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Old 01-29-2010, 03:01 PM #22
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I don't see why. It's true you would no longer need to ponder such things, but there are still plenty of things to do and enjoy. If I knew the truth it would allow me more time to enjoy my family, friends, loved ones, hockey and paintball without the stress of wondering how things will ultimately end up. I suppose that those who are true undoubting zealous believers in any religion can claim this kind of peace as they believe they know the truth. For me such a belief is impossible because I would always know that I am only fooling myself.
For me, life would not be worth living. My all-consuming passion, knowledge and truth, would be gone.
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You want the truth?
You can't handle the truth!
I'm very well aware of that...
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Old 01-29-2010, 11:25 PM #23
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Thumbs up Real Truth is objective not subjective

I made a similar decision when I was 20 and it took me a little over a year to find the truth I was looking for but because of that Truth I have been shaped into the man I am today.
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Old 01-29-2010, 11:39 PM #24
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I made a similar decision when I was 20 and it took me a little over a year to find the truth I was looking for but because of that Truth I have been shaped into the man I am today.
I have found this truth you speak of, about 3 years ago. I am convinced that there is more though. God wouldn't give so much knowledge and so very different thoughts if there wasn't some truth to be contained within them all. This I am sure of. Why would God only want us to look at him with only one of his attributes, or from only one point of view?
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Old 01-30-2010, 07:51 AM #25
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There are nuggets of truth contained elsewhere in the world. Be it anything from media to religion. But those are only nuggets and not the whole picture. There is one God, one transubstantiate sacrifice, and therefore only one Truth. The thing about Truth, real Truth at least, is that it doesn't care about what people want to believe or the walls they build to keep it out. It is still Truth and all the lies in the world can not sway it, can not change it,and can not detract nor add to it. That's the thing about Truth by its very nature of being True there can be only one objective Truth whether we like it or not. Everything else is false.
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Old 01-30-2010, 10:04 AM #26
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There are nuggets of truth contained elsewhere in the world. Be it anything from media to religion. But those are only nuggets and not the whole picture. There is one God, one transubstantiate sacrifice, and therefore only one Truth. The thing about Truth, real Truth at least, is that it doesn't care about what people want to believe or the walls they build to keep it out. It is still Truth and all the lies in the world can not sway it, can not change it,and can not detract nor add to it. That's the thing about Truth by its very nature of being True there can be only one objective Truth whether we like it or not. Everything else is false.
Tell me, sir, what makes you even think you know something called "truth"?
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Old 01-30-2010, 11:47 PM #27
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There are nuggets of truth contained elsewhere in the world. Be it anything from media to religion. But those are only nuggets and not the whole picture. There is one God, one transubstantiate sacrifice, and therefore only one Truth. The thing about Truth, real Truth at least, is that it doesn't care about what people want to believe or the walls they build to keep it out. It is still Truth and all the lies in the world can not sway it, can not change it,and can not detract nor add to it. That's the thing about Truth by its very nature of being True there can be only one objective Truth whether we like it or not. Everything else is false.
I once did believe in objective truth. I might still. I'm not sure. All I know is that I need to find my own truth and know that any truth I find may not be others' truth.
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Old 01-31-2010, 02:16 AM #28
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I once did believe in objective truth. I might still. I'm not sure. All I know is that I need to find my own truth and know that any truth I find may not be others' truth.
I'm pretty sure if you are looking for truth that is your "own" truth you've crossed over the bridge of objective truth.

Though I'm not saying that objective truth can't be subjective (usually it is) but when you approach an objective subject and are trying to figure out what "you" can get out of it then objectivity doesn't matter.

One time a girl in my english arts class listened to a poem and she told the teacher that you could find your own meaning in the poem. In reality, the author had a specific goal for the reader to think about (some historical battle or something). Anyway, the teacher yelled at the student. She deserved it because the author had an objective regardless of the subjective outlook one would have on it.

Good luck.
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Old 01-31-2010, 03:22 AM #29
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I'm pretty sure if you are looking for truth that is your "own" truth you've crossed over the bridge of objective truth.

Though I'm not saying that objective truth can't be subjective (usually it is) but when you approach an objective subject and are trying to figure out what "you" can get out of it then objectivity doesn't matter.

One time a girl in my english arts class listened to a poem and she told the teacher that you could find your own meaning in the poem. In reality, the author had a specific goal for the reader to think about (some historical battle or something). Anyway, the teacher yelled at the student. She deserved it because the author had an objective regardless of the subjective outlook one would have on it.

Good luck.
yelled? hmph.

Just because the author(or artist, or creator) has a purpose, reason, or message behind their work does not mean that it is either the sole or most profound one. It may not even be the correct one.
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Old 01-31-2010, 10:27 AM #30
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I'm pretty sure if you are looking for truth that is your "own" truth you've crossed over the bridge of objective truth.

Though I'm not saying that objective truth can't be subjective (usually it is) but when you approach an objective subject and are trying to figure out what "you" can get out of it then objectivity doesn't matter.

