendly. It's definetly not.

Family fun for paintball is on the recball side. And it is growing and thriving. Especially with 50 cal paintball coming of age....

Paintballs are NOT cheap to make. Anyone who says they are is clueless in what the raw materials cost.

As far as bathrooms go....we have an indoor that we keep clean for ladies. The two other outdoor ones at least have a real toilet and plumbing. Porta potties are the norm

I am all for change for the better. But, don't just post criticism if u don't have specific suggestions on how to make things better.
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Old 03-11-2015, 03:36 PM #7
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Coyote, it's not in your signature, but I'm guessing you're from PIG? I thought PIG had a very nice field, what little we saw. To your point, real toilets and plumbing, and the trailer for inside office/shop space, and segregated bathrooms for non players (women), along with various types of fields to play on. The airball space was nice grass, with netting, easily visible for spectators. We plan on playing the rest of your series.

Paintballs are NOT cheap. As far as 40 dollar a case paint in '96? Maybe half a case, where we played. RPS was 90/case for 2500 round cases in '98. The price of paint is not an issue in todays paintball imo.

As far as specific suggestions, the PIG tourney was the first tourney I've played with qualified refs, ready to throw a penalty flag at a cheating player. This was AWESOME, and a huge step in the right direction. Put in profanity rules, would be my suggestion. Whether you use that type of language or not, fact is, profanity takes a tense situation and escalates it to a volatile situation. On top of being offensive to the large majority. People will pay for a quality product event, that is a safe environment with structure.

Marketing. Outside of advertising to the player base, how often do you see a flyer for a paintball tournament at your local stores, talk shows, or ads on the radio? Inexpensive marketing strategies that can bring new people into the sport. Strap on a go pro at practice, go shoot somebody in the face, and drop that in a commercial or ad. We advertise the mud bog, why not the pball tourneys? lol. We have fewer injuries than every other sport available. Parents should be eating that up.

Corporate sponsors. The baseball fields are packed with them, why not the pball fields?

Tournament paintball should be the elite of the sport, not a black eye that makes field owners operate at 99% recball, 1% tournament.

Good conversation. This is directed at the sport in general, not one specific field by the way
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Old 03-11-2015, 07:42 PM #8
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HGBlues

Thanks for the kind words

As far as marketing. I spend LOTS of money marketing paintball to the masses and we do not tolerate any kind of cussing or even slightly inappropriate actions with recball.

As far as tournaments go. This is what I love personally and what most of our staff loves. I maintain it for them and the community overall. I however probably should be stricter with the language. However, Tournament paintball in general is a black eye on the sport. We are just now starting to see professional standards established for tournament ball. The psp in particular ( and its affiliates ) are really starting to do better. We even are starting to see the infamous HK company starting to act like a professional company (at events anyway)
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Old 03-14-2015, 11:31 PM #9
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HGBlues

Thanks for the kind words

As far as marketing. I spend LOTS of money marketing paintball to the masses and we do not tolerate any kind of cussing or even slightly inappropriate actions with recball.

As far as tournaments go. This is what I love personally and what most of our staff loves. I maintain it for them and the community overall. I however probably should be stricter with the language. However, Tournament paintball in general is a black eye on the sport. We are just now starting to see professional standards established for tournament ball. The psp in particular ( and its affiliates ) are really starting to do better. We even are starting to see the infamous HK company starting to act like a professional company (at events anyway)
I would agree with you about PSP wanting to change back to the game I grew up with!

When we played in the late 90's NPPL, MSPA for just a few were players leagues with families very much involved with setups to lunches and the list goes on!

We kicked out players and teams for the spoiled little Johny at the age of 29! Lol

Paintballs are just a Vitiam E capsule, you can buy a startup pill maker for about $10,000 and your in the paintball making business!

The problem is you have to move your goods fast and I mean fast!

Until lately we never thought about what harm the fill of the paint might do to our local landscape, so with the new fill it does cost more!

But don't be fooled Pro Caps isn't losing any money, trust me!

I would love to find out more about your field but I don't even know what PIG stands for or were your at!

This year I'm teaming up with some old buddy's from our NPPL days and want to visit all of our Alabama fields and talk About a tournament series ran by the field owners and players.

This will only help your walk on traffic, that's how I started!

Cya in the middle
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Old 03-15-2015, 06:43 PM #10
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I believe u r a little misinformed as to the expense of both a machine and the raw materials for paint. IF u can purchase a capsule machine for 10k it would be capable of producing MAYBE 100 paintballs per hour. To get a machine to produce any type of real volume u r looking at around a million dollars. Additionally. The cost of the raw materials alone are over $10 per case. That doesn't include shipping, packaging, marketing, or overhead.


As to PiG paintball. It stands for paintball is good and can be found at Paintballisgood.com

We are located where paintball quest use to be in McCalla , AL
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Old 03-15-2015, 10:04 PM #11
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I believe u r a little misinformed as to the expense of both a machine and the raw materials for paint. IF u can purchase a capsule machine for 10k it would be capable of producing MAYBE 100 paintballs per hour. To get a machine to produce any type of real volume u r looking at around a million dollars. Additionally. The cost of the raw materials alone are over $10 per case. That doesn't include shipping, packaging, marketing, or overhead.


As to PiG paintball. It stands for paintball is good and can be found at Paintballisgood.com

We are located where paintball quest use to be in McCalla , AL
Well I guess it's best we just agree to disagree.

Well that's great, as for taking up the old field and all.

Is that neighborhood still growing?
I know it was really hard to find back in the day!

Did you buy the land or lease it?

