Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-17-2014, 04:29 AM #1
vijil
Giant Paintball Robot
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: New Zealand
What products do you wish existed?

Today I was trying to find an 8ci tank, but then got to thinking how great it would be if there was such a thing as a 4500 CF tank in that size for pistols or magfed play. Goodbye forever 12gms! I guess you'd get 100+ shots. Or imagine a 13ci version...

The fact is paintball is small and there are so many things that used to exist or just haven't been invented yet. What do you wish existed?
vijil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 03-17-2014, 04:58 AM #2
bigmatt8989
 
 
bigmatt8989's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
13ci tanks exist already
__________________
MFM

Gear bag sale!!! Want trades!!!
http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=4076038
bigmatt8989 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 05:45 AM #3
vijil
Giant Paintball Robot
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: New Zealand
vijil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 09:48 AM #4
Nahib_Stilgar
 
 
Join Date: May 2008
Yes a 13/4500 would be nice!

So would a magfed gun with a dropped air in stock option.

A small forcefed hopper i.e. 50 rnd...
Nahib_Stilgar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 10:36 AM #5
Rodinski
 
 
Rodinski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
The vertical hopper feed needs to stop. We are in the 21st century and have the means of making stock based, modular hoppers. Such a change would be like how we went from autocockers to now. This is the next step for paintball (at least speedball). Why isn't there more investment into this is beyond me.
Rodinski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 11:44 AM #6
liquidfiretibby
 
 
liquidfiretibby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: etters, pa
Annual Supporting Member
liquidfiretibby is BST Legit
liquidfiretibby plays in the PSP
liquidfiretibby owns a Planet Eclipse Etek
liquidfiretibby posts videos on PbNation
liquidfiretibby plays in the APPA D4 division
liquidfiretibby has perfected Level 3 in PbNation Pursuit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodinski View Post
The vertical hopper feed needs to stop. We are in the 21st century and have the means of making stock based, modular hoppers. Such a change would be like how we went from autocockers to now. This is the next step for paintball (at least speedball). Why isn't there more investment into this is beyond me.
how do you figure this is the next step for speedball? Stock based hoppers? Like in the Empire Dfender? I guess you havent looked at speedball guns or players lately, but they dont use stocks. It would make the guns too big and too cumbersome to maneuver. Unless you can magically make the paintballs appear in the breech from some outside pool or paint, I'm going to say the current hopper/feed system works pretty well. If you put the feed system anywhere else on the gun, you make the gun that much bigger. The big companies have been investing money into making everything lighter and smaller, not bulkier. Sure this idea may work well for woodsball and I think it is suited for woodsball, but not speedball.
__________________

United
liquidfiretibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 12:31 PM #7
BurningPlaydoh
Blow-Dough'ed
 
BurningPlaydoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Twin Cities, MN
Annual Supporting Member
BurningPlaydoh has perfected Level 2 in PbNation Pursuit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodinski View Post
The vertical hopper feed needs to stop. We are in the 21st century and have the means of making stock based, modular hoppers. Such a change would be like how we went from autocockers to now. This is the next step for paintball (at least speedball). Why isn't there more investment into this is beyond me.
What advantage is there to not having the loader on top of the marker?
__________________
JT Highlighter parts and brand new Empire pants, large: http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...5#post85065545
BurningPlaydoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 12:52 PM #8
Lurker27
Engineering the Future
 
Lurker27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Annual Supporting Member
Lurker27 is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
Lurker27 posts videos on PbNation
Lurker27 has been published on the PbNation Youtube Channel
Better weight distribution, better profile. The Paragon was originally designed with a modular breech to take underfeed.
__________________
World's Best Hard-Parts Upgrades!
EigenBarrels, Mini, AXE, Intimidators, DM, Shocker
Lurker27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 01:15 PM #9
Rodinski
 
 
Rodinski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by liquidfiretibby View Post
how do you figure this is the next step for speedball? Stock based hoppers? Like in the Empire Dfender? I guess you havent looked at speedball guns or players lately, but they dont use stocks. It would make the guns too big and too cumbersome to maneuver. Unless you can magically make the paintballs appear in the breech from some outside pool or paint, I'm going to say the current hopper/feed system works pretty well. If you put the feed system anywhere else on the gun, you make the gun that much bigger. The big companies have been investing money into making everything lighter and smaller, not bulkier. Sure this idea may work well for woodsball and I think it is suited for woodsball, but not speedball.
Not exactly like the DFender as it isn't modular, but the same sort of concept, yes.

They use the tank as a stock. You can handle the marker the same way regardless if the hopper was above the tank or slightly extruded to be used as a stock.

When you have a 260 round hopper on top of your marker it becomes top heavy. The centre of mass is far away from the center of mass of the individual. Travel distance from the pod to the hopper is less, and is more compact, created a lower profile (considering the DFender). The paint doesn't magically appear in the feed neck under this system either. The DFender is a real world example of this system, and the balls don't "magically appear".

The current system does work, however, if players want a lower profile and better weight distribution that benefits the player in keeping a better centre of mass, then it can be seen as a better system over the current one. It's not that the current system is "bad", but there is an option there to make it better.

