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Old 03-21-2008, 08:05 PM #85
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Originally Posted by apunkjunkie View Post
What would happen to our economy if...Microsoft...went under?
We might get a stable release of Windows?
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Old 03-21-2008, 08:11 PM #86
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Originally Posted by Haga652001 View Post
probably nothing except that the local exconomies instead of the big box stores would rise again.

I don't see a problem.
You really think that would happen immediately...or even within 5 years? 10 years? How many mom and pop hardware stores are there in your area? I have zero....nada....zip....zilch. You take away big business hardware stores and you're left with nothing.

Now, sure, hardware stores could recover probably within 10 years...but lets take Coca Cola or Nike. There probably aren't a lot of mom and pop stores that make their own soda or tennis shoes. The trade of cobbler is all but gone except for novelty purposes (Renaissance festivals, costumes, etc.).

The point is that local economies would take a longer time to recover than you're pointing out.
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Old 03-21-2008, 08:19 PM #87
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Originally Posted by apunkjunkie View Post
You really think that would happen immediately...or even within 5 years? 10 years? How many mom and pop hardware stores are there in your area? I have zero....nada....zip....zilch. You take away big business hardware stores and you're left with nothing.

Now, sure, hardware stores could recover probably within 10 years...but lets take Coca Cola or Nike. There probably aren't a lot of mom and pop stores that make their own soda or tennis shoes. The trade of cobbler is all but gone except for novelty purposes (Renaissance festivals, costumes, etc.).

The point is that local economies would take a longer time to recover than you're pointing out.
You would also see a lot of prices double or even triple. The huge retailers provide manufacters with consistant cash flow, huge volume orders and enough business that they can produce at lower prices for all of it's clients. Which means that if Home Depot and Lowes went out of business, the price of a hammer would probably triple at a local store. Even 50,000 mom and pop stores couldn't provide the consistant cash flow and volume that drives down prices.

I don't know why people think we should punish businesses for being profitable. They're only providing the goods and services we want at a price we're willing to pay. Essentially, you're getting mad because businesses are doing exactly what you want them to do.

Last edited by graysonp : 03-21-2008 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 03-21-2008, 08:20 PM #88
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Big companies can sell products for much cheaper, because their supply chains are uber efficient. Mom and Pop stores just can't handle that sort of volume.

The section on Walmart's supply chain, as well as UPS's in The World is Flat is really interesting
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Old 03-21-2008, 08:24 PM #89
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Originally Posted by Adema3412 View Post
Big companies can sell products for much cheaper, because their supply chains are uber efficient.

The section on Walmart's supply chain, as well as UPS in The World is Flat is really interesting
Everything about Wal-Mart is super efficient. It's actually pretty incredible. I've read about 3 books on Wal-Mart, and I still can't pass up a Wal-Mart book at Barnes and Noble.
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Old 03-21-2008, 08:32 PM #90
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probably nothing except that the local exconomies instead of the big box stores would rise again.

I don't see a problem.
Stop being short-sighted.

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Old 03-21-2008, 09:43 PM #91
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Big business is good and bad, its bad because it runs small business out of business. Its good because poor people then have a place to go that is a little cheaper saving there money.

My parrents paid $50,000 in taxes for 07, they have a combined income of $170,000, now what i dont get is how so many people support somone that will raise taxes. There is even speculation that Obama will raise taxes 15-20%, which people cant afford, and yet this is the more popular person.

Taxing the rich actually hurts the workig class more, and anyone with a tiny bit of common sence would understand that. When you tax the rich more they lose money and then they higher less people or lay off people, giving people less jobs. So when talking about the economy big business would keep us out of a depression more than anything.
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Old 03-21-2008, 10:06 PM #92
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People are liberal because they think throwing money at things makes problems go away. A lot of them smarten up and understand that its a little more complicated than that and that there are real solutions, you just have to think outside the box.
Look at which president whose name starts with G and you tell me who does to much spending. If your going to be an idiot at least make your statement half belivable.
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Old 03-21-2008, 10:11 PM #93
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Sorry guys, big business is the future. You're just going to have to adjust to it. Go buy a double cheeseburger at McDonalds, get a 50lb bag of rice at Wal-Mart, send in for a 50$ mail in rebate from Best-Buy. Eventually you'll get used to it, and you won't have to complain anymore.
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Old 03-21-2008, 10:30 PM #94
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Look at which president whose name starts with G and you tell me who does to much spending. If your going to be an idiot at least make your statement half belivable.
I don't know of many conservatives that support GWB.

mom and pop stores are nice, but big cooperations are what is helping America. Also don't forget most of them started out as mom and pop stores themselves

Who hires offers more jobs?
Who gives employees better benefits?
Who offers products at lower prices?

