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Old 04-06-2015, 07:34 AM #1
LlabtniapYalp
 
 
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Alright, which one of you ******** did this?

So after being out of paintball for two years, I returned to my local field to play. To my disappointment, they got rid of their speedball field which was my favorite. I asked one of the employees why they did that. The employee said it "attracted a bad crowd." Alright, which one of you ******** caused my favorite field to get torn down?
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Old 04-15-2015, 11:58 AM #2
Tajue17
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Happened here at PnL paintball, asked about it and the girl that works there said its now a field for fun paintball only.

ex pro Buddy from infamous and hurricanes who works the counter must vommit alot because theres no more walk on speedball play, which is alot of fun if you have even enough squads.
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Old 04-15-2015, 02:00 PM #3
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More and more, I see fields taking out speedball type fields for this exact reason. As we grow in experience as players, we should remember that we all started out as that renter, that person who bought equipment without knowing what we were getting, that friend at a bachelor party that didn't know what the day would be, and got hooked. Odds are, we had a decent experience the first few times we played, or we wouldn't be back. As experienced players, it's up to us to pay it forward, and make sure that when we're at a field, those first timers have a good time playing... or they won't be back.

Additionally, experienced players really need to get it through our heads that the fields are a business, and they're not in existence solely to provide us a speedball field, air fills, the best paint at rec paint prices, and such. Renters are not seals to be clubbed. Find yourself out there playing against renters? Take off your powered hopper and run a gravity hopper. Better yet, pick up a pump and play that way with (and against) them.

It's supposed to be fun. For everyone. When one group of people screw that equation up, I'd remove them from the equation as a field owner, too.
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Old 04-15-2015, 10:16 PM #4
Clark Gryphyn
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More and more, I see fields taking out speedball type fields for this exact reason. As we grow in experience as players, we should remember that we all started out as that renter, that person who bought equipment without knowing what we were getting, that friend at a bachelor party that didn't know what the day would be, and got hooked. Odds are, we had a decent experience the first few times we played, or we wouldn't be back. As experienced players, it's up to us to pay it forward, and make sure that when we're at a field, those first timers have a good time playing... or they won't be back.

Additionally, experienced players really need to get it through our heads that the fields are a business, and they're not in existence solely to provide us a speedball field, air fills, the best paint at rec paint prices, and such. Renters are not seals to be clubbed. Find yourself out there playing against renters? Take off your powered hopper and run a gravity hopper. Better yet, pick up a pump and play that way with (and against) them.

It's supposed to be fun. For everyone. When one group of people screw that equation up, I'd remove them from the equation as a field owner, too.
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Old 04-15-2015, 10:55 PM #5
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... Take off your powered hopper and run a gravity hopper. Better yet, pick up a pump and play that way with (and against) them...
I can't run the gravity hopper anymore. I need at least a Halo for even my 98C, otherwise I feel like I'm running on flat tires, I guess it's a personal problem. I don't think I'll be able to rent a mask anymore, it's something you don't share... just like a wetsuit...
Is that a problem? Don't think so. Also, I'm always friendly to rentals, take my time explaining things to them, and when I walk on, i usually try to get assigned to the least experienced team.
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Old 04-16-2015, 06:44 AM #6
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Mask is one thing. Leveling the field to give first timers a good day is entirely different.

I get wanting to make sure you don't get a "blank" shot. They suck. I run powered hoppers on my pumps for that very reason. But in that case, I'm shooting a gun that's got a vastly lower rate of fire. Know what scares the heck out of a new player? The guy with the thousand+ dollar setup that is capable of rates of fire beyond what they can even imagine. An electronic gun should actually be easier to run a gravity hopper on than a mechanical, because it'll have eyes.

It's everyone's individual choice how they want to interact with other players, and the fields they're playing at. I've got a certain way of adjusting my play style and gear choices. It's probably not right for everyone, and that's fine, as long as people aren't out there "seal clubbing" new players.
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Old 04-16-2015, 07:54 AM #7
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One of my local fields got rid of their speedball field too. They made the call to reduce the physical fighting, verbal abuse, maintanance, and promote the field more to the new players.

Whenever I go to a field I gauge how the players are playing. If I am playing with a more experienced crowd I play just as hard as they do with similar equipment (noted a bit older gear). If it is somewhat experienced, I lower the rate of fire and make more "stupid crazy" moves for fun.

More times than not, we have the new players that can count how many times they have walked on to a paintball field on one hand. For that I always have my pump available.

