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Old 07-31-2003, 11:34 PM #22
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I reffed the Hyperball that day and I think that we did a damn good job. I cannot speak for the other fields but I know that there were no major complaints about our field during the day.

For those of you guys that are out here bashing the reffing that day I say maybe you ought to ref the next GPL and look at it from the other side. It's a thankless job that every player should try before they get on here and blame the refs for this game or that game.
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Old 08-01-2003, 07:23 PM #23
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nyjets..... u werent there on saturday to see what happened. the refs were literaly pulling people for splatter. and no it wasnt the size of a quarter. it was splatter u know like rain drop size. if it was questionable i could see doing what the ref(s) did but it was rediculous. now come on, if it had happened to you tell me you wouldnt have somthing to say. exactly, you would so dont tell me that im rediculous for blaming refs for some ****. how could we max almost everygame, in fact yes, we did max everygame but one that wasnt on field 2? all im saying is that if you wanna ref in a tourny make sure you put in 110% like the other guy said and dont bull**** around.
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Old 08-01-2003, 11:41 PM #24
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there has never been a tournament where no one complained about reffing in one way shape or form... like i said about 50 times mayb there were some bad calls but sh t happens dude. Take what you get and be happy that there were reffs on the field with you, they dont have to ref, they do it so people like us can play and well in most of our case have fun. Paintball players have got to realyze not every call is going to be perfect, i used to be one of those annoying whinny players who would argue EVERY call no matter what the circumstance, and then I learned the hard way that the refs are doing us a favor, and arguing doesnt get you anywhere except the deadbox, and occasionaly a trip for one of ur teamates there as well. You just have to hope that the calls are as close to perfection as possible, and at the same time realyze that they might not be. So take the calls as they go and accept them.
P.S. - even though I did not play the three man, we played the 5man and we played on hyperball field 2. And I slid in paint on the left sub, I told the ref it was from kneeling he whiped as much off as possible and I was fine. Just let them know these things, the refs do not know what you are thinking.
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Old 08-02-2003, 10:42 AM #25
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I have been watching this thread progress and I felt that I ned to say something. In my opinion and many others there this weekend, my refs did a GREAT job. I had very little complaints in regards to the reffing this past event. Every person that came up to me said that the reffing was the best this year and that they hope that all the same reffs are there throughout the year.

Now, I am not stating that some of you had issues with the refs. If you did at the event, please voice your opinion to Tony (Ultimate Ref) or myseft at the registration table that day. We welcome all comments, sugggestions and complaints. As NY Jets stated, since when have you gone to an event and the reffing was 100% perfect? When was the last time a player said "Ref, I am sorry, pull a 1-for-1 because I played on, here is my armband". Never. That is why there are refs in the first place. To assure that there is no cheating and everyone is obeying the rules.

In the past I have ALWAYS made the same offer after every event that there is complaints: Volenteer yourself to ref a GPL Event. Reffing Rec ball in the woods and local 10 team Tourney's are not acceptable. Ref an event where there are at least 400 people that are going to play your field and you work for 10 hours straight with your goggles on your face for 9 of those hours and stand in the hot blazing sun (or downpour rain) while you are getting shot at least 1/2 dozen times per game and going on the energy from the sandwich or hamburger you had for lunch and the 101 powerades you had to keep your energy up making the calls that affects a team in weather they are getting $5000 in prizes or $1100 in prizes. It is hard. Every person and team that have done this knowns what I am talking about. Reckless Rebels, Megastore players (reffing now and looking back at how they were before they played on the team), Mixed Nuts, Alpha and many More. They can all tell you. They have reffed and experienced this first hand. They would complain about calls ref would make and then one day they reffed and they came up to me and said, if I ever complained about anything, please disregard it. I never realized how hard it is.

So, any one who feel that they are geting cheated by the refs and that the refs are not doing their job, please come and volenteer to ref. If you play the 5-Man, ref the 3-Man and vice versa. I qurantee that no one will volenteer. This is a serious offer and I don't think anyone will step up. These refs did a great job each day. Having to endure all the above and then doing it a second day and I hope that they read this and hear from me how much I appraciated them. PBMegastore.com, Freaks of Nature, Reckless Rebels, Vandon, Nate, all the Global Employees, you guy did a great job and I look foward to the next event.

