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Old 10-08-2009, 04:09 PM #1
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Economics of .50

Let's get some expert advice on why .50 is cheaper.

this is the simple math that I understand to be true.

40% smaller ball=40% less materials=40% less weight=40% less shipping costs=savings through every level of the market while maintaining the same supply.

I know it is not THAT simple but it gives the general idea of how .50 is cheaper.

Are there any economists that play the sport of paintball here?
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Old 10-08-2009, 04:58 PM #2
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Originally Posted by jackjcc View Post
Let's get some expert advice on why .50 is cheaper.

this is the simple math that I understand to be true.

40% smaller ball=40% less materials=40% less weight=40% less shipping costs=savings through every level of the market while maintaining the same supply.

I know it is not THAT simple but it gives the general idea of how .50 is cheaper.

Are there any economists that play the sport of paintball here?
It's actually 60% smaller, but who's counting. 60% less material will not translate into 60% savings because there are plenty of fixed costs associated with selling paintballs. And with the overall cost reduction per ball, paint manufacturers might be looking at reduced total revenue.

Also, the cost of shipping and raw materials does not likely scale with the increasing price of higher grades of paint. For example, a $80 box of Ultra Evil doesn't use any more raw materials or cost any more to ship than a $35 box of Triumph.

I'm guessing that we're going to see about a $10 reduction in price per 2000 paintballs. So a 4000-count case of Triumph might cost $50, and a 4000-count case of high end stuff might cost $120.
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Old 10-08-2009, 05:04 PM #3
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Old 10-08-2009, 05:33 PM #4
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It's actually 60% smaller, but who's counting. 60% less material will not translate into 60% savings because there are plenty of fixed costs associated with selling paintballs. And with the overall cost reduction per ball, paint manufacturers might be looking at reduced total revenue.

Also, the cost of shipping and raw materials does not likely scale with the increasing price of higher grades of paint. For example, a $80 box of Ultra Evil doesn't use any more raw materials or cost any more to ship than a $35 box of Triumph.

I'm guessing that we're going to see about a $10 reduction in price per 2000 paintballs. So a 4000-count case of Triumph might cost $50, and a 4000-count case of high end stuff might cost $120.
This is what I would predict. And it is crap.
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Old 10-08-2009, 05:37 PM #5
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This is what I would predict. And it is crap.
Why is it crap to save $10-20 per practice? A year of that and you basically paid your way to World Cup.
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Originally posted by matt00iconoclast:
"there are variables outside of physics that will affect the flight of the ball"
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Old 10-08-2009, 05:49 PM #6
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the fixed costs have to be less than the variable costs. the major cost should be associated with the materials because they are variable. if you can cut about 60% of your materials out you should stand to save large amounts of money.
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Old 10-08-2009, 05:53 PM #7
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the fixed costs have to be less than the variable costs. the major cost should be associated with the materials because they are variable. if you can cut about 60% of your materials out you should stand to save large amounts of money.
I think that depends on what grade of paint you're talking about. I am assuming (perhaps wrongly), that the major cost associated with high grade paint is quality control. But I'd also guess that a good part of the pricing difference is pure marketing. Those things aren't going to change.

It probably only currently takes about $10 worth of materials to manufacture a case of paint, and maybe $10 dollars to ship it to the retailer.

So there's not a lot of room for cutting.
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Originally posted by matt00iconoclast:
"there are variables outside of physics that will affect the flight of the ball"
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Old 10-08-2009, 06:39 PM #8
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Shiping is like $80 per skid. you will get about 3000 paintballs for $10 more than you pay now..
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Old 10-08-2009, 06:54 PM #9
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Let's get some expert advice on why .50 is cheaper.

this is the simple math that I understand to be true.

40% smaller ball=40% less materials=40% less weight=40% less shipping costs=savings through every level of the market while maintaining the same supply.

I know it is not THAT simple but it gives the general idea of how .50 is cheaper.

Are there any economists that play the sport of paintball here?
Well how come the 43 caliber paint for the Spyder pistols cost 30.00 for 800rounds?That is way more expensive then the 68cal paint.Google it and see how much it cost.
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Old 10-08-2009, 07:06 PM #10
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Another thing that seems to be left out of the talks of price reduction. Note this is not my thoughts just some of what I am seeing. To actually see the price go down the field owners are the ones that will have to lower their price. Many places may still charge the same price for 500 .50 cal balls as they do for 500 .68 cal balls. You have seen many fields increase the cost of paint in effort to reduce the amount of shooting going on. Pretty sure they are not going to want to reverse that trend. They want their new customers to become return customers. High rate of fire and over shooting kills the return customer. Me personally I am fore rate of fire caps and if I can reduce the cost of paint with .50 cal and bring in more customers and have them play more often, I'm game.
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Old 10-08-2009, 07:29 PM #11
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Another thing that seems to be left out of the talks of price reduction. Note this is not my thoughts just some of what I am seeing. To actually see the price go down the field owners are the ones that will have to lower their price. Many places may still charge the same price for 500 .50 cal balls as they do for 500 .68 cal balls. You have seen many fields increase the cost of paint in effort to reduce the amount of shooting going on. Pretty sure they are not going to want to reverse that trend. They want their new customers to become return customers. High rate of fire and over shooting kills the return customer. Me personally I am fore rate of fire caps and if I can reduce the cost of paint with .50 cal and bring in more customers and have them play more often, I'm game.
In that case, the lower paint cost will be a benefit for the field owners, which is fine by me.

