[iamaparanoidperson]

Okay, so this is discussion has the obvious potential to turn into an absolute breading ground of flaming and chaos. Please, be civil.

A lot of grunts (not all) feel that POGs are useless. A lot of POGs have A LOT of combat experience...more than some grunts.

Are POGS really pussies? Are Grunts really just vain? Are a lot of them just pussies with a gun? Are a lot of POGs serving in a non-infantry MOS because they are scared or less-motivated than Grunts?

I respect both. Everyone serving their country bleeds, sacrifices, kills and dies for the same thing.

[Big P]

IIm sorry but this is just one of those topics that never end well, and always turns into us against them fights.

IMHO only, I think that the term GRUNT spans tons of MOSs today. MPs, Engineers, Arty guys who have all been pressed into service into the field outside of the MOS they signed up for. Hell, there are tons of AF, and Navy guys doing their time on the ground as well.

The term Grunt does not just apply to an 11b trigger puller anymore...again, just MHO.

[sHoCkA (Banned)]

From my personal experience, obviously I feel grunts are much more beneficial to the Army. Everyday I was in Iraq, I was out finding IEDs/weapons caches/insurgents, in constant danger, and losing friends while the POGs were in the cush AC offices jerking each other off. That being said, I fully understand that POGs are essential in supporting the grunts to accomplish the overall mission whether it be delivering supplies, fixing commo, cooking food, fixing generators, etc., etc. Some POGs do get tasked out for route clearance and are put in the same ammount of danger as grunts... those are the ones I don't mind, but the ones who sit in the TOC for 8-12hrs at a time in the AC, buy all the **** in PX, eat up all the hot chow, and then tell their loved ones back home they see combat... yeah, those are the ones I ****ing hate.

[ohherrohans]

Originally Posted by Big P

IIm sorry but this is just one of those topics that never end well, and always turns into us against them fights.

IMHO only, I think that the term GRUNT spans tons of MOSs today. MPs, Engineers, Arty guys who have all been pressed into service into the field outside of the MOS they signed up for. Hell, there are tons of AF, and Navy guys doing their time on the ground as well.

The term Grunt does not just apply to an 11b trigger puller anymore...again, just MHO.

Basically said it all.

Im intel and i've been outside the wire quite a bit more than the scouts on this FOB. i get a kick out of it, i love being out there.

the 11b.. they do their thing but i dont usually go out with them. And yes the AF out here with (JTACs) go out on missions all the time (just in case bombs need to drop).

i laugh when im called a POG because half the time its coming from an E1 who thinks he's hot sh!t because he just came straight out of AIT into a combat zone. then that first bullet cracks...

POG's and GRUNTs... like it has been mentioned before, this topic will never end

[pbnoob9988]

Without the grunts they'rd be no Marine Corps, or military for that matter. We revolve around them, it's what made this country (Revolutionary War Grunts). Without POG's though, in todays modern military, the grunt's are nothing, just think about it. No transport (sea/ground/air), no supplies (gear, weapons, ammo), no food, no engineers, no fire support (arty, tanks, air) etc, etc, hell nobody to even pay them and do paperwork either.

Grunts need us and we need them. Sadly atleast over here it seems all the ITB guys I talk too at the PX or whatever are brainwashed into 'if your not 03 then get out of my Corps' and that BS. I'm just like aye Pvt, present-cocksalute.

For that reason I think the whole grunt vs pog is stupid. Plus nowadays you have pogs doing grunt job, atleast getting some action. And all Marine pogs are pretty much 0311's (heard it from my grunt combat instructors), they just don't contine to train after MCT.

Speaking for my boot self, if needed to acomplish the mission I'll pickup my rifle and go into the ****, I'm trained to do so, just not nearly as much. I can't say I'm not scared to do grunt work, but not a 'fobbit' type I don't think. As bad as I'd suck, I wan't the deployments, I want the security and convoys, I want the patrol. Further into my carreer I even want to try to be an embassy guard and the first I think 12 or 24 months you are in a 3rd world contry and have the possiblity of attack/danger.