Yes the big companies screw over the little ones, but they also offer more better jobs in most cases. Which helps with our unemployment rates.

Also mom and pop fast food joints are not going to get screwed over by chains. Most offer better food and a taste you can't get from a chain.
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Old 03-21-2008, 10:55 PM #95
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Is it that hard to believe that some of us think government should try and help those in need? Sure, it might be socialism, but I don't care.
i dont think 90% of the so called needy are needy at all. You see them faking injuries so they dont have to work all the time. i think the people who want to help the needy so badly should. just not with everyones tax dollars.
make welfare more privatized. And if they dont get enough money boo hooo. Get a damn job. If you are truely unable to work then i have no problem helping out.
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Old 03-21-2008, 11:25 PM #96
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Before you read my reply below, I'm talking about true liberals and true conservatives....not the Washington liberal or Washington conservative. Also, there are exceptions to these, so I don't want to hear "but not everyone is like that...."

Conservatives deal with the individual. Liberals deal in groups. NRA? Religious Organizations? Interest groups?
Conservatives want less government. Liberals want government to do more. Patriot Act, Military Commissions Act, Federal Wiretapping, Censoring scientists..
Conservatives want to decrease taxes to increase spending. Liberals want to tax the "evil rich." Conservatives have put us 10 trillion dollars in debt.
Conservatives are pro-business because they recognize they drive our economy. Liberals are anti-business because they believe the government can do it better. I am more conservative on the economy than most liberals...but I do not trust businesses. From destroying the environment to deceptive practices, to insurance companies that deny claims, etc, etc etc, they must be regulated and punished harshly when they do wrong.
Conservatives support privatized welfare through charities. Liberals support government funded welfare. I don't think either side is entirely right, but I side with conservatives on this.
Conservatives care about the environment, but care about the economy more. Liberals care about the environment, to a fault sometimes, and are willing to hurt business if it saves a species of bug that does more harm than good.Conservatives confuse environmentalism with caring about Koala bears. I care about the environment because I don't want cancer from air and water pollution, douche-bag.
Conservatives are anti-labor union and want people to get paid for an honest days work. Liberals are pro-union and want people to be over paid for the job they do (or don't do). This is just ridiculously biased and I don't even know what to say to it.
Conservatives are color blind. Liberals still use race as an issue. If conservatives were color blind, they wouldn't love getting their pictures taken with black people so much. Yes, we know that you want people to think you have black friends, but that doesn't change the fact that there are like 3 non-white people in the GOP.
Conservatives aren't victims. Liberals believe everyone is a victim.What?
My responses to a stunningly childish and divisive piece of rhetoric that looks like a script written by Karl Rove for the Fox and Friends.

Get over yourselves, things are not black and white. People have a tendency to think they are wise.

There's a quote that goes something like "The foolish man thinks he is wise. The wise man knows he is a fool."

PS- You can't post a retarded list and then tell people you don't want to hear their objections to it because you know that parts of it are retarded.

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Old 03-21-2008, 11:40 PM #97
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I dont understand how the OP said that "liberals"' want big government

because our current administration is 100% small government now
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:02 AM #98
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My parrents paid $50,000 in taxes for 07, they have a combined income of $170,000, now what i dont get is how so many people support somone that will raise taxes. There is even speculation that Obama will raise taxes 15-20%, which people cant afford, and yet this is the more popular person.
But to a liberal's mind, your parents still have $120,000. They still consider you rich, even though they took about 1/3 of your parents income.
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:25 AM #99
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My responses to a stunningly childish and divisive piece of rhetoric that looks like a script written by Karl Rove for the Fox and Friends.

Get over yourselves, things are not black and white. People have a tendency to think they are wise.

There's a quote that goes something like "The foolish man thinks he is wise. The wise man knows he is a fool."

PS- You can't post a retarded list and then tell people you don't want to hear their objections to it because you know that parts of it are retarded.
Hmm....reading comprehension isn't your strong point now is it?

You see that little message, in red, underlined, and in bold at the top of the page? Please re-read that. Every single example you mentioned was for a Washington Conservative and a Washington Liberal. I'm talking about ideology, not political affiliation.

Again with reading that little sentence at the top of the page you would've understood that the argument that I didn't want to hear was, "But not all liberals/conservatives are like that." There are exceptions to every rule and nothing is absolute. So my little "retarded list" was my opinion, and yes it is bias. It wouldn't be much of a debate if it wasn't bias now would it?

