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Old 03-14-2008, 04:01 PM #1
GrantR
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Official Smart Parts Legalities Discussion Thread

MOD NOTE: As this thread grows, there may be temptations to rehash things that have already been covered. PLEASE, if you're coming into this thread cold, don't start at the end and just drop a post. READ the thread. Yes, it's long. But really, it's not going to help if it's super-long but 1/3 the content it should be.

Instead of filling up every smart parts related thread with SP hate, maybe we could concentrate it here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pump Scout View Post
If folks could air their grievances (or perceived grievances) in a remotely mature fashion, I wouldn't mind letting a gripe thread live. Problem is that those threads turn into the idiocy that cropped up here. I seem to recall there may be something along these lines in PBTalkaintball Legalities. If there isn't, that might be a good place to start.


I'll start with, how is this news!?!? http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=2598005

MOD EDIT
The intent of this thread is to have a place to discuss - with some intelligence and direction - the legalities of Smart Parts' business moves. Blatantly wrong information will not be allowed. Rumoring will not be allowed. It is not just a general "whine about Smart Parts at random" thread, it's a place to gather any and all discussion about the legalities involved.

Post at will, but remember that due to the inflamatory nature of a thread like this, it will be watched closely.

MOD EDIT #2
Title adjusted to Smart Parts Legalities Discussion Thread. That's the real intent of this thread, not as a real "gripe about Smart Parts" thread.

Last edited by Pump Scout : 04-18-2008 at 01:40 PM.
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Old 03-14-2008, 04:19 PM #2
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think of all the things that could be if it weren't for them...AKA could have had some amazing guns
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Old 03-14-2008, 04:22 PM #3
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We will never get to see the Evil M
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Old 03-14-2008, 04:34 PM #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by little al
Someone asked what would AKA be making if it was still around and SP and Larry and Eileen had not done what they did. Here is a list of things that were on the drawing board to be brought out. Many of the designs were close to being finished or were ready to be prototyped. If licensing fees were reasonable so small a family run American company could offer them, AKA might have been able to continue to make markers.

Evil-M: Many people donít believe it was real. It was, I still have a few in my garage. This was a stacked tube marker using all the proven components from the Viking and a new LPR using a new extrusion for the body that was based off of the Merlin extrusion but even better.

Generation 3 Excal: The 2004 Excal is actually classed as generation 2. I had Gen 3 mostly ready to be prototyped when the above things happened. The electronics were moved to the grip to go trayless. There were a few other refinements.

Scenario Gun that looks very real.

Nitro system: It had a fixed output with High flow. Built in on-off and a dove tail rail machined into the body. This was on my short list of projects before all the above things happened. It would have been out about 1.5 years before another company released something similar just a while back.

New pressure Regulators that even outperformed the 2-Liter.

Generation 4 Excal: I finished this design up early this spring, yes I still enjoy designing paintball stuff. The Gen 4 is the most refined and best Excal yet. The marker contains a number of changes that would have kept this marker on top as well as brought the production cost way down. It is much smaller height and length more than any Excal or electro closed bolt marker out there. It has a new eye system, new solenoid layout. New grip layout based on the Evil-M. A custom MQ-valve to replace the venerable Tornado valve. A new LPR, new Lightining bolt and much more. I still have a few pieces of Excal extrusion, maybe this winter Iíll get a chance to make the prototype so Iíll at least be able to play with them and my little son will have one to play with when he is old enough.

Spool valve marker. Yes I had two designs that I was playing around with for spool valve marker. They would have been efficient and reliable.

Of course there would have been upgrades parts developed for other markers

Outside of paintball market I was working on a Gas piston conversion system for the M16/AR-15. I still take my prototype out some and shoot it. It works great. I was also working on other firearms related products.

I really appriacted everyone's support for the company while it was still around.