Good luck
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Old 03-16-2015, 01:34 PM #12
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..

neighborhood is the same....we purchased the land


paintballs.....I held your same assumptions about paintballs, enough so that I researched, got quotes, looked into recipes for paint, etc....I quickly found out how expensive it was..

but...we can agree to disagree!
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Old 03-16-2015, 02:51 PM #13
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Well I'm glad Roy sold it to a paintball person!

Are you using Valken?

Gino is a friend and it would be good to have a major paint/equipment sponsor for a league.
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Old 03-17-2015, 07:33 PM #14
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no, we are a KEE \ empire filed
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Old 03-18-2015, 09:29 PM #15
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I'll be in contact, some of the new developments have been released a little early on the top level.

Thanks for your time, look into Valken you will be much happier.

We in the business don't care for what Kee has done to our favorite brands, like WGP, JTso on!

Cya in the middle
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Old 03-19-2015, 04:02 PM #16
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Old 03-19-2015, 09:16 PM #17
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I love KEE, great company. If it wasn't for KEE JT wouldn't exist still AND KEE came back out with a mech cocker, otherwise it wouldn't exist anymore. Other then infinity ( worst paint I have ever seen) I believe valken paint is a GREAT product. It's ever bit as good as KEE. However, the multiple lines KEE has to offer, plus their lead in the 50 cal market made them the best fit for me. Not to mention I receive a lot of support from them both in customer service and tournament support.
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Old 03-20-2015, 12:13 AM #18
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I love KEE, great company. If it wasn't for KEE JT wouldn't exist still AND KEE came back out with a mech cocker, otherwise it wouldn't exist anymore. Other then infinity ( worst paint I have ever seen) I believe valken paint is a GREAT product. It's ever bit as good as KEE. However, the multiple lines KEE has to offer, plus their lead in the 50 cal market made them the best fit for me. Not to mention I receive a lot of support from them both in customer service and tournament support.

It seems your doing good in the paintball business!

Very glad.

I Hope it continues for you!
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Old 03-20-2015, 09:10 AM #19
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Thanks for your time, look into Valken you will be much happier.

We in the business don't care for what Kee has done to our favorite brands, like WGP, JTso on!
I'm curious about this "we in the business" insight that you have.

Empire hasn't done anything to harm the reputation of JT. The flex line is still going strong and expanding every year. When they wanted to make changes, they left the flex untouched and created a new line with the E-flex. Sure their apparel and soft goods have declined, but that was long before the acquisition. Dye could be more attributed to the loss of JT apparel sales than most other companies (which is funny when you think about how Dye got started).
It is true that KEE has tried to expand the JT line unsuccessfully, but the core of JT has remained untouched.

WGP was slow to adapt to the change in technology. The autococker was revolutionary for its time, but that time has passed. That's like blaming a company like GE for RCA television being crap. They have been crap for 20 years, new ownership doesn't affect that. But KEE is fully behind Boston Paintball and Inceptions with their custom bodies. The new autococker from Empire is doing well too.

Invert has exploded with the Mini and Axe

Halo has maintained itself as a great loader for an affordable price. They took the halo platform and improved it into the Z2 loader

To me, the only brand that I can think of that KEE squandered was the viewloader.

You have already tipped your hand as why you don't like Empire and it doesn't have much to do with the above. Gino has his own sordid past with KEE, as well as most other paintball companies. Personally I find that Valken paint is too inconsistent. I've shot some redemption that was great, but mostly blasted by marbles in a Grafitti and Infinity box or having to clean fate out of my barrel after every shot because of the horrible quality. But let's be honest, field owners don't switch to Valken because they have better paint, they just have better margins. Not everyone does, but most field owners I've talked to that have done this list this as one of their primary reasons.

I'd comment about Paint being 40 a case back in 96, but HGBlues already nailed it with his point that paint was no where near that cheap.

Since I'm chiming in on the other stuff, allow me to share my thoughts on the original purpose of this thread.

And before you call my post condescending allow me to quote you

Quote:
Originally Posted by TeamProdigy1# View Post
I don't think you understand the question?

Paintball isn't what you guys play today, it's field owners in each state that each month host a less expensive family friendly atmosphere.

I'm trying to help bring paintball back.

We need the field owners and they need us.

Thanks, but not looking for what your offering!
First, learn the difference between we're, were, and where then people might actually understand what you are asking.

Second, tournaments don't attract new players. The research proves this, not sure why everyone keeps thinking this. Let's say you have 200 rec players who migrate to tournament play. You still only have 200 players, a new player isn't going to play a tournament on his first day there. As much as I don't care the for the scenario scene, I think they do more for bringing in new players than any tournament or series of tournament would.

Thirdly, I despise your "old timer' attitude that paintball today isn't paintball. It is no different than the old man complaining how music today isn't like what he grew up with and therefore isn't music. The great Johnny Cash had a song with a lyric that echoes this perfectly, but the song title escapes me.

Paintball is not defined by playing 3 on 3, 10 on 10 or 100 on 100. It is not defined on if you play on an inflatable field, an open field with bunkers, a bar, or woods. The definition of Paintball is shooting your friend in a game and 5 minutes later going back at it creating stories to tell later.

I would like to commend you on keeping a family atmosphere. But treat these as learning opportunities to cultivate a good environment, don't be so quick with the ban hammer.

If you want to "save" paintball do these three things:
- Accept all types of paintball are paintball and drop the elitist attitude
- Challenge yourself to bring a new friend every time you play or as a field owner, challenge your patrons to do the same.
- Build the paintball family. I think 75% of my current circle of friends I met through paintball. Most of those don't play anymore but the friendship persists.

You have some good ideas, but don't let your own bias act as a blinder to other view points.

Last edited by Silencio : 03-20-2015 at 02:12 PM.
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Old 03-20-2015, 09:19 AM #20
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Old 03-20-2015, 04:00 PM #21
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*Pulls out Popcorn* Love me a great debate.
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