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Old 08-11-2009, 10:39 AM #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hsilman View Post
other than "probability" because of the number of stars, we have pretty much absolutely no reason to believe in either the existence of alien life and even less that they have come anywhere near us.

the irony of the number of atheists who believe there is some other form of life out there is quite hilarious.

I don't believe either way, but I don't see any reason its not possible.

I do not see irony at all there. That makes absolutely no sense at all.

In fact, it's usually these super devout folk that refuse to believe that life exists beyond our solar system or even planet. They ****ing believe the Earth is 6,000 years old....

Yeah, you're a ****ing idiot buddy.
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Old 08-11-2009, 10:42 AM #23
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Originally Posted by warbeak2099 View Post
I do love the fact that since we can't explain what created the Nazca lines, people jump right to, "Aliens did it!"

That being said, it's very probable that extraterrestrial life exists somewhere beyond our galaxy. The planets of the Gliese 581 planetary system (remember when they found that blue/green planet that's 20.5 light years away?) clearly shows that alien life is more than likely to exist out there. Aliens exist? Most likely. Aliens have visited Earth and screwed around with us positively or negatively? Probably not.
why is it likely aliens exist? why does the existence of blue/green planets make it more likely? How can we make any quantitative statement about the likelihood of life anywhere?

serious qeustion, I don't understand how we keep saying "probably" or what reason there is for that, except some appeal to "vastness of the universe".
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Old 08-11-2009, 10:59 AM #24
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there is possibly a great number of chances for life to exist.

there is absolutely no proof or reason to believe life exists.

it's a fine line, but for a lot of other topics, that's an important distinction. Just making sure it's maintained in here is all.
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Old 08-11-2009, 12:54 PM #25
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Really? what are we weighing the probability against, exactly?

you are saying it is more likely than not, but I don't see the rationale behind that decision.
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Old 08-11-2009, 12:55 PM #26
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Originally Posted by Big_Dangerous View Post
I do not see irony at all there. That makes absolutely no sense at all.

In fact, it's usually these super devout folk that refuse to believe that life exists beyond our solar system or even planet. They ****ing believe the Earth is 6,000 years old....

Yeah, you're a ****ing idiot buddy.


If you deny their being a God because of no reason or evidence to believe so, why would you believe in aliens when there is no credible evidence to even suggest their existence?
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:05 PM #27
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All I see is some stupid *** picture you loaded and a long *** rant you typed that pretty much means nothing. Lots of planets =/= life. I believe life is completely unique to earth
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:08 PM #28
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Originally Posted by warbeak2099 View Post
I do love the fact that since we can't explain what created the Nazca lines, people jump right to, "Aliens did it!"
We actually can explain it. The feat has been duplicated.

As for aliens, it's possible that they exist, that they've visited the Earth, and even that they might still be here. How else can you explain people like Eminem and Sarah Palin?
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:12 PM #29
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Originally Posted by SuperSupra619 View Post
I believe life is completely unique to earth
So you criticize one person for jumping to conclusions based on shady evidence, and then....

But here's are two more interesting question for everyone, because nobody knows the answer to the first one
whether they think they do are:

1. Do you want/hope for there to be intelligent life elsewhere in the galaxy and why?
2. Do you want/hope for them to visit us during your lifetime, and why?

Last edited by Spock : 08-11-2009 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:22 PM #30
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why?

we know it happened, we have a pretty good idea how it happened, and there is nothing suggesting that given the same conditions, it wont happen again.

pretty damn simple to me.

Exactly, since you love talking about probability, the probability that another planet went through the EXACT same conditions as Earth is MUCH MUCH lower then whatever number you posted. If you want to say that life is "different" on other planets then I am not sure what you mean by "life". As far as we know life as we know it can exist only on the conditions that we have here on earth. If those conditions don't resemble earths almost exact then life can not be supported.

