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Old 09-01-2007, 07:46 PM #85
boadey
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Originally Posted by Spyderman06 View Post
Wow. You guys are all geniuses. There are only two requirements for combustion- Oxygen and an ignition source. Yes, adding pure diatomic Oxygen into things such as Acetylene torches and the V2 rocket does help accelerate the combustion, but the fact that you are missing is that flame is the result of the combustion of atmospheric Oxygen. Don't believe me? Why do you think that if you light a candle in a jar, and then seal off the jar, the fire will go out? Because combustion is the reaction of Organic material that produces only Water (H20) and Carbon Dioxide (CO2). Therefore, since you have Oxygen as a product, it must also be a reactant. For example, for the combustion of Octane (The fuel that runs any gasoline powered car) the balanced reaction is as follows:
1 C8H18 + 25 O2= 8 CO2 + 9 H2O

As you can see, diatomic oxygen is indeed a reactant and is still present in the product side of the reaction, bonded to the Hydrogen to form water.

Anyways, to answer the OP' s question- you will be fine filling the oxygen tanks, so long as you do not exceed the pressure ratings of the tank. Don't know the rating? Do not mess with it. And washing the tanks will not do anything. If you are worried about residual oxygen, the best thing you can do is to just let it air out for a day or two with the valve assembly off. However, to be able to fill an air tank off of it, you will need a fill station set up.
pretty close but there are actually three requirments HEAT,FUEL,OXYGEN , not just two without all three fire can not exist (fire tetrahedron) ....look it up
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Old 09-01-2007, 07:55 PM #86
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Originally Posted by boadey View Post
pretty close but there are actually three requirments HEAT,FUEL,OXYGEN , not just two without all three fire can not exist (fire tetrahedron) ....look it up
its the fire triangle.
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Old 09-01-2007, 08:26 PM #87
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with oxygen from a tank you dont need an ignition source you just need the right enviroment for things to go bad dont do it and if so .. please have you family send me a copy of you obituary so i can laugh at you ..
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Old 09-01-2007, 09:20 PM #88
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Originally Posted by East Side Factory pb View Post
with oxygen from a tank you dont need an ignition source you just need the right enviroment for things to go bad dont do it and if so .. please have you family send me a copy of you obituary so i can laugh at you ..

You always need heat. No fires (or anything else, for that matter) will occur at absolute zero.


It's just that in an oxygen rich evironment, you might find something which might burn at room temperature, thus not needing a specific ignition source.






This whole thread has become rediculous. Why not just leave it at "lots of oxygen (gas, hot sparky things, dangerous stuff, cliffs, planes with (suddenly) no wings, etc...) can be dangerous, plan accordingly..."?
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Old 09-01-2007, 09:47 PM #89
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in almost any real world environment there is going to be something present that will be flamable along with that oxygen. this will cause a fire. be careful.... say there is something in the tank (metal or otherwise) when the tank is filled, the pressure on the oxygen would cause friction. this would ignite the oxygen there for causing an explosing due to the other material inside the tank.
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Old 09-02-2007, 12:35 AM #90
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen#Precautions

go read ****ing wikipedia

Oxygen is a reactant, not a fuel. oxygen needs a fuel to start a reaction called combustion.
Like in the reaction between hydrogen and oxygen. 2Hs+Os=2HsO+Heat (i used s as subscript 2) The HEAT is the fire that the reaction between the hydrogen and oxygen. This is just getting ridiculous. Doesn't ANYONE know how to ****ing google anymore?!

you don't need heat, you need an ignition, something to start the reaction. Heat is a byproduct of the reaction. Of course fire won't happen at absolute zero, because the reaction would CAUSE heat.
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Old 09-02-2007, 01:59 AM #91
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as far as paintball uses go, O2 is just fine to use in a marker. as long as the rated pressure of the tank isnt exceeded, i dont see why it would matter.

Oxygen, by itself, WILL NOT BURN. If it did, our atmosphere (which is 20.9% oxygen) would have burned up a long time ago.

Flames, fire and all related chemical reactions are a result of a FUEL being OXIDIZED, or being combined with oxygen. The application of oxygen to a burning fuel will cause the fire to burn much more vigorously, as well as hotter.

Oxygen is mixed with a number of different fuel sources to get a faster, hotter burn. Acetylene, used in metal cutting torches, is mixed with oxygen to get a super hot flame that will quickly cut through metal.
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Old 09-02-2007, 11:44 AM #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sniper1rfa View Post
You always need heat. No fires (or anything else, for that matter) will occur at absolute zero.


It's just that in an oxygen rich evironment, you might find something which might burn at room temperature, thus not needing a specific ignition source.






