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Old 01-17-2010, 04:48 PM #22
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I'm not sure I like the idea of an uncapped season. In baseball it just seems like Yankees or Boston. That would get gay if every year it was either Team A or Team B.
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Old 01-17-2010, 04:51 PM #23
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I'm not sure I like the idea of an uncapped season. In baseball it just seems like Yankees or Boston. That would get gay if every year it was either Team A or Team B.
I'm going to assume you don't watch baseball.
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Old 01-17-2010, 04:52 PM #24
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think its the skins
I'm pretty sure the Redskins create the most revenue, but after you subtract their costs and whatnot, Dallas is worth the most.

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Why not, socialist? Salary caps only serve to punish successful franchises. Plus, it diminishes the quality of the league because you don't have as many truly dominant teams. Go back and watch some of those old Lakers - Celtics Finals from the pre-cap days. Those teams were ****ing loaded and made for some fantastic entertainment. You just don't see teams like that nowadays.
Having no cap would be what would diminish the quality of the league. Having 4-5 completely dominant teams who are almost guaranteed a playoff spot for the next 20 years is boring and gay.
You're basically saying that competition is bad and you hate seeing worse teams have a chance at winning.
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Old 01-17-2010, 04:57 PM #25
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No, it wouldn't.

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Originally Posted by thephoenix.com
If the goal of a salary cap is to create parity, then in the NBA and the NFL, at least, it ain't working so hot. Were the NBA season to end today, the eight playoff teams in the Eastern Conference would be Boston, Cleveland, Orlando, Atlanta, Detroit, Philadelphia, Miami, and Milwaukee. That's six of the eight playoff teams from last year, and one of those two won a title two seasons ago. In the Western Conference, seven of eight current playoff teams appeared last year with Portland the only new additions. And seven of eight Western teams were repeaters from the year previous as well. The NBA has only seen six seven different teams win a title since the 90s - the Bulls, Rockets, Lakers, Spurs, Pistons, Heat, and Celtics.

Ah, but it's the NFL with true parity, no? Well, no. ESPN's Jayson Stark makes this argument quite a bit. The short form is this: in the last eight years 13 different teams have gone to the World Series, while only 12 have gone to the Super Bowl. 43% of teams have made the playoffs in MLB, while only 37.5% have in the NFL. What others see as parity, I personally see as small-sample-size-related aberrations. But that's just me. The point is that for all the talk of parity in the NFL, baseball is the league that can lay a true stake to the claim.
The MLB has more parity than either the NFL or NBA. And those leagues are capped.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:00 PM #26
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Having no cap would be what would diminish the quality of the league. Having 4-5 completely dominant teams who are almost guaranteed a playoff spot for the next 20 years is boring and gay.
You're basically saying that competition is bad and you hate seeing worse teams have a chance at winning.
Seriously? How far did the Mets and Cubs go in the playoffs this year? Wait, they didn't even make the playoffs despite having tremendous pay rolls? Hmmmm ....
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:05 PM #27
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And what team has won the most World Series? The team with the BIGGEST payroll? Hmmmmmmm....
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:08 PM #28
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And what team has won the most World Series? The team with the BIGGEST payroll? Hmmmmmmm....
What about clubs like the Cubs, who routinely spend tens of millions of dollars and they haven't won a World Series in over one hundred years? Or the Mariners, who spent $100 million dollars and lost 100 games in '08?

You're making an argument based on one end of the spectrum while ignoring the other.

Money doesn't ensure success. That's the bottomline. The empirical evidence I've posted proves that.

Snyder and Jones aren't going to suddenly become geniuses when they can unload their wallets.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:10 PM #29
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It might not guarantee a win, but look how many years the yankees make the playoffs.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:14 PM #30
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It might not guarantee a win, but look how many years the yankees make the playoffs.
Once again:

Quote:
Originally Posted by thephoenix.com
43% of teams have made the playoffs in MLB, while only 37.5% have in the NFL.
The Yankees - for all their spending - missed the playoffs in 2008.

Again, the MLB has more parity than either the NBA or NFL.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:15 PM #31
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There's a difference between ensuring success, and having a system in place that limits what other, small-market teams can do. Yes, you have a point, but MY point is that rather than making it so that a couple teams will always make the playoffs, it will be so teams like Jacksonville, Buffalo, and Oakland won't even have a chance.

With a salary cap, it PROMOTES parity and competition, but the fact remains that in order to be a good team, you not only have to have good players, but also a good system, you have to be able to draft well, hire the right coaches, etc.

Any team can pick any player in the draft (unless they've already been taken, obviously) or sign any free agent they want, but it doesn't matter if they can't take that player, put him in a position to play well, and groom him into YOUR system.


I think what people are speaking out against is, is that we don't want to even begin down a road that would let any of these things happen. We want to ensure that parity remains, and that competition is still high, and not just between a couple teams.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:17 PM #32
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Once again:



The Yankees - for all their spending - missed the playoffs in 2008.

Again, the MLB has more parity than either the NBA or NFL.
they missed the playoffs one year? That's your big evidence?
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:22 PM #33
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There's a difference between ensuring success, and having a system in place that limits what other, small-market teams can do. Yes, you have a point, but MY point is that rather than making it so that a couple teams will always make the playoffs, it will be so teams like Jacksonville, Buffalo, and Oakland won't even have a chance.