Little Al
(Aaron K. Alexander)
from a thread in AKA this makes me very depressed
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Old 03-14-2008, 04:47 PM #5
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I think a little bit of me just died. Also what AKA did to aaron is another story

I wonder if AKA could have made a gun that works underwater!!!!
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Old 03-14-2008, 05:55 PM #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrantR View Post
I'll start with, how is this news!?!? http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.php?t=2598005
For what it's worth, News Ups act as short-term advertisements. That's why that thread is in the News section.
http://www.pbnation.com/up.php?uptype=News
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Old 03-14-2008, 06:12 PM #7
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Quote:
Description..............News Up........Regular News Post
Advertisements...............Yes.................. ....No
I guess that source of revenue is a place where I disagree with the owners of pbnation.
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Old 03-14-2008, 07:01 PM #8
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The sad part is that 98% of the paintball playing public has either forgotten, doesn't care, or started playing paintball after SP single handedly took out 3 or 4 of its competitors with one BS move. The only Sp products I have purchased in this decade was a wooden grip back in 2001 and some used freak barrel inserts for use in my Deadly wind barrel. Personally I will be damned if they ever get a penny of my money before I start pushing up daisies. They always get the thumbs down whenever I am asked about what I think of the company, the people who represent them, and their products.
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Old 03-14-2008, 07:25 PM #9
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That is so true, there are enough new players now, that even the people that don't like SP are mostly band wagoners, and virtually nobody knows the facts.
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Old 03-14-2008, 07:45 PM #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loki32687 View Post
from a thread in AKA this makes me very depressed
I remember reading that, it's a damn shame Sp put AKA out of business, same with AGD.
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Old 03-14-2008, 08:02 PM #11
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When did AGD go out of business?
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Old 03-14-2008, 08:14 PM #12
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the difference between being out of business, and not making markers anymore is small to most.
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Old 03-14-2008, 08:26 PM #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrantR View Post
the difference between being out of business, and not making markers anymore is small to most.
Huh? http://store.airgundesignsusa.com/
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:24 PM #14
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I guess I just assumed that because I hadn't heard anything about AGD in about 3 years that they stopped making new guns.
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:42 PM #15
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AGD is still around, just nothing new coming out. I'm not really up to speed on whats going on, but I think they are selling what they have left. I'd put them near where AKA is, but a step higher. Don't quote me on this.

On the topic of Smart Parts, I one day decided to not support or buy from them, ever. Mainly because I didn't want a broken down Shocker. They do what businesses do, put competition out of business and sell products. They didn't always do it on the most straight terms, they still did what they should. Make money. That much I give them.

I've seen things with their products and service that has caused me to stray customers and friends away from them. Smart Parts drives me nuts, I can't stand them and despise some the affect they've had. I think eventually the "low budget" marker will backfire heavily, and it'll be too late to realize that.
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:47 PM #16
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the budget marker has already made it harder for new players to maintain their equipment. Because the norm for rec play is now cheap fast electros, some new players feel they can't compete with a more reliable but slower marker.
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:49 PM #17
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a buddy just picked up a beautiful mag about 2 months ago....

still one of the better guns out there...
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Old 03-14-2008, 09:49 PM #18
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smart parts sucks and always will suck. the shoebox was a crap, the impulse started on a crap design (bushmaster) and make it even more crappier and brittle, and the sft was the lowest grade high end i have seen to date. (that custome anno fade you get after 1 month due to their **** material)
lets not forget the flop of the nerve that was supposed to be their flagship which turned out to be impulse 3 years after impulse died. im kinda glad sp gave up making high ends they definitely belong in the low end market
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:10 PM #19
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Newer players need to learn the basics of marker operation before keeping up a complicated(to them) peice of machinery. The Ion and SLG, PMR, they aren't really, "fire and forget" markers. They need regular bolt maintainence and cleaning. Some stores offer these services for free, but a large amount of people buying these lower end markers don't have that.

Some of the parts on those markers will crumble if left in the wrong hands.

The Shocker- what a POS, argggh.

The Ion needs stronger threads for the feedneck, seriously.
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Old 03-14-2008, 10:19 PM #20
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The lower priced markers are a blessing, and a problem.....

they require a certain amount of intuition, that some kids just dont have, and some will never get. Ive seem kids break every gun they own...Ego, Marq, shocker, pimp, defiant 2, timmy, shoebox, ego again, and even a 98.... al one person as well...i have also seen people use a walmart marker for 8 years with no issue...
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Old 03-14-2008, 11:21 PM #21
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People talk about the "good" smart parts did, but really they just lowered the quality, and thus the price, of paintball guns.
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