I have no idea whether the GI Milsim people are really trying to help the sport, or just line their pockets. I'd like to think that they can do both -- help the sport and get rich at the same time. That's pretty much what the American way is all about.

For the time being, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.
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"there are variables outside of physics that will affect the flight of the ball"
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Old 10-08-2009, 07:42 PM #12
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Shiping is like $80 per skid. you will get about 3000 paintballs for $10 more than you pay now..
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:14 PM #13
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.50 Cal will not save me enough money to justify the cost of purchasing a new marker, hopper and barrel kit. I shoot two cases of paint a month, 3 if I play a tournament that month. Saving an average of $10 per case, playing 4 tournaments a year, I'd save about $280 per year.

How much will it cost for a new Ego w/ .50 cal kit, how about a .50 cal impulse? Rotor w/ .50 cal upgrade? If I bought one of those, it'd be about 5 years before I break even. After that, I'd be saving an additional $280 per year. So if I go out and buy an Ego10 and Rotor right now, in 6 years I'll have saved $280. Will that $280 cover the cost of all of my equipment that is now completely worthless? No, not even close. It'd be several more years before that happened, so now what, I'm looking at 8+ years before I finally break even.

How about if I decide to stick with my .68 equipment? Obviously, if .50 cal takes off, the price of .68 will rise. Since fewer people would be using .68 cal paint, the deliveries will be smaller. If it costs $100 for a shipment of paint, and they're shipping 50 cases, it will add $2 to the cost of each case of paint to account for shipping. But, now people are using .50 cal, so their order for .68 cal paint is only going to be for 25 cases now. Distribute the $100 amongst each case of paint, and the cost to ship each case just went from $2 to $4 per case. How about the cost to produce .68 cal paint? They're going to be making less of it now that part of their attention is on .50 cal. It costs money to run the machines that churn the paint out. If they're making less of it, they need to charge more for it to be able to pay the cost of running the machines. If I want to keep playing .68 cal, I'll be paying for it at a higher wholesale price and I'll be paying more for shipping.

What if .50 cal DOES flop? Well now you've got a handful of paint manufacturers that just spent a lot of time and money on paint that people don't want. They're going to lose money on the whole damn thing. How are they going to account for the money they lost? Raise their prices on their .68 cal paint. Once again, I'm stuck paying more money.

If the industry decides to make my .68 cal equipment obsolete, then I'll just give them back all of their .68 cal paint.....at 320 feet per second.
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:17 PM #14
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there is no way they will change it everyones equiptment would become obsolite including the trillions of dollars worth of guns hoppers barrels squeeges ect
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:38 PM #15
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im not sure if your were serious or not but paintball in no way shape or form is any where close to a trillion dollar industry there is not even close to a trillion dollars of paintball equipment that would become obsolete
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:39 PM #16
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Trillions of dollars? I didn't think paintball was THAT big lol...
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:48 PM #17
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:48 PM #18
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my opinion is the economy has only been declining for 2 yrs and now their going to change the whole industry to keep up with a relatively small market hiccup (in the grand scheme of things) their going to spend a lot of money and make you spend a lot of money and when the economy recovers and people can play again all your expensive 50 cal stuff is going to go away because its going to hurt more and be less effective. its a scam if you ask me. think of it this way the current economy has forced a lot of people to ask them selfs what can i really spend. now if someone is a player and they looked at their finances and said i cant afford to play hitting them with a new gun and hopper is more than enough to turn them off completely. your going to confuse newer players what if they get .68 stuff not knowing its going out of style that turns them off. the only people that are going to be able to afford newer 50 cal stuff are the people who can already afford the 68. and then what the hell is the point?

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Old 10-08-2009, 10:49 PM #19
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Trillions of dollars? I didn't think paintball was THAT big lol...
his avy says it all...
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Old 10-08-2009, 10:56 PM #20
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This is going to hurt field owners, one way or another. Buying an entire new fleet of rental equipment won't be cheap, and I'm willing to bet most fields don't have the money to deal with that right now.

What are they supposed to do? Buy a few at a time? What if .50 cal never materializes and they purchased .50 cal rental markers? They lose money. What if it does? What do they do with all of their .68 guns? They lose money.

It's a lose/lose scenario for field owners, especially the smaller ones that only get a few rec groups each weekend. Way to **** on the little guys
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Old 10-08-2009, 11:08 PM #21
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Smart field owners will not change over till the time is right and they know this is the only future for paintball. If you jump in both feet 1st without testing the water, you are a fool.
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