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Old 08-02-2003, 07:57 PM #26
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dude i understand what you are saying but you would have to be there to understand it. i rarely argue calls unless i know that i am right. and cyndi, like you said i, and i dont think anyone has, never been to an event where the reffing has been perfect but i just feel that certain refs really didnt care about how the games went and im sure others agree with me from how pissed people were in the parking area cause of some calls. i know not every call can make every person happy but when you start to see more and more people getting pissed it leads you to think somthing. we did talk to tony and it was as if he didnt give a damn about it. we actually got some time to talk with the refs from field 1 during the 3man and they were helpful. i dont know who he was but the head ref on field 1 wearing the super 7 referee jersey and the philly eclipse headband had to be one of the best refs there in my opinion. he took everything from everybody into consideration. the refs on that field even told us that they heard complaints about field 2. now come on, these are your refs now that were saying that they heard complaints about it. not just me or anyone on this board. other than the problems on field 2, the event did go smoothly and ill be back for the next one. if i have any problems at that one, which i hope i dont, i will make sure i go to you this time and not mr. ultimate ref
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Old 08-02-2003, 09:21 PM #27
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"nobody's perfect" just play tight at the 4th GPL event, if you pissed off go out and play...
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Old 08-04-2003, 01:12 PM #28
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I think this "GPL ref bashing" has to stop. I would say that the refs did an outstanding job not only in making the right calls, but also in making sure the games ran smoothly and safely.
I would agree with NYJets25 that the reffing is how it should be. And that no one has to make bad calls an excuse for losing or not making the cut.
Thanks to the GPL crew for making sure that all the teams have a good paintball weekend.
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Old 08-04-2003, 07:41 PM #29
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Ok alot of refs were on top of their game, a couple were a little off but the day went smoothly which I thank Cyndi and the rest of the GPL staff for.
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Old 08-05-2003, 01:50 PM #30
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nothing but a yes...
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Old 08-07-2003, 07:50 PM #31
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i thought the reffing at the 3rd event was very good...
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Old 08-08-2003, 03:37 PM #32
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it was, der gud, der are some badcalls, thats the topic but "its n the game"...so keep it up,lolz
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Old 08-11-2003, 12:12 AM #33
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Quit *****in, if you dont like it do something about it. If you can't do something about it forget about it. Luck runs both way. Good refs are hard to find, hard to keep and easy to forget. If you win a game its cause of your skill if you lose is cause of bad paint, bad refs, bad gun, or bad luck. We all know what excuses are like.

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Old 08-11-2003, 03:08 AM #34
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Just so we're clear, I am not attacking the refs of the GPL. These are just some of my feelings towards all refs, or more correctly all refs that don't do their job well.

I'm not saying that the refs at this event were bad. I'm not saying that the refs were good. Of course there were tough calls that were made correctly as well as easy calls that were blown bigtime. I think everyone can agree with that... probably even the refs.

What I'm trying to figure out is why some players are so quick to excuse the poor performances of refs. Yeah, sure, we all know, and we all agree that reffing is a tough job, and none of us expects a ref to get the tough calls right every time. It's just not possible.

People aren't perfect. That includes refs. With so much going on during a game things will be missed, that's not the problem.

There's a difference between making a mistake and being a poor ref.

What makes me angry is when bad calls are caused by, unpreparedness, lack of rules knowledge, or lack of proper position. Or worse... when a bad call happens because of apathy, or just plain laziness, you as a customer are being cheated. These conditions can be avoided and should not be defended or accepted.

I doubt that any player out there thinks that paintball is a better game because cheating exists. I doubt that anyone will say that paintball is made better when a ref allows cheating to continue because he's not paying attention to the game.

Being a Tournament ref is a lot like being a paintball cop. Refs are there to enforce the rules and apply penalties to those who break them. Yeah, like I said before, we all know it's not easy, but that doesn't excuse a poor ref for not doing his job.

If you choose to ref, then the least you can do is a good job for the folks that pay you, the players.

1. Know the rules. Know them well. Know them before the game starts and you won't have to check on them after the game is all screwed up.
2. Be in the right position. You can't see a guy get hit in the front when your staring at his back.
3. Move with the game. How many times have I seen a ref do absolutely nothing because there wasn't a player in his "assigned" bunkers
4. Be quick. Make the call now! don't wait until the game conditions have changed. You saw it happen, now do something about it.
5. Be decisive. Don't be wishy washy. Make the call and stick to it.
6. Get in there. You're going to get hit. If you don't like it, don't be a ref. But for heavens sake if you're going to check him, then get over there and check him!
7. Cheaters are bad for the sport. If you catch one... Nail 'em. Make a big deal about it, because it is a big deal. He's not just breaking the rules of a game, he's stealing the hard earned money I paid to play in the event.
8. Always remember that the poor shmucks your reffing just paid hundreds of dollars to be there. Give them some value for their buck.

To the refs that do a good job (yes, I know they exist), thank you.
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Old 08-11-2003, 09:24 AM #35
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The GPL refs are not PRO refs. Don't kid yourself the only places where your gonna see pro refs are nppl events and psp and other PRO events. Ive been mad about calls, but so has everyone, you dont know what happened exactly, the refs have better views of everyone on the field than you do. They have a 95% chance of making the right calls and such, the player on the other hand has about a 40% chance of making the right call. Reffing is a very hard job, the refs are gonna make the calls to the best of their ability. If you think a ref is being lazy, yell to him and say, REF CHECK THE PLAYER OVER THERE. and if he doesn't point to him and scream. If he still doesnt say or do anything, theres probably a reason for him not to check that player. Paintballs get abnoxious when the other player gets a bouncer. They swear its a hit and its the ref's fault for not checking it in time because he whiped it. The rules are not what the players see, its what the ref's see. Play the game and stop fliping over amature refs...The refs out there are doing there best, and id like to thank them for doing what they do.
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Old 08-11-2003, 12:06 PM #36
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"The GPL refs are not PRO refs."
I never suggested that they were or that they should be.