You aren't making the marker "much bigger". It's fractionally larger. The hopper is merely shifted to a different area. As like the DFender, the length and width dimensions are essentially the same. Height on the other than is much smaller.

Furthermore, it's not like every modular "stock hopper" would be the same as the DFender. They will improve upon the existing design.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lurker27 View Post
Better weight distribution, better profile.
Exactly.
Rodinski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 01:49 PM #10
Robotech
 
 
Robotech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: So. Cal.
 has been a member for 10 years
Robotech is attending Decay of Nations VII
Quote:
Originally Posted by liquidfiretibby View Post
how do you figure this is the next step for speedball? Stock based hoppers? Like in the Empire Dfender? I guess you havent looked at speedball guns or players lately, but they dont use stocks. It would make the guns too big and too cumbersome to maneuver. Unless you can magically make the paintballs appear in the breech from some outside pool or paint, I'm going to say the current hopper/feed system works pretty well. If you put the feed system anywhere else on the gun, you make the gun that much bigger. The big companies have been investing money into making everything lighter and smaller, not bulkier. Sure this idea may work well for woodsball and I think it is suited for woodsball, but not speedball.
I talked to one of the Dye guys who was testing the Box Rotor on his DAM. I asked him if he had tried playing speedball with it on a DAM that had all the extras removed. He told me that he had and that he doubted he'd ever play speedball with a hopper again.

Last edited by Robotech : 03-17-2014 at 01:53 PM.
Robotech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 02:32 PM #11
BurningPlaydoh
Blow-Dough'ed
 
BurningPlaydoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Twin Cities, MN
Annual Supporting Member
BurningPlaydoh has perfected Level 2 in PbNation Pursuit
I feel like podding and shooting one handed would be awkward like that but we shall see what happens in the next few years.
__________________
JT Highlighter parts and brand new Empire pants, large: http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...5#post85065545
BurningPlaydoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 03:24 PM #12
liquidfiretibby
 
 
liquidfiretibby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: etters, pa
Annual Supporting Member
liquidfiretibby is BST Legit
liquidfiretibby plays in the PSP
liquidfiretibby owns a Planet Eclipse Etek
liquidfiretibby posts videos on PbNation
liquidfiretibby plays in the APPA D4 division
liquidfiretibby has perfected Level 3 in PbNation Pursuit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
I talked to one of the Dye guys who was testing the Box Rotor on his DAM. I asked him if he had tried playing speedball with it on a DAM that had all the extras removed. He told me that he had and that he doubted he'd ever play speedball with a hopper again.
#1. you prob wouldnt need to reload a box rotor during a speedball game....
#2. the box rotor is essentially a large magazine. it feeds from under the gun, not from the rear as the OP was suggesting.


Rodinski - I agree that the hopper makes the center of gravity much higher. I dont however think moving the hopper to the rear would be beneficial tho. Yes most speedball players use the tank as a "stock", but you would have to add quite a bit to the rear of the gun to add a hopper or other feed system. Now there is more weight at the rear of the gun. The hopper brings weight forward. Most speedball setups are balanced if you hold the snatch grip. Adding the feed reservoir to the rear would make the marker back heavy.

Also, the big issue would be loading with the hopper in the rear. As it is, I hold my gun as tight to my body as possible. Dumping a pod into something that is basically pressed into me shoulder as tight as it can be wont be easy.

I like the idea and the Dfender. They are great for woodsball, CQB, and magfed games. But I dont seem them being viable options on a speedball field. Maybe go more magfed for speedball. Gas thru grip, internalize the HPR and put a magazine where the HPR is now. Capacity would be a huge issue then tho.
__________________

United
liquidfiretibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 03:31 PM #13
Rodinski
 
 
Rodinski's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
I talked to one of the Dye guys who was testing the Box Rotor on his DAM. I asked him if he had tried playing speedball with it on a DAM that had all the extras removed. He told me that he had and that he doubted he'd ever play speedball with a hopper again.
That's interesting...box mags in speedball. The sport shifting to a mil-sim approach would be a huge shift. But given the price, the weight, and the awkwardness of running around with 4 box mags on your back would be cumbersome I would think.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BurningPlaydoh View Post
I feel like podding and shooting one handed would be awkward like that but we shall see what happens in the next few years.
I can see where it would be awkward, but I think it would be lest problematic then missing the hopper entirely as you extend your reach. The DFender, for example, has the lid spring 180 degrees compared to traditional loaders. It acts as controlling the feed of the balls so you lose less. Having the hopper closer to yourself also helps maintain an ease at not missing your pod reloads.
Rodinski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 03:50 PM #14
Robotech
 
 
Robotech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: So. Cal.
 has been a member for 10 years
Robotech is attending Decay of Nations VII
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodinski View Post
That's interesting...box mags in speedball. The sport shifting to a mil-sim approach would be a huge shift. But given the price, the weight, and the awkwardness of running around with 4 box mags on your back would be cumbersome I would think.
It would...but you wouldn't need to do that. The BoxRotor has a door...a big door...on either side of it that can be flipped up to reload the BoxRotor just like you would a hopper. Only difference is the door could be positioned behind the bunker as you shoot and would be easily in your area of vision making it just as easy to load as a hopper.