If all goes well in a few years I may be becoming an air grunt (air crew) too, origionally joined for it but my eyes need fixed up.

Long post, can't sleep, eh, disect or whatever.

[Jonnyblaze1991]

My dad's a Seabee.. He used to be down in the dirt as well.. (although he's a desk jockey now)

[ohherrohans]

Originally Posted by pbnoob9988

Without the grunts they'rd be no Marine Corps, or military for that matter. We revolve around them, it's what made this country (Revolutionary War Grunts). Without POG's though, in todays modern military, the grunt's are nothing, just think about it. No transport (sea/ground/air), no supplies (gear, weapons, ammo), no food, no engineers, no fire support (arty, tanks, air) etc, etc, hell nobody to even pay them and do paperwork either.

Grunts need us and we need them. Sadly atleast over here it seems all the ITB guys I talk too at the PX or whatever are brainwashed into 'if your not 03 then get out of my Corps' and that BS. I'm just like aye Pvt, present-cocksalute.

For that reason I think the whole grunt vs pog is stupid. Plus nowadays you have pogs doing grunt job, atleast getting some action. And all Marine pogs are pretty much 0311's (heard it from my grunt combat instructors), they just don't contine to train after MCT.

Speaking for my boot self, if needed to acomplish the mission I'll pickup my rifle and go into the ****, I'm trained to do so, just not nearly as much. I can't say I'm not scared to do grunt work, but not a 'fobbit' type I don't think. As bad as I'd suck, I wan't the deployments, I want the security and convoys, I want the patrol. Further into my carreer I even want to try to be an embassy guard and the first I think 12 or 24 months you are in a 3rd world contry and have the possiblity of attack/danger.

If all goes well in a few years I may be becoming an air grunt (air crew) too, origionally joined for it but my eyes need fixed up.

Long post, can't sleep, eh, disect or whatever.

well said.

[Sanguinary]

Originally Posted by ohherrohans

well said.

.

[/-\dam]

i hate these topics. im an aviation ordnanceman. ive spent alot of time out in the field and will continue to do so. when we are in country, we go out to things called FARPS. FARPS are set far away from your base and are designed to refuel and rearm(my job) aircraft. we have a handful of grunts there with us.

now ive never seen combat and probably never will. because from my experience that **** has pretty much ended over there. im not afraid to go on an actual FARP. in fact id love to because thats the heart and soul of my job. its essentially what ive been training for the last 2 1/2 years. im know plenty of people in my MOS who have seen combat.

grunts/pogs are an apples and oranges debate.

[Marine786]

They both have their uses.

[iamaparanoidperson]

I am a Combat Correspondent. When deployed, the entire point of my job is to be with grunts IN COMBAT covering everything that happens. Our motto is you have to be brave to be in the **** shooting back...you have to be ****ing crazy to be in the ****, getting shot at, and taking pictures.

Almost every CC i know (well, during the early phases when there was actually ground engagements) has confirmed kills, purple hearts, and CARs.

Coming through MCT, my instructors always pulled me aside to ask if i fully understood everything because all the CCs they knew saw ALOT of combat. they wanted me prepared.

MY OPINION of the differenc...POGS are combat trained. And trained well. Strait out of mct, i would bet everything i own that they could function in combat as well as any infantryman. However, when they hit the fleet, POGS stop training. THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE.

When grunts hit the fleet, they keep doing the exact same ****. Learning more, and becoming more proficient.

I think the POG Marine knows alot about infantry tactics, but are rusty at applying them.

ALSO, i think once a person has seen real combat, then he has just leveled the playing field. You can train all you want, but will NEVER simulate the chaos of combat. That experience is invalueable.

[the other one]

I'm a POG... a tank mechanic.

But... when I deployed, I was a part of a provisional rifle company.. and we had grunts with us, and we were in a grunt rotation (we were in between two grunt units, giving them some rest time).

So... after 200+ patrols with a grunt no more than 10 feet away from me at all times, doing the same job he was doing, which was the same job all the other grunts were doing... I can claim that I wasn't a fobbit for my tour.