This whole thread has become rediculous. Why not just leave it at "lots of oxygen (gas, hot sparky things, dangerous stuff) can be dangerous, plan accordingly..."?
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Originally Posted by RabidHobo View Post
as far as paintball uses go, O2 is just fine to use in a marker. as long as the rated pressure of the tank isnt exceeded, i dont see why it would matter.

Oxygen, by itself, WILL NOT BURN. If it did, our atmosphere (which is 20.9% oxygen) would have burned up a long time ago.

Flames, fire and all related chemical reactions are a result of a FUEL being OXIDIZED, or being combined with oxygen. The application of oxygen to a burning fuel will cause the fire to burn much more vigorously, as well as hotter.

Oxygen is mixed with a number of different fuel sources to get a faster, hotter burn. Acetylene, used in metal cutting torches, is mixed with oxygen to get a super hot flame that will quickly cut through metal.
These men tell the truth



Also, heat is a relative term when you're talking about the fire triangle. Combustion reactions do generate heat, but they usually require a certain amount of energy (called activation energy) before they can begin, even though they are exothermic reactions (read this). However, concentration of reactants has an inverse relationship to activation energy and sometimes it will lower the activation energy to the point where no additional energy is required to begin the reaction and it will combust spontaneously (read this). The reason behind this is that the number of effective collisions between the reactants is increased when you raise the concentration, pressure or velocity (temperature) of the molecules in the reaction (read this). So, this means that without the presence of heat (absolute zero) you will not get any fire at all, simply because the molecules aren't moving around and colliding with eachother. So if you want to be completely safe, drain your tanks when the temperature outside is 0 Kalvin . (but seriously, if you drain them slowly in a field nothing is going to happen)

There, let me know if I got something wrong.


PS - anyone who still thinks oxygen is flammable, and doesn't trust wikipedia, read this: http://www.newton.dep.anl.gov/askasc.../chem03291.htm


PPS - Something that I think is being miscommunicated is that everyone here knows and agrees that pure oxygen can be a fire hazard, but that doesn't mean that it's flammable.

PPPS - I love how everyone arguing that oxygen isn't flammable is actually putting forth solid arguments, whereas everyone arguing that oxygen is flammable is just like "anyone who thinks oxygen isn't flammable needs to be drop kicked in the throat".

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Old 09-02-2007, 01:06 PM #93
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Yeah, you ****ed up, Mkriegs.


Kelvin is spelled with an "E". You obviously haven't got a clue.


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Old 09-02-2007, 04:12 PM #94
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Originally Posted by sniper1rfa View Post
Yeah, you ****ed up, Mkriegs.


Kelvin is spelled with an "E". You obviously haven't got a clue.


That completely changes everything!

All that I believed is now null and void

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Old 09-02-2007, 05:20 PM #95
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Mkriegs, that site you posted (with the yellow background, don't remember the page name) Was the site I used to get all the right words and information haha. Great write up on the matter.
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Old 09-02-2007, 09:53 PM #96
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Oh yeah, and draining them at absolute zero would be tough, too, on account of the not possible for anything to move bit.


Maybe 1 kelvin? Enough to chip away the O2 Ice Chunk?
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Old 09-02-2007, 10:14 PM #97
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Wow this right here is what gives paintballers a bad name. Yes flameable is the right name for it because oxygen is a fuel. And if you consider wood a fuel and it burns what would oxygen be? Also you can create flame without oxygen however that is obviously way beond most of the people in this thread I dont mean to troll. Also there is no need to drain the tanks you can use pure oxygen in your guns isnt gonna hurt it. Infact my dad works at a lab andf I fill my tank with there pure oxygen....LOL the wonder whare there oxygen goes. Anyways another thing you need to think abou is youll need to cascade the tanks since you dont have a compressor you need it to be like 3000psi+3000psi with a reg after them because you use the reg to fill your tank and you can only fill your tank with half as much pressure as is in your larger tank. So if it has 3000 psi in it you can only fill your tank to 1500 then the next time you can only fill to 750 you see.
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Old 09-02-2007, 10:20 PM #98
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good god, you're all retarded or something.

fire is a triangle. see diagram below:


just like taking away a leg of a triangle makes it not a triangle, taking away one of the parts of fire makes it, you guessed it, not a fire.

you will not have a combustion reaction without any one part. meaning if you take away the fuel, the oxygen will not burn.

to stamantpimp: yeah, it will go "boom," because the match is the fuel source. if you could somehow run an arc of electricity through a chamber of pure oxygen, so there are no impurities, and no fuel, NOTHING WOULD HAPPEN! why? OXYGEN DOESN'T BURN! it OXIDIZES!

the person who posted the formula for octane combustion in air had it right. you need all 3 legs of the fire triangle to have fire, as well as certain compounds. one is a hydrocarbon, the other is oxygen. oxygen is a substance that allows the hydrocarbon to combust.

