Why is my gun a gas hog? - PbNation
Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

 
Archived Thread - Cannot Edit  
Old 05-08-2001, 01:54 PM #1
Rioken
 
 
Rioken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Lexington, KY
 has been a member for 10 years
Question

Here are the specs

RAT 3:16 (using the shocktech springs)
KAPP Hammer Kit
Shocktech Venturi Bolt
Palmer Rock
STO Ram
PnP 3way
WGP Ergo Reg
68/4500 Apocalypse
14" Boomstick

I tuned the gun by starting the reg down low and the velocity adjuster backed out. I turned the reg up till the velocity started to come down then I backed the reg up to the point that the velocity was at its max. Then I started turn the adjuster in and had to turn it in very far to get the velocity up to the 280's and now I'm getting like 200-300 shots per 1000psi. Before I got the RAT valve I had a Tornado valve in and tuned it the same way and only got around 1000 shots to a full tank (4500psi), is my gun possessed by the air hog gods or something?
__________________
Spyder Rodeo
-One Kit/Custom Switch
-4 Piece Empire
Rioken is offline  
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 05-08-2001, 02:30 PM #2
Yochinaman
Gun Gigolo
 
Yochinaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Ottawa, ON
Yochinaman is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
I had about the same probs with my RAT 3 valve and springs. I've come to the conclusion that most others have come to. The springs included with the RAT 3 valve are garbage and should be swapped. I'd try a heavier valve spring, like a blue. I'm using AKA's matched spring set and am having good results. I believe they are equivelent to blue valve and yellow/green main. Other than that, does your bolt fit well in the bolt chamber? Having a bolt that fits too loosely will allow gas to escape around the bolt and you again lose efficiency. Instead of cranking in the velocity adjuster a lot just change to a heavier spring. But I'm just anal like that.

Yochi.
Yochinaman is offline  
Old 05-08-2001, 03:46 PM #3
Budha
Paint Slüt
 
Budha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Northern VA
 has been a member for 10 years
I dont want to sound like an ***, but that is what you get for messing with your internals. I mean I sound bad, but your gun was probably working fine without the new rat and such, but that is what happens when inexperienced hands do stuff. Let a certified cocker tech do it for you, you should have it good then.
__________________
"What is this country coming to when the only people you can legally hate are white, conservative, Christian men?"

"Another innocent victim of APG...."

"I need a self esteem boost.... I think I'll go play walkon!"


Cocker World New to cockers? Want to learn about them? Click the link.
Budha is offline  
Old 05-08-2001, 03:56 PM #4
Yochinaman
Gun Gigolo
 
Yochinaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Ottawa, ON
Yochinaman is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
I agree that the stock stuff probably worked fine. But I've also seen a stock cocker or two that was garbage. That's besides the point. Let's try not to be so harsh. If nobody tried anything with their cocker then this forum would be quite bland (and more empty than it is) and uninteresting. As long as the same question isn't posted over and over again. I don't mind helping if I can. I know you didn't intend to come across as harsh.
As long as no blame is put on anything like "Oh my cocker is CR*P". I encourage people to tinker. You learn a lot that way. More than what anyone could possibly tell you.

Oh yeah, to the original post. Boomsticks aren't the most efficient barrels to begin with as well.

Yochi.
Yochinaman is offline  
Old 05-08-2001, 04:27 PM #5
Rioken
 
 
Rioken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Lexington, KY
 has been a member for 10 years
Inexperienced? I built the gun myself from the ground up and have built several others for people. The reason I changed the tornado valve was because it started leaking bad.
__________________
Spyder Rodeo
-One Kit/Custom Switch
-4 Piece Empire
Rioken is offline  
Old 05-08-2001, 04:36 PM #6
Azure
Dreamer
 
Azure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Wausau, WI
 has been a member for 10 years
Well, the first thing to screw with is springs. I'd suggest the Maddman springs. *Shrugs.* Green Main, Green Valve to start... maybe test with Green Main, Blue Valve. Is the inline/ergo reg set properly?

The valve spring with the Rat is very light, so your valve may be staying open too long.
__________________
Azure
#87 - Team Flying Balls
Sponsored By: Apocalypse Paintball
Azure is offline  
Old 05-08-2001, 08:57 PM #7
Devaut
God.
 