The only two things I'll clarify for you is the first and last line. When I said liberals deal in groups, I was talking about social groups. Whites, Blacks, Hispanics....Gays, Straights....basically they see things in groups of people not as individuals. They don't want the individual, because the individual is a threat to big government. The individual thinks for himself and makes his own decisions, which means the government can't do it for him. The reason they are so successful with this approach is that its easier to gather people together who believe themselves a part of a group, not as an individual.

As for the last line, Neal Boortz said something on the radio either today or yesterday (days run together with a new born). He basically said that life is easier as a victim. "I didn't get the job because I was black....not because I lacked the education or experience needed for the job." How about, "Man, you pulled me over because I'm Mexican....not because your window tint was so dark that I couldn't tell if my own mother was driving the vehicle, especially since its night time." Liberals want to keep people victimized...why do you think the NAACP is still around and is strong as ever. They keep telling black people that they're victims, which is keeping them down. Being a victim means you don't have to work as hard at life. "Man that teacher flunked me because I'm gay....not because I didn't do the homework and didn't study for any of the tests."

However, with your reading comprehension skills that you showed tonight, I doubt that you'll understand this post.
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:40 AM #100
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Look at which president whose name starts with G and you tell me who does to much spending. If your going to be an idiot at least make your statement half belivable.
What is unbelievable about my statement? And why does hating liberals make me a Bush-lover? The MSM has done a number on you lol, theres more to politics than just "liberal" or "conservative". I can't think of a good president that shares my views that had power over the last century. (or two)
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:48 AM #101
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Sorry guys, big business is the future. You're just going to have to adjust to it. Go buy a double cheeseburger at McDonalds, get a 50lb bag of rice at Wal-Mart, send in for a 50$ mail in rebate from Best-Buy. Eventually you'll get used to it, and you won't have to complain anymore.
That's great and all but the problem arises when legislation is doctored and geared towards favoring them, especially considering the amount of sheer profit they make.

If we're going to make the generalization that big businesses are the kernel of economic propulsion, then should they not be held to at least the same standards as everything else?
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Old 03-22-2008, 01:00 AM #102
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That's great and all but the problem arises when legislation is doctored and geared towards favoring them, especially considering the amount of sheer profit they make.

If we're going to make the generalization that big businesses are the kernel of economic propulsion, then should they not be held to at least the same standards as everything else?
Why? Not everyone is equal. If you give big business preferential treatment, they stay in the US (or come to the US) instead of going to another country that can give them more. I'm sure a lot of major corporations have been tempted to go to other countries for bigger benefits, which would help their economy and hurt ours.

Also, what do you think most business do with their profit? They put it right back into the business for it to grow. Not to mention, probably every big business is incorporated and not one person gets a big lump sum of money....so where does that "profit" go? CEOs and other upper management have capped salaries....so it doesn't go to them. Maybe some middle management get larger bonuses, but that helps out the lower upper class and upper middle class....and probably pushes them up a bracket or two.

Remember profit isn't evil, its necessary.
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Old 03-22-2008, 03:08 AM #103
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How does the Malthusian fit into all that?
If it was meant to die then it should die.

I also believe in the acquisition of resources by any means possible.
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Old 03-22-2008, 11:48 AM #104
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Originally Posted by paintballer9876 View Post
Big business is good and bad, its bad because it runs small business out of business. Its good because poor people then have a place to go that is a little cheaper saving there money.

My parrents paid $50,000 in taxes for 07, they have a combined income of $170,000, now what i dont get is how so many people support somone that will raise taxes. There is even speculation that Obama will raise taxes 15-20%, which people cant afford, and yet this is the more popular person.

Taxing the rich actually hurts the workig class more, and anyone with a tiny bit of common sence would understand that. When you tax the rich more they lose money and then they higher less people or lay off people, giving people less jobs. So when talking about the economy big business would keep us out of a depression more than anything.
Ugh, supply-side/trickle down economics has NEVER been even close to proven. You can't come in here, make that statement and pass it off as "fact".
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Old 03-22-2008, 12:15 PM #105
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Ugh, supply-side/trickle down economics has NEVER been even close to proven. You can't come in here, make that statement and pass it off as "fact".
It hasn't been "proven" because in a real economy, you can't hold everything else constant. In that respect, no ecomonic theory has ever been "proven" because other variables are changing at the same time. They're all theories.

However, supply side economics is a very valid theory and many economists believe it exists and works.
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