there. i proved it in pretty simple terms.


by the way, stamantpimp, if you think middle school comes before preschool, you might need to go back to preschool and find out. just a thought.
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Old 09-02-2007, 10:39 PM #99
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****IN RETARDS FIRE NEEDS OXYGEN OR IT WONT BURN IF YOU TAKE A FILLED OXYGEN TANK CRACK THE VALVE PUT A MATCK UP TO IT THE TANK WILL GO BOOM IS THAT PRESCHOOL ENOUGH FOR YOU IF NOT GO BACK TO ****IN MIDDLE SCHOOL
okay, I feel like we're just sort of hitting on the same points over and over and over and it's giving me a headache. So, instead of arguing some more I just did a google search for "is oxygen flammable?" (w/ quotes), here are the FIRST ten pages in the EXACT order that google ranked them:

1 - Yahoo! Answers - Verdict: NOT FLAMMABLE
2 - General Chemistry Online - Verdict: NOT FLAMMABLE
3 - MadSci Network - Verdict: NOT FLAMMABLE
4 - American Journal of Nursing - Verdict: Page had no relevant info on it, shame on you Google.
5 - Neowin Forums - Verdict: Mixed answers (it's a forum)
6 - Live QnA Beta - Verdict: NOT FLAMMABLE (according to the best answer and a large majority of the others)
7 - Naked Scientists Forum - Verdict: NOT FLAMMABLE (according to 100% of the posters)
8 - DigitalCorvettes.com - Verdict: Mixed answers, but what the hell would a car forum know about chemistry anyway? (evidently about as much as a paintball forum )
9 - flammablefluids.com - Verdict: Site had NOTHING to do with the question.
10 - Jazzmysite.com - Verdict: NOT FLAMMABLE

6 out of the 6 definite answers all said that oxygen is NOT flammable.

There, is that "preschool" enough for you? Those are the very first search results on google, I didn't cherry-pick these. In fact, here's a link to the google search in case you're too lazy: LINK

EDIT -
Quote:
Originally Posted by cww516 View Post


just like taking away a leg of a triangle makes it not a triangle, taking away one of the parts of fire makes it, you guessed it, not a fire.

you will not have a combustion reaction without any one part. meaning if you take away the fuel, the oxygen will not burn.
Well put, simplest proof you could ever want.

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Old 09-02-2007, 11:52 PM #100
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Old 09-03-2007, 01:03 AM #101
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sweet ****ing jesus, I"M BACK GAIZ!
HAI!


Anyway, we need a special thread for this topic alone. This has already been gone over twice in at least the last few months, and retards still think oxygen is flammable.

Also, if I remember correctly, an o2 tank(for welding) has reverse threads on it. I'd check, but I'd be ****'d if I'm going out to look at our torch at this hour.
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Old 09-03-2007, 07:43 AM #102
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sweet ****ing jesus, I"M BACK GAIZ!
HAI!


Anyway, we need a special thread for this topic alone. This has already been gone over twice in at least the last few months, and retards still think oxygen is flammable.

Also, if I remember correctly, an o2 tank(for welding) has reverse threads on it. I'd check, but I'd be ****'d if I'm going out to look at our torch at this hour.
isnt acentyline(sp) the one with reversed threads? i cant remember its been a year since i had welding class
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Old 09-03-2007, 09:33 AM #103
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My god. People really hold on to their beliefs in the face of anything, don't they?

Have you noticed that most of the advocates of "Not flammable (but still dangerous)" have used things like grammar, spelling, and organization in their posts, where most of the advocates of "flammable" use things like leet speak, insults, and ALL CAPS (that man is yelly, momma!)?


Odd.

stamantpimp: Screaming and yelling and name calling are generally not considered effective methods of persuasion. Sorry to burst your bubble. Next time try the three parts of rhetoric, as put forth by aristotle - logic, emotion, and character. Play towards your audiences emotions, use logic rather than force, and maintain a character which your audience can get along with. Read up on rhetoric, it might make you a better speaker, could land you better jobs and might gain you more respect and authority.




I'd bet that the oxygen tank is reverse threaded, since you generally have to use seperate regulators and oxygen specific fittings/equipment when handling oxygen, whereas many other gasses can use the same stuff. Mostly due to lubrication and rust, I think.
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Old 09-03-2007, 09:37 AM #104
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to every1 in here who says oxygen isnt flamable if you knew anything w/ out oxygen you cannot make a fire you learn that in training and college when becoming a fire fighter so dont say other wise
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Old 09-03-2007, 10:05 AM #105
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to every1 in here who says oxygen isnt flamable if you knew anything w/ out oxygen you cannot make a fire you learn that in training and college when becoming a fire fighter so dont say other wise
we all know that, but that doesn't make oxygen flammable.
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