Devaut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: 30117
Devaut is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
you people must read el pirata's misinformation bull****

always start with the springs first, making sure that your hammer and valve are matched properly, if you have to turn your velocity in at all, your gun is springed wrong

that's the flat out truth

-y

and by the way, i will always suggest the use of maddman products springs. they are flat out the best on the market, they are colored for strength level, and it's hard to get it wrong.
Devaut is offline  
Old 05-08-2001, 11:35 PM #8
Ak|rA`
 
 
Ak|rA`'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Fort Bragg, NC
 has been a member for 10 years
budha, you need to STOP telling people not to tinker, you are wasting space on the board...i already saw you get told by devaut i think it was...people will tinker, that is the fun par tof owning a gun...when i got my gun, i had it apart 20min later before i even played with it to see how it worked and stuff...telling people to take their guns to a certified tech will do nothing but waste their money... when and if the problem arises what should they do, TAKE IT BACK TO THE TECH and waste more money? i think not. if you are going to give advice, give advice, if not...don't tell people to take their guns to a tech

sorry if i sound really mean, but i had to say it
Ak|rA` is offline  
Old 05-09-2001, 01:25 AM #9
Rioken
 
 
Rioken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Lexington, KY
 has been a member for 10 years
As far as how I learned to tune my gun like that, I heard it straight from a man from AKALMP. But I'm going to try the madman springs cause its apparent that his method isn't working. Also do the madman valve springs fit newer style cockers?
__________________
Spyder Rodeo
-One Kit/Custom Switch
-4 Piece Empire

Last edited by Rioken : 05-09-2001 at 02:08 AM.
Rioken is offline  
Old 05-09-2001, 04:19 AM #10
Azure
Dreamer
 
Azure's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Wausau, WI
 has been a member for 10 years
Yes, Rioken. The Maddman kit includes 12 springs total.

3 Mainsprings/Hammersprings... each of a different color designating strength (Red - Strong, Blue - Medium, Green - Light).

3 Valve Springs for newer cockers with those same colors.

3 Valve Springs for older cockers with the same color combo.

1 Trigger spring

2 Sear springs... one for 45 frames and one for the standard frame.

Hope that helps.
__________________
Azure
#87 - Team Flying Balls
Sponsored By: Apocalypse Paintball
Azure is offline  
Old 05-09-2001, 03:31 PM #11
Budha
Paint Slüt
 
Budha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Northern VA
 has been a member for 10 years
You know what akra? I try to be a nice guy, and then you come along and make me want to get really mad. I AM ENTITLED TO MY OWN OPINION! I thought Rioken was some newbie kid who just loved to mess with his gun and screwed it up, I guess I was wrong for sterotyping, and rioke, I apologize. But at my field I ref and I see so many young cocker owners who mess with their crap only for them to mess their guns up and make us fix them. Having an air tech work on your gun or even better teach you, is better than some guys who might not know wtf they are talking about and giving out false info. Please, mind your business and dont badmouth me again. Oh yes, I give out 3 times the help you do, so please, shove it. Thank you.

-Budha
__________________
"What is this country coming to when the only people you can legally hate are white, conservative, Christian men?"

"Another innocent victim of APG...."

"I need a self esteem boost.... I think I'll go play walkon!"


Cocker World New to cockers? Want to learn about them? Click the link.
Budha is offline  
Old 05-10-2001, 10:17 AM #12
Rioken
 
 
Rioken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Lexington, KY
 has been a member for 10 years
Budha I understand were you come from. I ref at a field and have to fix cockers that people take to the local store and let their tech (who basically SUCKS!) work on them and I have to fix them.
__________________
Spyder Rodeo
-One Kit/Custom Switch
-4 Piece Empire
Rioken is offline  
Old 05-10-2001, 10:30 AM #13
peter parker
If you build it...
 
peter parker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: New York, NY
peter parker is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
same here

I have the same exact problems with my ratt, and came to the same conclusion - it's all about springs.
Need heavier valve spring.
It suks in a big way when you have to run to the fill station every two or three games.
peter parker is offline  
Old 05-13-2001, 03:04 AM #14
pirate
mutiny!
 
pirate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: the west
pirate is a Supporting Member
pirate is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
Mine isn't at its peak, but its not that bad. What springs are you guys using for optimum performance, and what do you have your regs set at? You would think BBT would catch on and change the springs, maybe they don't even know yet?
pirate is offline  
Old 05-13-2001, 05:32 AM #15
Devaut
God.
 
Devaut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: 30117
Devaut is a Supporting Member
 has been a member for 10 years
depending on the valve's flow rate i use either a green hammer and a green valve from madman. or a green hammer and a blue valve (if the valve is very high flow "tornado")

i usually run my guns around 180-200 for efficency, sometimes i run them at 300 for efficency if the internals aren't as sophisticated.

i make sure to never adjust with the velocity adjuster, and to use delrin bolts to keep my cocking pressure low. orings cause drag, drag=suck

-y
Devaut is offline  
 




Posting Rules
Forum Jump