Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 06-12-2014, 10:22 AM #1
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Suggestions for my HPA fill station

Hey guys,

We have been filling CO2 at our shop for about 8 years now and we want to get into HPA/N2 filling since it's more popular now. We currently have a single lever fill station that attaches to our CO2 canister that comes from the welding shop, and its a very large tank. So here are my questions, and I've already gone through all the stickies FYI

If we get the same style tank in but it is filled with N2, can we use our CO2 fill station with the N2? If not why?

Since the tank will not be a scuba tank it will not be able to use a yoke since it doesn't have the same valve. How do I make a non-scuba tank work with a yoke or some how attach the scuba valve to the N2 tank and then use the yoke?

What are the things ill need if I can only get my hands on the bulk N2 tank and need to set up a fill station?

Thanks again in advance to anyone who tries to help!
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 06-12-2014, 11:10 AM #2
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
I also see that Ninja makes a $300 dollar fill unit and I was wondering if that is pretty much all I need besides my bulk tank.

Provided is the link to the product:

http://www.airtanksplus.com/products...e-fill-station
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 11:17 AM #3
robdavy
Field Owner
 
robdavy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Edmonton, AB
Hey,

No, you can't use your CO2 fill station. Almost certainly not rated for enough pressue.

BUT, we were in the same boat. And we bought this from a field near us:



We paid $150 I think. Has a price sticker of $189 on it. It's just some bits screwed together, but works well if you're not doing a ton of fills.

The thing you linked to from Ninja is basically the same thing, but with a regulator (stops you over filling - we just use the gauges) and two gauges so you can see how much is left in your bulk tank.

And bulk tank wise, although they look the same, the CO2 ones are rated for 3000psi (but are filled with much less) and your N2 should be 4500psi. The tanks are about twice the price to buy because of how much stronger they need to be.

Also, I don't know what the market is like where you are, but we pay much more for N2 than CO2 fill-per-fill wise (comparing a 20oz CO2 with a 48cu N2). Make sure you work out how much your N2 fills are costing you when you price it for customers.

Hope that helps!
__________________
Edmonton Paintball Centre
10010 107a Ave NW, Edmonton, Alberta, T5H 4H8
(780) 800 2324
robdavy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 11:23 AM #4
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by robdavy View Post
Hey,

No, you can't use your CO2 fill station. Almost certainly not rated for enough pressue.

BUT, we were in the same boat. And we bought this from a field near us:



We paid $150 I think. Has a price sticker of $189 on it. It's just some bits screwed together, but works well if you're not doing a ton of fills.

The thing you linked to from Ninja is basically the same thing, but with a regulator (stops you over filling - we just use the gauges) and two gauges so you can see how much is left in your bulk tank.

And bulk tank wise, although they look the same, the CO2 ones are rated for 3000psi (but are filled with much less) and your N2 should be 4500psi. The tanks are about twice the price to buy because of how much stronger they need to be.

Also, I don't know what the market is like where you are, but we pay much more for N2 than CO2 fill-per-fill wise (comparing a 20oz CO2 with a 48cu N2). Make sure you work out how much your N2 fills are costing you when you price it for customers.

Hope that helps!
Thank you so much!

If you don't mind me asking, how much do you charge per fill? We will be the only people with HPA/N2 available within about 75 mile radius with lots of players, which is the main reason we are getting a jump on our local dunhams about 30 miles away. They only supply CO2 at the moment though but we get their trickle down since they are complained about all the time of shorting people on CO2 and not even having HPA.

I'll be getting prices today from our suppliers though so hopefully we can get a good price for it.