For the absolute first timers that are barely of age, I find it amusing to just run back and forth on the field without my marker and see how many times they can hit me.
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Old 04-16-2015, 02:53 PM #8
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i feel like chiming in on this one too...

speedball is just a format and i think that it is not necessarily the problem. ive met a lot of speedball guys that are great players.

but heres the thing, to some people, even if you are financially well off, a 70 dollar blowback, 3 dollar grav hopper, 20 dollar co2 tank and paint for the day is already a good bit of money to be playing a game of cowboys and indians (yes, that is what we are doing).

and then they get to the field, and not only do the experienced guys have guns that are more accurate, ergonomic and efficient, they also sling paint at a level that a beginner would probably not even expect. if you pay all that money and have a bad time, why would you come back...

i bring a lot of new people, or players that havent been to the field in a while, and i also talk to the beginners and renters at the field. they dont fear getting shot, they talk about getting lit up. and i dont blame them cause i get overshot at least once every time i play, it seems.

im pretty frustrated, because the last time i played, the refs that usually do a great job splitting up teams let a few buddies that all had electros on one team, and on our side, we got stuck with all semis. we lost every time.

was the other team just more skilled? maybe, but it really seems like the high ROF allowed them to employ tactics we couldnt. usually if i cant engage a player because hes outshooting me, ill move and call out his position. but when we were getting outshot by every player it was different. snapshot battles, i got off three or four and got back ten. if i got a lane my way i had to just wait on the edge of the bunker for movement but i couldnt stick my head back out. and this was just my experience, i wonder how lame it was for the newbies. and as i walked off i see a guy practicing walking the trigger literally as fast as he could, lol.

i feel like its the rate of fire that has the "keeping up with the jones's" effect in paintball over anything else. from walk on play all the way up to the tournaments. hell after that weekend i want to get a response trigger if a bunch of nerds show up that think lighting up newbies is cool, again. kind of lame that its gotten to that level because i have a perfectly decent set up for rec play really. i also notice that paintball seems to have a high "quit rate" where people sell every bit of their gear, i wonder how many bad experiences led to that?

feel free to disagree with my rant, its just food for thought, and maybe i am oversimplifying it. but i definitely feel that if we saw more mandatory lowered ROF rules, newbies might have a little more fun and we might get some more profits in paintball so we can keep the industry going.
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Old 04-16-2015, 03:15 PM #9
Tajue17
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agree if the ROF was a mandatory 10bps things would be so much better BUT it means not selling as much paint..... a smart field would see the investment in a low ROF and friendly atmosphere a greedy OR struggling field wouldn't.

the refs play a huge part in this also, maybe its their all kids too and just there to maintain sponsorship or they have a paint deal who knows but they need to be more involved focusing on the new players when there is a mix at places where there is a problem,, they need to be checking the deads for too many hits and finding who did it, with me a penalty would be using a gravity fed loader after the first warning or go home.

I'm older and I have played many times with kids and I just let them shoot me out they love it, I'll usually run in but not shooting and let them shoot me they luv it.

with all that being said I wish the speed ball fields would stay, speed ball though is fast shooting so we all had to learn it somewhere.. doesn't mean we got bullied but everyone here in this entire website knows that format and when we first tried we either liked it or we didn't,,, kids need to be mentored in though, and no bunkering but that's what the refs do here they will warn you if your down to one left and hes new and you go easy look for the pack to hit.

there is one thing though as far as I know everyone is capped at 15 now my first season in 2000 before they banned ramping I got bunkered hard and got 4 holes in my back and from that same burst two pods in my pack got the bottoms that where sticking out the top smashed off that's how hot this guy was shooting, walking off the field I could feel the blood going down my back and down my butt crack and ever since then I hated the people who purposely try to hurt people on any field, I don't look the other way when I see someone being a jerk.

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Old 04-16-2015, 07:10 PM #10
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speedball is just a format and i think that it is not necessarily the problem. ive met a lot of speedball guys that are great players.
Agree with ya, I have seen terrible people in woodsball, urban, heck all types of fields. When they blatantly do something wrong they blame the person who got overshot, pointblank shot or wronged in any way. They call them names and make a big scene of it, it is really quite disturbing.
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Old 04-16-2015, 10:15 PM #11
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...Also, I'm always friendly to rentals, take my time explaining things to them, and when I walk on, i usually try to get assigned to the least experienced team.
This is the case where the format and gear wouldn't matter, you're being the exception to the rule (in the good way). This is what it takes to keep players coming back, and want to get their friends involved and so forth. I've seen kids where something as little as telling them about your setup makes their eyes light up and say "That's what I want!"; it gets them excited about being involved in the sport. I'm sure most of us have seen it at least once where someone has a "holier than thou" attitude towards a newbie.

I was spectating on a match where the teams were split pretty fairly with experienced players on both sides, but there was about 3 - 4 guys that were friends on one team. They killed the few experienced players on the opposing side and then quickly ran through and proceeded to bunker 3 rental kids that were huddled up together. It was bad. The ref went off on them and booted them from the field, but the damage was done. The refs had been doing their jobs fine, but they cant know what someone is about to do mid-stride. Turns out the kids were part of a b-day party of about 20 kids. The owner apologized and wound up having to refund the party, since one of the kids was bleeding. It really soured the day. Obviously they never came back, never told anyone to go there, and never purchased more gear. That could have been a steady group of kids (20 b-days a year in that group if you think about it), which is what fields (and any business) needs to stay open.