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1. Do you want/hope for there to be intelligent life elsewhere in the galaxy and why?
2. Do you want/hope for them to visit us during your lifetime, and why?
1. I would not want their to be intelligent life elsewhere because that would give me the impression that I am just another life form on another random planet, which would take away my belief in mankind's purpose in this universe.

2. No, same reason above

Last edited by SuperSupra619 : 08-11-2009 at 01:27 PM.
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:41 PM #31
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Originally Posted by SuperSupra619 View Post
Exactly, since you love talking about probability, the probability that another planet went through the EXACT same conditions as Earth is MUCH MUCH lower then whatever number you posted. If you want to say that life is "different" on other planets then I am not sure what you mean by "life". As far as we know life as we know it can exist only on the conditions that we have here on earth. If those conditions don't resemble earths almost exact then life can not be supported.



1. I would not want their to be intelligent life elsewhere because that would give me the impression that I am just another life form on another random planet, which would take away my belief in mankind's purpose in this universe.

2. No, same reason above
What do you believe mankind's purpose is in the universe, and how would that be any less viable if there were thousands of other "mankinds" in the universe with us? For instance, do you believe that your purpose as an individual person is cheapened by the fact that there are more than 6 billion other people just here on Earth?
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:55 PM #32
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I'm a Muslim so that answers a bunch of your questions. It should also be noted that Islam takes no stance on the idea of alien life, it doesn't explicitly deny it or say it exists, but there are parts of the text that leave the idea open for interpretation. So my beliefs are not formed around Islam's stance but more my own understanding
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Old 08-11-2009, 02:03 PM #33
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Originally Posted by SuperSupra619 View Post
All I see is some stupid *** picture you loaded and a long *** rant you typed that pretty much means nothing. Lots of planets =/= life. I believe life is completely unique to earth
You really just need to shut the **** up. All you do is ***** ***** *****. Apparently you don't ****ing understand. The more planets there are, the higher the probability of their being other life in the universe. Do I need to explain this for you? You can not assess probabilities to the existence of God. The point here is, because there are so many planets we can get a general idea of the likelihood of there being other life out there.
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Old 08-11-2009, 02:09 PM #34
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Originally Posted by SuperSupra619 View Post

1. I would not want their to be intelligent life elsewhere because that would give me the impression that I am just another life form on another random planet, which would take away my belief in mankind's purpose in this universe.

2. No, same reason above
Someone wants to feel special. You are just another life form on this planet. Look around you at Trillions of creatures living here just on this planet. Do you have any concept of how miniscule you are in comparison to this world? To the universe?
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Old 08-11-2009, 02:15 PM #35
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You really just need to shut the **** up. All you do is ***** ***** *****. Apparently you don't ****ing understand. The more planets there are, the higher the probability of their being other life in the universe. Do I need to explain this for you? You can not assess probabilities to the existence of God. The point here is, because there are so many planets we can get a general idea of the likelihood of there being other life out there.
I disagree. I think assigning a term like "more probable" or "less probable" is a misnomer. Saying it's "likely" that there is other life is a misnomer.

It's possible. period. There is no statistical way to express it as "more likely". more planets do not necessarily equal more likely for there to be life mathematically. Especially if you take a stance that "life may form in ways we don't even know in conditions we don't understand". That's true, but that just means it can come from anything anywhere, it doesn't lend validity to the statement "more probable than not that there is other life".

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Originally Posted by Spock View Post
So you criticize one person for jumping to conclusions based on shady evidence, and then....

But here's are two more interesting question for everyone, because nobody knows the answer to the first one
whether they think they do are:

1. Do you want/hope for there to be intelligent life elsewhere in the galaxy and why?
2. Do you want/hope for them to visit us during your lifetime, and why?
I like this direction, Spock.

I don't know how I feel. I suppose I would find it interesting/cool, but I wouldn't say I "want/hope" for it. Doesn't really matter to me. Same for the "in our lifetime."