...I don't care if grunts say that they're better riflemen than POGs. It's true... they are better at killing people than I am. I will never argue that.

The only thing I get mad at is when they say that I sit in an office all day, doing nothing. In reality, my mos works longer hours in a week than grunts do. I'm yet to come across a grunt that works outside as much as I do on a consistent basis. I didn't sit at a COC for my tour, either... and so I don't like to be labeled as an admin *****.
...and when boot grunts try to talk ****.... on man, that's just funny.

Grunts are better infantrymen than POG's are.... duh. But, I can do their job with some semblance of competency... they could never do mine.

...doesn't matter in the long run, though. I'm not a grunt for a reason.

[pbnoob9988]

Originally Posted by the other one

...and when boot grunts try to talk ****.... on man, that's just funny.

"**** you CPL, I just graduated SOI you pog *** desk *****. GTFO of my Marine Corps, if you aren't 03 then you aren't even a Marine."

I don see the problem as long as it's said tactfully at parade rest.

[DM6 KILLA]

i know a guy who sits in an office everyday and his main job is to purchase stuff for SF guys, but because of his job he gets to wear the SF patch. he also claims to be SF (which is complete bull**** because he isint tabbed)

I respect grunts more because they are the ones in the **** CONSTANTLY
but i respect anyone who serves in the military.

[DM6 KILLA]

Originally Posted by the other one

I'm a POG... a tank mechanic.

But... when I deployed, I was a part of a provisional rifle company.. and we had grunts with us, and we were in a grunt rotation (we were in between two grunt units, giving them some rest time).

So... after 200+ patrols with a grunt no more than 10 feet away from me at all times, doing the same job he was doing, which was the same job all the other grunts were doing... I can claim that I wasn't a fobbit for my tour.


...I don't care if grunts say that they're better riflemen than POGs. It's true... they are better at killing people than I am. I will never argue that.

The only thing I get mad at is when they say that I sit in an office all day, doing nothing. In reality, my mos works longer hours in a week than grunts do. I'm yet to come across a grunt that works outside as much as I do on a consistent basis. I didn't sit at a COC for my tour, either... and so I don't like to be labeled as an admin *****.
...and when boot grunts try to talk ****.... on man, that's just funny.

Grunts are better infantrymen than POG's are.... duh. But, I can do their job with some semblance of competency... they could never do mine.

...doesn't matter in the long run, though. I'm not a grunt for a reason.

just because someone is a grunt dosent make them not intelligent, that may just be the path they wanted to take, they may have just wanted to fight.

[ohherrohans]

Originally Posted by DM6 KILLA

just because someone is a grunt dosent make them not intelligent, that may just be the path they wanted to take, they may have just wanted to fight.

agreed i know tons of infantrymen with degree's who are very smart. and im labeling infantry because honestly they're scruntinized (sp? w/e) more than any other mos out there. but scouts/infantry/FO's i know alot of smart ones.

[Cap_Insanity]

I look at it this way. There are 2 kinds of POG's the first kind of pogs I dont really see as important to the military. They do paper work so on and so forth. You know stuff I would trust a high school kid doing. The other kind of pog is I run into in the field, and they are just as bad of as the grunts freezing, sweeting, staying up late ect...

How I define the two.

If you a set time when you go to work and a set time you get off more less a 9-5 job and you dont go to the field you are a straight up POG "The kind I hate".

If you dont know what you work schedule is going to be from day to day, and you go to the field weather it be moter-t, Tanks, combat enginers... As long as you have a deployment under your belt you are ok in my books.

[underdog_153]

i agree with what noob said. without "pogs" there wouldnt be a military. we need them as much as infantry guys are needed

[xxxarsonist]

I HATE POGS!!!>!>! INFANTRY BLUE IN MY VEEEEEEEEEINNNNNNNSSSSSSSSS!!111! one !1!!!!!

[the other one]

Originally Posted by DM6 KILLA

just because someone is a grunt dosent make them not intelligent, that may just be the path they wanted to take, they may have just wanted to fight.

I never called them unintelligent.... where in my post does it say that?

[JackH (Banned)]

Can't have one without the other.

/thread?