With a salary cap, it PROMOTES parity and competition, but the fact remains that in order to be a good team, you not only have to have good players, but also a good system, you have to be able to draft well, hire the right coaches, etc.

Any team can pick any player in the draft (unless they've already been taken, obviously) or sign any free agent they want, but it doesn't matter if they can't take that player, put him in a position to play well, and groom him into YOUR system.


I think what people are speaking out against is, is that we don't want to even begin down a road that would let any of these things happen. We want to ensure that parity remains, and that competition is still high, and not just between a couple teams.
If clubs like the Marlins, Twins, Rays, and A's can make the playoffs then why can't franchises like the Bills, Jags, and Raiders do the same?

Billy Beane gave us Moneyball in the MLB. You can still find ways to win, as the Braves and A's have shown. Good organizations make successful teams, not piles of money. Ask the Mets how big spending has worked out for them.

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they missed the playoffs one year? That's your big evidence?
No. Obviously, my big evidence is the quote right above that statement, which shows that more teams have made the playoffs in the uncapped MLB than in the capped NFL.
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Old 01-17-2010, 05:55 PM #34
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You also can't compare MLB to the NFL fairly. An MLB team can't start their best pitcher every game. An NFL team can start their star QB every game and so forth. The difference in amount of games is a huge factor.
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Old 01-17-2010, 06:05 PM #35
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The MLB will have a salary cap before long anyways.
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Old 01-17-2010, 06:08 PM #36
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Old 01-17-2010, 06:13 PM #37
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Also, I wonder how an uncapped year will affect the possibility of an eventual (and hopeful) rookie salary cap/certain salaries depending on where you get picked.
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Old 01-17-2010, 06:30 PM #38
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Dallas is most profitable as a franchise, but Snyder has the largest net worth.
If Paul Allen still owns the Seahawks, he's definitely the richest owner in the NFL.
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Old 01-17-2010, 07:04 PM #39
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You can't just look at the value of the franchise. You have to take into account how much the owners actually have, and how much they're actually willing to spend. It all comes down to who wants to spend the most, not who has the most successful franchise.

Other than that i think an uncapped NFL is stupid.

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If Paul Allen still owns the Seahawks, he's definitely the richest owner in the NFL.
He does

1. Paul Allen, Seattle Seahawks
Net worth: $16.8 billion


2. Malcolm Glazer, Tampa Bay Bucs
Net worth: $2.5 billion

3. Wayne Huizenga, Miami Dolphins
Net Worth: $2.5 billion

4. Randolph Lerner, Cleveland Browns
Net Worth: $1.6 billion

5. Robert McNair, Houston Texans
Net Worth: $1.5 billion

6. Arthur Blank, Atlanta Falcons
Net Worth: $1.5 billion

7. Jerry Jones, Dallas Cowboys
Net Worth: $1.5 billion

8. Robert Kraft, New England Patriots
Net Worth: $1.4 billion

9. Steve Bisciotti, Baltimore Ravens
Net Worth: $1.3 billion

10. Daniel Snyder , Washington Redskins
Net Worth: $1 billion

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Old 01-17-2010, 08:34 PM #40
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If i recall correctly, the top 5 most profitable franchises in 2005 were Cowboys, Skins, Raiders, Patriots, and Broncos. That was obviously a few years ago now but I do remember that being the top 5 at the time and that was the last I really checked it.
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Old 01-17-2010, 10:21 PM #41
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You also can't compare MLB to the NFL fairly. An MLB team can't start their best pitcher every game. An NFL team can start their star QB every game and so forth. The difference in amount of games is a huge factor.
That's a good point, but the NFL salary cap hasn't been around forever. And you could argue that the cap hasn't stopped certain franchises from dominating since its inception in '94: Pittsburgh, New England, Indy, etc., are still perennially the teams to beat. Which kind of goes to show that it's not really the money that makes franchises successful, but rather, how well run they are. The removal of the salary cap, if anything, would create more competition for the title because big money franchises like the Cowboys, Bears, and Skins could challenge the Steelers, Patriots, and Colts.
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Old 01-17-2010, 10:33 PM #42
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Quote:
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I'm not sure I like the idea of an uncapped season. In baseball it just seems like Yankees or Boston. That would get gay if every year it was either Team A or Team B.

Well, there would be teams that could step up, but if you think a bad signing is detrimental now, wait until you see how gun shy owners get with guys like Moss, TO, etc. and older vets. It will really suck balls.

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That's a good point, but the NFL salary cap hasn't been around forever. And you could argue that the cap hasn't stopped certain franchises from dominating since its inception in '94: Pittsburgh, New England, Indy, etc., are still perennially the teams to beat. Which kind of goes to show that it's not really the money that makes franchises successful, but rather, how well run they are. The removal of the salary cap, if anything, would create more competition for the title because big money franchises like the Cowboys, Bears, and Skins could challenge the Steelers, Patriots, and Colts.



But in the same sense teams like the Cardinals, Seahawks, Texans, Saints, Jags, etc. who have all be at least competitive and in contention almost every year for the last 5 years or so out in the cold. It would all but eliminate a team like the Browns all of a sudden getting good and getting a chance to make a playoff run. I mean, the Jets were a .500 team last year, NOBODY in their right mind picked them to get to the AFC Championship game, but this is what the salary cap allows teams to do. It keeps the competitive balance in the league in a spot where any team can have success, but only few will have consistent success because they're better run.
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