As far as religious people, I don't understand why it matters if there is life elsewhere. your religious books are about human kinds relationship with God. perhaps the aliens are still living in the way God created them in perfect harmony with their creator being. Who the hell knows. but they certainly don't need the salvation of Jesus or Muhammed or whatever.
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Old 08-11-2009, 03:09 PM #36
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Originally Posted by SuperSupra619 View Post


If you deny their being a God because of no reason or evidence to believe so, why would you believe in aliens when there is no credible evidence to even suggest their existence?


Dumbest question. Ever.
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Old 08-11-2009, 04:14 PM #37
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Originally Posted by hsilman View Post
other than "probability" because of the number of stars, we have pretty much absolutely no reason to believe in either the existence of alien life and even less that they have come anywhere near us.

the irony of the number of atheists who believe there is some other form of life out there is quite hilarious.

I don't believe either way, but I don't see any reason its not possible.
The point is the probability of it most likely happening. A smart person would say something like more likely then not it exists. Just based off of probability. Just like a smart atheist would say more likely then not god doesn't exist. No one knows for sure, it would be extremely arrogant to say either way.

The word is probably, not "**** YAH THERES ALIENS, but there is not god at all trust me"
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Old 08-11-2009, 08:36 PM #38
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Originally Posted by hsilman View Post
there is possibly a great number of chances for life to exist.

there is absolutely no proof or reason to believe life exists.

it's a fine line, but for a lot of other topics, that's an important distinction. Just making sure it's maintained in here is all.
There's no proof of other minds either, but it's relatively obvious they exist. Do you want to go down that road? Half kidding.

You're taking the philosophical approach over the astrophysics approach. Unfortunately, astrophysics dominates this one straight up. Virtually every astrophysicist in the world will tell you it is extremely likely that extraterrestrial life exists. Are they biased? Of course, but their claims are far from baseless and far more credible than any of ours.

I understand your arguments. They make sense and I won't toss them aside just because I disagree, like a few others have in this thread. Yes there is no proof of extraterrestrial life, however, there is proof of other things. We know there are other planets. We know there are other planets that contain rock, water, and oxygen. We know there are other planets within the "habitable zone" of stars. And we know that there are trillions upon trillions upon trillion of other planets. This infers a high probability of the existence of extraterrestrial life, and that's barring the possibility of non carbon based life forms, etc...

I know you're saying that we have nothing to compare ourselves to and therefore we cannot say alien existence is more probable than not. I disagree. I'll put forth this conditional If life naturally occurred on Earth, then extraterrestrial life almost certainly exists. And if it did not naturally occur, that still does not rule out alien life. The odds of at least one form of life not existing outside Earth seem astronomical. Even the most ridiculous things can occur when we're talking about one or a few times out of TRILLIONS.

It seems as though everything in the universe started out at one point, exploded, and (on the small scale) gravity pulled things together into stars planets, etc.. Our planet formed in the exact same way. Why on earth (pun intended) would we believe our planet is unique in the vastness?
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:07 AM #39
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why is it likely aliens exist?
Because we know of planets with conditions that are favorable for life to exist. We already know that various strains of bacteria survive on Mars. That's an "alien" life form. A planet with vegetation and water clearly sports an ecosystem and most likely houses several species of organisms. That's what I mean when I say "alien". I don't necessarily mean some super awesome advanced life-form.
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Old 08-12-2009, 01:52 AM #40
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There are FAR too many galaxies for life to NOT exist. Do i believe they have visited earth? Maybe. I'm not quite sure, because television influence my beliefs on that. (documentaries on discovery and ****)

Also, you do realize that new galaxies could possibly have new elements? These elements could be far more powerful than anything on earth, not to mention the lifeforms there could be super-evolved organisms also.

I would love for aliens to visit earth. Whether it be independence day, or just saying hello we DO exist.
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:09 AM #41
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Transformers.

They're real.

that is all.
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Old 08-12-2009, 04:18 AM #42
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There Earth has been here what, 5 billion years? There is no possible way to know what happened thousands of years ago let alone billions.
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