One time a girl in my english arts class listened to a poem and she told the teacher that you could find your own meaning in the poem. In reality, the author had a specific goal for the reader to think about (some historical battle or something). Anyway, the teacher yelled at the student. She deserved it because the author had an objective regardless of the subjective outlook one would have on it.

Good luck.
I like to think in terms of abstract art. I have done a few abstract pieces before, and they have meaning for me, but I would like everyone who sees them to find their own meaning for it.
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Old 01-31-2010, 11:44 AM #31
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Wait, I don't get it. I thought the best way to do this was to just live life, and acquire your own perspectives and outlooks through kindness, experience, and eventually wisdom?

While I'm all for pilgramages and such as a way to gain experience, I think it's kind of silly to "define" yourself and your beliefs. We are all dynamic beings, and whatever conclusions you reach now will likely change in 5 years along with the knowlege and perspectives you gain with new life experience.

Defining your beliefs as absolute seems awefully restrictive. Probably why I see most religions as pretty silly. If you're not doing that, I'd say scrap the whole thing and go do some community service. Or go backpacking. Or visit a new country. Spend time with people that grew up in circumstances wildly different from your own. Heck, it can be as simple as eating something you've never tried before.

But I think that might have been what you were trying to get at with your first post?
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Old 02-01-2010, 01:06 AM #32
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yelled? hmph.

Just because the author(or artist, or creator) has a purpose, reason, or message behind their work does not mean that it is either the sole or most profound one. It may not even be the correct one.
you are utterly misguided

if someone creates something, you can interpret it "SLIGHTLY" different ways. but, thats just it, you only slightly change the message, so it is easier for you to grasp and comprehend . Imagining a totally different purpose than what the creator has made, is not the correct purpose for that "thing" or object, because that is not what it was designed for. you can attempt to use something for a totally different purpose than it was not designed, but it would hardly work nearly as well as simply taking another object in which its abilities fit the requirements that you are subjecting your original object to.
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Old 02-01-2010, 06:16 AM #33
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you are utterly misguided

if someone creates something, you can interpret it "SLIGHTLY" different ways. but, thats just it, you only slightly change the message, so it is easier for you to grasp and comprehend . Imagining a totally different purpose than what the creator has made, is not the correct purpose for that "thing" or object, because that is not what it was designed for. you can attempt to use something for a totally different purpose than it was not designed, but it would hardly work nearly as well as simply taking another object in which its abilities fit the requirements that you are subjecting your original object to.


The artworld respectfully disagrees.
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Old 02-01-2010, 02:17 PM #34
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yelled? hmph.

Just because the author(or artist, or creator) has a purpose, reason, or message behind their work does not mean that it is either the sole or most profound one. It may not even be the correct one.
Maybe yelled is a bit harsh. It was more of a stern suggestion that the student was wrong. And the student was wrong because she went way off in left field while interpreting and suggesting what the poem meant. She then said something about getting any meaning you wanted out of literature which isn't the case. The professor is a major English and super smart. But it was a poem about a historical event that the author had a an intention in writing about that historical event. It was written in a time and a place in order to convey a meaning to the reader about that event.

Abstract art is different as the creator might have the idea of "get your own meaning" but most literature is not "get your own meaning".

Nostradamus comes to mind with his cryptic critiques of historical events he lived within. Many people have taken those to mean apocalyptic foresight but taken in context of the writing there isn't any other meaning than seeing the critique of his government (mostly). Regardless of what meaning "you" want there are ways to study literature to come to better understanding of what it really means.
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Old 02-01-2010, 11:47 PM #35
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Abstract art is different as the creator might have the idea of "get your own meaning" but most literature is not "get your own meaning".
.
No, literature is not, but which example is a better analogy of truth? Also, isn't it possible for one to understand the meaning of the author in his work and then still find their own meaning in it?
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Old 02-03-2010, 11:51 AM #36
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No, literature is not, but which example is a better analogy of truth? Also, isn't it possible for one to understand the meaning of the author in his work and then still find their own meaning in it?
Well we'd have to define meaning which could take a while.

I'd rather say you can find your own insights on how to deal with the literature.

Say a character is dealing with drug addiction in a certain context. The author had a reason to tell that story (to progress the story/develop character/get a point across) but that doesn't mean we can't have some insightful experience from reading it.

It doesn't change the meaning of the literature but it does mean that we can extrapolate changes within ourselves from that meaning.

I'm not saying you can't be subjective with literature I just believe that most authors have an intent with what they are writing and if you approach their writing to get your own meaning you are doing a disservice of why they even wrote it to begin with. As a writer I'd be offended. Now if you dealt with it, "This is what the author was saying but this is an insight I have from it" then I don't see a problem with that.
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Old 02-03-2010, 12:19 PM #37
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i smell a lot of ****ty logic in this thread.

"i might still believe there is an objective truth"
"I found teh truth when i was 20"

are you guys ****ing serious? stop acting like there is any substance in anything you have to say. you know nothing.
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