Price of the BoxRotor is up there though that's because it comes with a new board for the DAM.
Robotech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 04:37 PM #15
BurningPlaydoh
Blow-Dough'ed
 
BurningPlaydoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Twin Cities, MN
Annual Supporting Member
BurningPlaydoh has perfected Level 2 in PbNation Pursuit
A box Rotor would get in the way of keeping your marker tight against a bunker though I would imagine.
__________________
JT Highlighter parts and brand new Empire pants, large: http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...5#post85065545
BurningPlaydoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 04:49 PM #16
Robotech
 
 
Robotech's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: So. Cal.
 has been a member for 10 years
Robotech is attending Decay of Nations VII
Quote:
Originally Posted by BurningPlaydoh View Post
A box Rotor would get in the way of keeping your marker tight against a bunker though I would imagine.
Actually I think you could play tighter. Now, when you come out the side of the bunker you make a choice, keep the marker upright and have a bit of the tank and of the hopper exposed to be hit, tilt the maker out so the tank is behind cover but the hopper is more exposed, or tilt the other way hiding more of the hopper and exposing the tank.

With the BoxRotor on the bottom, you can tilt your marker a bit so the BoxRotor AND tank are still behind the bunker and only your barrel is exposed.

As far as front and back, the BoxRotor sits about where the front of the regular Rotor would be. The front of the box is in about the same position as the front of a normal mag would be. Width is only slightly wider overall.

But maybe you have something else in mind that I'm just not thinking of.

Last edited by Robotech : 03-17-2014 at 04:53 PM.
Robotech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 04:53 PM #17
liquidfiretibby
 
 
liquidfiretibby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: etters, pa
Annual Supporting Member
liquidfiretibby is BST Legit
liquidfiretibby plays in the PSP
liquidfiretibby owns a Planet Eclipse Etek
liquidfiretibby posts videos on PbNation
liquidfiretibby plays in the APPA D4 division
liquidfiretibby has perfected Level 3 in PbNation Pursuit
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robotech View Post
Wouldn't think it would be much different than with a hopper as far as coming out the side of a bunker. Over the top of a bunker, big difference.
try pressing the gun flat against the bunker with barrel up like when you are being pinched in from both sides. That box rotor is gonna make it hard. also, doesnt it stick out the sides of the gun a bit? so if you would just press the barrel into the side of the bunker to hide as we do now, the side of the box rotor would still be viewable since its wider than the gun and regular hoppers.
I just see it as being too cumbersome for speedball.
__________________

United
liquidfiretibby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 05:18 PM #18
BurningPlaydoh
Blow-Dough'ed
 
BurningPlaydoh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Twin Cities, MN
Annual Supporting Member
BurningPlaydoh has perfected Level 2 in PbNation Pursuit
With proper form your mask, loader, tank and elbow should all be inline and not amking much of a larger profile.

With that said I think the box rotor would be great at a scenario as you can put a bunch of paint in there and itd be sweet to mount an action cam on the top rails or a sight/magnifier for first strikes.
__________________
JT Highlighter parts and brand new Empire pants, large: http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...5#post85065545
BurningPlaydoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2014, 09:48 PM #19
Fubarius
Yep, it's orange.
 
Fubarius's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: New Richmond, WI
Annual Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
Fubarius supports our troops
Fubarius has achieved Level 1 in PbNation Pursuit
Fubarius has achieved Level 2 in PbNation Pursuit
Fubarius is a Forum Captain
Quote:
Originally Posted by BurningPlaydoh View Post
With proper form....
That's the thing with a radically different setup like a under mounted hopper (which a box mag really is), or rear hopper. The current "proper form" now becomes the incorrect form for that setup. A totally different form now becomes the proper form.

If you find the current popular form to be awkward or uncomfortable, an alternate setup which benefits from a different form looks like a great idea. God knows I have enough trouble keeping my hopper from sticking out when leaning right, so heck, sign me up for a setup where leaning the gun out of the bunker is the right form.

If you've spent a lot of time mastering the current popular form then something that promotes a different form seems either illogical, or possibly even a bit of a threat ("darn it, now I'd have to start learning all over...").


What other products would I like to see? Heck, just more. More variety, more alternative setups, more options. I'm really bored of seeing a bunch of people using the same boring stuff.

I think the problem these days is that too many people only followed the instructions that came with their Lego sets as a kid.
__________________
David Johnson, AKA Fubarius.

Nunquam emere potes facere
Fubarius is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2014, 06:12 AM #21
Long_island (Banned)
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Long Island, NY
Long_island owns a Planet Eclipse Ego
Long_island has achieved Level 1 in PbNation Pursuit
Long_island has perfected Level 1 in PbNation Pursuit
Long_island supports Empire
i just want to know what the hell happened to Angel Air systems?! do they still exist or are they gone bc of their price tag for really not doing anything different from a regular tank...anybody know?
Long_island is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
Forum Jump