I know this is getting long but lets break down the cost of the refunded case of paint, applied to this scenario to keep it simple. Some of this may be speculation on prices, but the basics are the same, especially when dealing with one time use products (like paintball's). Lets say its costs a field $30 for a case that they sell for $60. When they refund that, they don't just lose money once. Its closer to 4 times. They lose the $30 they spent on the case, the $30 in profit. They don't get the paint back, since its been fired, so they cant resell the returned product to someone else. That's $30 in potential recoup profits gone (the next case they sell doesn't earn profit, they only break even, that's two cases they didn't make profit on). The fourth is the incalculable's. The things you cant even put a price on. How much money that group would have spent in the future. The sales you could have made on people they recommended. The cost of employee time to receive the shipment, shelf it, sell it, and outfit it to those kids. The cost of retail space that box took up, etc. The list goes on. The financial loss that field took because of those guys actions cost them more than those guys ever spent.

Next time you see some newbies, just say "Hows it going, great to see new players out here." or something. Break down that awkward barrier. Its intimidating to see all these electros and bling bling ripping paint like firehoses. A friend and I once saw some kids that we could tell were nervous about being around all the experienced guys, but were in awe of everything going on. When their group was going out, my buddy and I kinda looked at each other and almost simultaneously nodded "Lets go". We ran over to the group and yelled at the ref "Put us on their team!" and pointed at them. You would have though someone just told these kids they were about to play with pros. They were stoked. One of them got someone out, the other one tried to follow my buddy into the snake and got nailed. But they were both excited the rest of the day.

Last edited by ArnoldPalmer : 04-16-2015 at 10:23 PM.
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Old 04-17-2015, 08:57 PM #12
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Fields should understand they're serving 2 different markets and take advantage of it. There could be 2 separate prices and game structures for speedball and rec-ball. Just takes a little figuring out of the market in your region. But rather than rejecting one market, they learn how to serve it and captilize from it.
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Old 04-24-2015, 02:46 PM #13
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How would speedball pricing differ from recball pricing?
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Old 04-24-2015, 05:20 PM #14
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How would speedball pricing differ from recball pricing?
Camp Pendleton does that. Their tourney park is I think $5 less then the rec fields (its been a while since I've been there, don't quote me on that). That's if you pay for air on the rec fields, its a separate charge on the rec fields, but its included on the tourney fields. If you don't pay for air on the rec fields, then its cheaper than the tourney fields.
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Old 04-24-2015, 11:33 PM #15
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So you save $5 on air because you're going to play on a more expensive to maintain field? I don't quite grasp it.
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Old 04-25-2015, 12:15 AM #16
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I don't get it either...
Do they charge you for the air you breathe too?
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Old 04-25-2015, 05:04 AM #17
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Very humble people mostly at my closest field. Many people that recball, gave up tournament paintball and are just having fun, so the skill level is greater there. Frequent local tournaments and scrimmages with college teams happen there as well. They measure the layout to be as close to exact as possible.

South it get's more viscous. When big money kids get on the field piling out of their Mercedes Benz SUVs, it's like a weird class war on that field. They like to make it rain...paintballs. I find some other tournament player to sandbag with me onto the team that is stacked against to mess up their day. Usually it stops the alpha male wannabe cussing when you put their foot in their mouths doing the opposite of what they did when they won against a team that had no way of winning. No celebration, just another day in the park; whereas, when they destroy the rentals it's as if they won the world cup.

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Old 04-26-2015, 01:37 PM #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LlabtniapYalp View Post
So after being out of paintball for two years, I returned to my local field to play. To my disappointment, they got rid of their speedball field which was my favorite. I asked one of the employees why they did that. The employee said it "attracted a bad crowd." Alright, which one of you ******** caused my favorite field to get torn down?
You don't happen to play in NH, do you?
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Old 05-02-2015, 10:32 AM #19
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One of my local fields got rid of their speedball field too. They made the call to reduce the physical fighting, verbal abuse, maintanance, and promote the field more to the new players.

Whenever I go to a field I gauge how the players are playing. If I am playing with a more experienced crowd I play just as hard as they do with similar equipment (noted a bit older gear). If it is somewhat experienced, I lower the rate of fire and make more "stupid crazy" moves for fun.

More times than not, we have the new players that can count how many times they have walked on to a paintball field on one hand. For that I always have my pump available.

For the absolute first timers that are barely of age, I find it amusing to just run back and forth on the field without my marker and see how many times they can hit me.
I do the same thing. I have the High end gun, the middle range, and a pump. Depending on the what the player make up of the day is dictates what marker i use.

Its nice when the rich cocky kids see me with my phantom and talk **** get thier masks painted, shuts them right up.
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Old 05-02-2015, 01:29 PM #20
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Happened to my local field as well unfortunately.
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Old 05-07-2015, 08:02 PM #21
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Fields should have rookies one day or one part of the field separate and the following day have the moderate to experts playing. I think that would help out the problems a lot.
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