It seems my best and safest bet would be the ninja fill station.
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 11:54 AM #5
robdavy
Field Owner
 
robdavy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Edmonton, AB
We don't charge for N2 fills for our players (not many, we're mostly renters). We don't fill N2 for people who aren't playing here.
We do fill CO2 for non-customers at 50c/oz. If we were to fill N2 for people, I wouldn't do anything for less than $10. But that's just because we're not a store and random people coming in for random things is a PITA.
__________________
Edmonton Paintball Centre
10010 107a Ave NW, Edmonton, Alberta, T5H 4H8
(780) 800 2324
robdavy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 11:55 AM #6
Rob @ Ninja PB
 
 
Rob @ Ninja PB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Chicago, IL
Rob @ Ninja PB works for a Paintball manufacturer
Rob @ Ninja PB owns a Planet Eclipse Ego
Rob @ Ninja PB supports Team VICIOUS
Rob @ Ninja PB supports our troops
Quote:
Originally Posted by RTG_ZeUs_17 View Post
Thank you so much!

If you don't mind me asking, how much do you charge per fill? We will be the only people with HPA/N2 available within about 75 mile radius with lots of players, which is the main reason we are getting a jump on our local dunhams about 30 miles away. They only supply CO2 at the moment though but we get their trickle down since they are complained about all the time of shorting people on CO2 and not even having HPA.

I'll be getting prices today from our suppliers though so hopefully we can get a good price for it.

It seems my best and safest bet would be the ninja fill station.
give us a call or shoot us an email and we will be happy to help you out!

ray
__________________
http://www.ninjapaintball.com
http://www.facebook.com/ninjapaintball
NINJA IS PROUDLY MADE IN THE USA - NOT CHINA
Certfied Hydro Test Facility - DOT RIN# G777
NINJA USERS CLUB
Rob @ Ninja PB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 12:12 PM #7
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob @ Ninja PB View Post
give us a call or shoot us an email and we will be happy to help you out!

ray
You're name says rob but your sig say ray haha, but whoever you are what is your email?
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 12:19 PM #8
Rob @ Ninja PB
 
 
Rob @ Ninja PB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Chicago, IL
Rob @ Ninja PB works for a Paintball manufacturer
Rob @ Ninja PB owns a Planet Eclipse Ego
Rob @ Ninja PB supports Team VICIOUS
Rob @ Ninja PB supports our troops
Quote:
Originally Posted by RTG_ZeUs_17 View Post
You're name says rob but your sig say ray haha, but whoever you are what is your email?
sales@ninjapaintball.com

rob was an employee and when he left we kept this account so players can contact us with the same info.
__________________
http://www.ninjapaintball.com
http://www.facebook.com/ninjapaintball
NINJA IS PROUDLY MADE IN THE USA - NOT CHINA
Certfied Hydro Test Facility - DOT RIN# G777
NINJA USERS CLUB
Rob @ Ninja PB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 12:20 PM #9
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by robdavy View Post
We don't charge for N2 fills for our players (not many, we're mostly renters). We don't fill N2 for people who aren't playing here.
We do fill CO2 for non-customers at 50c/oz. If we were to fill N2 for people, I wouldn't do anything for less than $10. But that's just because we're not a store and random people coming in for random things is a PITA.
Thanks for all of your info man!
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 04:11 PM #10
got wake?
 
 
got wake?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
got wake? supports Empire
I honestly can't imagine only filling CO2! I'm about to no longer fill CO2 because of the cost involved with it. All my rental tanks are HPA. As close to free to fill as possible. Our of curiosity, how much are you spending on CO2 each year?
got wake? is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 08:24 PM #11
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by got wake? View Post
I honestly can't imagine only filling CO2! I'm about to no longer fill CO2 because of the cost involved with it. All my rental tanks are HPA. As close to free to fill as possible. Our of curiosity, how much are you spending on CO2 each year?
Well its a small town here in northern Michigan. But this year we have only run through 3 tanks but we also have it all delivered. I really don't remember what we pay but its not cheap. I guess the bottom line is we just want to have it available along with co2 since not everyone here has HPA tanks.
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-12-2014, 09:20 PM #12
got wake?
 
 
got wake?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
got wake? supports Empire
Pickup a small gas compressor for filling your bulk tanks. I bought one as a backup for $500 used. If you're not filling HPA often, that'll be plenty. We use so much air that I can't imagine not having my electric compressor, though.
got wake? is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 09:38 AM #13
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by got wake? View Post
Pickup a small gas compressor for filling your bulk tanks. I bought one as a backup for $500 used. If you're not filling HPA often, that'll be plenty. We use so much air that I can't imagine not having my electric compressor, though.
I'd love to know where you purchased one for that cheap. Everything I have seen is well in the thousands. By gas compressor you mean a gas powered pump right? If thats the case we are also a small engine shop so if I could just buy everything but the motor and put one in there myself that would save some money for sure.