"the refs have better views of everyone on the field than you do."
I would hope so, that's why they are there, but if they are not in the right position they can't see anything and are worthless.

"Reffing is a very hard job,"
Without a doubt, and it's not for everybody.

"If you think a ref is being lazy, yell to him and say, REF CHECK THE PLAYER OVER THERE. and if he doesn't point to him and scream. If he still doesnt say or do anything......."
I'm trying to play paintball. I shouldn't have to worry about weither or not a ref is doing his job. He should be the one telling me when a player is out, without me having to get his attention. Remember he's got the best view.

"They swear its a hit and its the ref's fault for not checking it in time because he whiped it."
If a ref calls a player clean that's fine, he's clean. The problem is when a ref doesn't bother to look.

"The rules are not what the players see, its what the ref's see."
The rules are written in the rulebook and the refs should know what they are and enforce them.

"Play the game and stop fliping over amature refs...The refs out there are doing there best, and id like to thank them for doing what they do."
I'd like to thank them as well. As a matter of fact when I see a ref make a good call I tell him personally. At the same time when a ref doesn't measure up, he should know that as well.

I'm just stating my opinion. You can disagree, just be sure you know what your disagreeing with.

What I'm saying is that I appreciate the job that refs do and many of them do it well, but if they are not any good at it or if they don't care enough about keeping the game fair and enforcing the rules then they should not be refs. If I have paid to attend an event, I have the right to point out any concerns or praise that I might have.

If the person that serves me a burger is dirty, curses, picks his nose and gives me the wrong change, I have 2 choices. 1) never go there again. 2 let the manager know how I feel.

If I don't enjoy an event enough to care about comming back I'll chose option 1. If I like the event but I think the service or product could be improved and I'd like to come back, I'll choose option 2.

I'll bet if you ask Brian and Cyndi which one they would prefer, it would be for me and everyone else to let them know what you really think about the refs, even if it's not what they want to hear.
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Old 08-11-2003, 12:22 PM #37
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Question

like cindi has said before... if you have a problem with the reffing, then try it your self. Go ahead and voulenteer for a decent sized event, try reffing over 100 games aday on one meal and see how hard it is. Every paintball player owes as much respect as possible to ANY ref on ANY field. Weather it be someone working at a local field, or a pro ref at a nppl event. They all put their time out of perspective to make your competition work. Yes sometimes we kid around and boo at call because we like another team better but to publically bash particular refs at a particular event is retarted. Honestly what does it do for you, nothing. it is just another excuse for losing or "not doing as well as you should have". I said it before and ill say it again, refs do make bad calls, it is bull ***** that people have the nerve to demote refs. If everyone played fair there would be no need for refs. Do not blame them, blame your team and your opponents if there is a bad call. If you shoot someone out and they wipe it, why is it the refs fault? last time i checked thats their own fault for defacing paintball. And if you kneel on a ball tell the ref, its not their job to determine whats a hit and whats a kneel/rub its their job to call a hit out unless specified why it is there. If anyone follows paintball they know who The Russian Legion is. They are the most honest group of paintballers in the world. And when was the last time you have seen someone complain about them wiping, playing on, or even themselves complain. If everyone played the way they did refs would be no more, but people cheat, thats why there are refs, and thats why we need them. Regardless what event, or where they reff give them props and thank them because it is their choice to be a ref, and it is your choice to have fun and play. Dont blame the refs blame yourself, your teamates, and your opponents... and good luck
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Old 08-11-2003, 12:30 PM #38
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Delmarva has some great points in that post. If you are going to ref make sure that you are prepared.

Know the rules and enforce them the way that they are written. Call it like you see it and do it quickly. Ref the games on your field they way you would like the refs to be if you were playing the game yourself.
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Old 08-11-2003, 04:45 PM #39
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yeah yeah yeah!lets play
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Old 08-11-2003, 11:45 PM #40
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im not even gonna bother arguing you guys over this *****. i rarely bash on refs unless i know im right. Delmarva Paintball had alot of good points that i agree with. like i said before i cant explain over the internet the sh it that happened. it was flat out poor reffing on 2 and 3. im leaving it at that. if my teams loses because of our own mistakes then we try and fix that to make us better but when this kind of **** happens its bull. again, even some of the other gpl refs said people were complaining about the other fields. thats all im saying
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Old 08-30-2003, 11:43 AM #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by afrin_od
The GPL refs are not PRO refs.
I think I'd rather take GPL refs than PRO refs. Anyone at NJ S7 could see some of the arguments game after game regarding blown calls.
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Old 09-01-2003, 01:45 PM #42
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I've had bad calls made against me.Yeah it stinks.But why create a thread so everyone else can have a stab at the refs and GPL.If your not satisfied with GPL, don't come to the next event,this way I can get home earlier.Also,I would prefer my teammates refrain from posting on these types of threads(we know what happens).
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