Any links you have on hand?
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 01:59 PM #14
got wake?
 
 
got wake?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
got wake? supports Empire
I'll try to get some info on the unit when I get to the field this weekend. From what I understand is that it was used for a flame thrower application. It's not the usual gas compressor most fields would be looking for since they'd be running a lot more and are styled for scuba diving compressed air. It goes to 3k psi and works well enough for emergency situations at my field. If you're not needing a lot of HPA, it should work fine as long as you have bulk tanks to fill over time.
got wake? is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 10:39 PM #15
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by got wake? View Post
I'll try to get some info on the unit when I get to the field this weekend. From what I understand is that it was used for a flame thrower application. It's not the usual gas compressor most fields would be looking for since they'd be running a lot more and are styled for scuba diving compressed air. It goes to 3k psi and works well enough for emergency situations at my field. If you're not needing a lot of HPA, it should work fine as long as you have bulk tanks to fill over time.
Unless you have a parts list that will let me build my own compressor

But yeah we honestly will be filling hpa probably twice a week to 5 tanks a week at most when the weekenders come up. Something like that would be perfect.
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-13-2014, 11:24 PM #16
RTG_ZeUs_17
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Ive also gotta ask, would it hurt if I just purchased N2 gas from our current CO2 suppliers? I feel like it will be more expensive to just go with N2 in the long run, but there is no way our business will shell out 2.5k for a compressor. Its tough enough for us to get tanks and stuff since were a small business.

Also does anyone know if the company Airgas sells compressed air?

Just need options since there are people waiting to buy Hpa powered guns but they won't till our store gets hpa available.
__________________
Lincoln Outdoor Center:
Ninja paintball and Empire Dealer

GoG eXtcy: Virtue Board, more to come!

Spyder Pilot ACS: Supafly bolt, Virtue Board, Dye stickies, J&J 2pc, rap4(POS!) clamping feedneck

Tippmann 98c "WIP"
RTG_ZeUs_17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2014, 01:02 AM #17
robdavy
Field Owner
 
robdavy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Edmonton, AB
Oh for sure it'll be cheaper just to get a fill station like ours and get N2 from your current gas supplier, in the short term anyway.

For some reason, we found compressed air is more expensive than compressed N2 at the same pressure. I think it's because the compressed air is breathing air, so super clean, etc. But getting compressed N2 is just fine
__________________
Edmonton Paintball Centre
10010 107a Ave NW, Edmonton, Alberta, T5H 4H8
(780) 800 2324
robdavy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2014, 01:35 AM #18
doodlebugsportz
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Everett,WA
Check with the local welding gas supplier and find out if they carried Compressed air. The one close to used to supply a 6k tank that is used to flush water lines (regulated down) and it is less expensive than N2.
On the fill station, get a Ninja (Pressure Specialist) regulated fill station (or look for a used Kingman Java-same thing) and do 3k fills. Get with Ray and he can get you set up.
I would recommend doing only 3k fills, your bulk tank will last longer and once you drop below 4.5k customers will start to complain about short fills. We get $5 for a 3k fill and $7.50 for 4.5K (we have a booster as well).
__________________
Make Your .68 Caliber a Multi caliber Marker-.50 caliber Conversion Kits for Tippmann & GOG
PaintballInnovations.com

Don-DoodleBug Sportz- NW Paintball At Its Best! www.doodlebugsportz.com
Paintball Innovations- 50 Caliber Solutions www.paintballinnovations.com
doodlebugsportz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2014, 09:27 AM #19
got wake?
 
 
got wake?'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
got wake? supports Empire
Quote:
Originally Posted by doodlebugsportz View Post
Check with the local welding gas supplier and find out if they carried Compressed air. The one close to used to supply a 6k tank that is used to flush water lines (regulated down) and it is less expensive than N2. On the fill station, get a Ninja (Pressure Specialist) regulated fill station (or look for a used Kingman Java-same thing) and do 3k fills. Get with Ray and he can get you set up. I would recommend doing only 3k fills, your bulk tank will last longer and once you drop below 4.5k customers will start to complain about short fills. We get $5 for a 3k fill and $7.50 for 4.5K (we have a booster as well).

^^^^ Excellent advice. Also, look up cascade filling if you are going to buy air. Then you won't waste air trying to fill to 4.5k with say two tanks. One just for up to 3k, and a second to top off. That is only if your customers need it. Down here with the temp changes, CO2 gets downright dangerous. And requires constant chronoing and adjustment to keep all the guns within safe limits. With HPA, it's pretty much set and forget.
got wake? is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2014, 10:28 AM #20
doodlebugsportz
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Everett,WA
Quote:
Originally Posted by got wake? View Post
^^^^ Excellent advice. Also, look up cascade filling if you are going to buy air. Then you won't waste air trying to fill to 4.5k with say two tanks. One just for up to 3k, and a second to top off. That is only if your customers need it. Down here with the temp changes, CO2 gets downright dangerous. And requires constant chronoing and adjustment to keep all the guns within safe limits. With HPA, it's pretty much set and forget.
Cascading works good as long as everyone remembers to close the low tank valve before opening the high tank... Back when we did it at our outdoor field ( we ran a 3 tank cascade), It was only a matter of when one of the staff would get busy and leave the low valve open....Honestly, we only offer 3K fills in our Proshop (its a stand alone-No compressor onsite. We fill our own bulk tanks at the Indoor Field) and have never had a complaint. Our booster is at the Indoor from when we had a Proshop there (we moved it to a stand alone to make room for party rooms). The walk in players at both fields get a max of whatever the bank tanks are at (usually 3800 or more) and really no issues.

Not sure where your at, but keep in mind, even with HPA and a uncontrolled climate (outdoor), Markers should be chronoed thru out the day due to humidity and temp changes causing the balls themselves to grow a bit, causing a tighter bore fit and increasing velocity. Our field limit is set at 285 to leave us a bit of cushion (insurance allows up to 300), so when you set a CO2 powered gun at 270-280 to stay under the field limit, its usually within the safety limits, but again, needs to be checked thru out the day.

Rabble, rabble...
__________________
Make Your .68 Caliber a Multi caliber Marker-.50 caliber Conversion Kits for Tippmann & GOG
PaintballInnovations.com

Don-DoodleBug Sportz- NW Paintball At Its Best! www.doodlebugsportz.com
Paintball Innovations- 50 Caliber Solutions www.paintballinnovations.com
doodlebugsportz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2014, 11:00 AM #21
generalee72
Knight who says Ni
 
generalee72's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Port St. Lucie, Fl.
generalee72 is a Moderator
generalee72 is a Supporting Member
generalee72 donated to help Peyton Trent
generalee72 supports our troops
generalee72 is reppin' sidebar 4 life
generalee72 has perfected Level 2 in PbNation Pursuit
Might also consider only filling tanks to 3k-3.5k. Customers won't be that excited about it, but it feels more reliable to get all day 3k then to watch the available pressure drop all day. It might sound odd, but it makes sense in my head, I used to prefer that.

Although it won't really work for "tournament players", it doesn't sound like that's your target.

Another idea is a booster, might be worth looking into, I like them but not everyone does.
__________________
lPlAlIlNlTlBlAlLlLl
My Anti-Savings Account

Ability is what you’re capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it. –Lou Holtz (via-John Maxwell)

Advice for the thread: "how to open a paintball store"
NastyShock3r: hey guy's i live in miami i need help to open a paintball store can anyone help or can tell me what i need to do?
midstatepaintball: That's easy! Just push on the front door of the store if it says "push", or pull on the door if it says "pull".
generalee72 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
Forum Jump