Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

ReplyRegional Ups
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-01-2008, 04:37 PM #1093
drjeckel
 
 
drjeckel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky...ish
MY OPINION ON PAINTBALL.....I don't care if you don't want it. Its free anyway.

NO Ramping, just unlimited semi... Shooting fast should be a privilage and not a right! Just like spandex.
Cheaters should be called as such and kicked off the field for the day! I don't care what anyone says. I've heard people make comments like; "Oh, you can't tell me that you haven't wipped a hit before"......YES I CAN. And if I see you doing it, I will call you a retard in front of God and everybody!
I am getting tired of people who think of cheating (wipping) as a part of paintball...BECAUSE IT'S NOT. The rules say if you are hit, and the ball breaks on you, you are out. It doesn't say; if someone sees you getting hit then you are out! It doesn't say; If you wipe it before someone sees it then you are still in play. But then again it dosen't say retards can't play either. I think I've said this before, but here it is again. If your team must cheat to win, then stop acting like a bunch of retards humping a door knob and go kill yourselves or quit playing....Either way, makes me no difference.
__________________
Dr jeckel
drjeckel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 02-01-2008, 04:47 PM #1094
mules
 
 
Join Date: May 2007
i hate it when people cheat just makes me want to shoot them more but i hold back
mules is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2008, 03:52 AM #1095
b_dazzle912
.....
 
b_dazzle912's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wisconsin
wow, i ask a question to clarify the rules and i get a monologue about cheating? ok? w/e i guess. i havent wiped...ever... so yeah.... yes, no one likes cheaters but to me thats all just karma. it'll catch up with them
b_dazzle912 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2008, 09:20 AM #1096
mad-engineer
Sand Cat
 
mad-engineer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Wisconsin
 has been a member for 10 years
Hey bd,
You will have to ask the “Don”, Mr. John about what is allowed or what is not at JC. I was just generalizing the dilemma in the industry in my comments.

Sorry if there was any confusion.

All,
As for my opinion, I am personally against ramping in the sport because it takes away from the actual skill and makes people assume that bigger faster markers are the key to winning, which they are not. Just another marketing ploy! I also feel that it is an extreme safety hazard that some in the industry have ranted about for years. What ever happened to following ASTM standards?

As for Cheating for any sport shame on those who do it. Paintball will never be great until teams start acting like Sportsmen. I especially hate seeing new players being taken advantage of at fields. Shooting Noobs all day is definitely not going to encourage them to stay in the sport for very long. I prefer more people to play with on the weekends, for some of the more experience you need to know when to set your limits, even if it means allowing some new guy to mark you out a few times. It is not going to hurt you, but it will definitely drive the confidence of the new player.

Which leads into this last note, we need to be leaders not whiners and people need to control their emotions; it is just a game even if playing for money. There have been too many instances where I have seen player get angry because they messed up or thought the ref call was unfair or poor. Why is there need in throwing equipment and tying to get in fights, its dangerous and could cause injury or death. Hey, that’s the way it goes, don’t blame the ref’s sometimes they just can’t call everything perfect.
mad-engineer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2008, 01:20 PM #1097
b_dazzle912
.....
 
b_dazzle912's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wisconsin
well they way i look at ramping is that it equals out the playing field. If we all shoot the same speed, than nobody has an advantage bc they spent 165 for an ion and the next guy spend 1400 on a Dm8. They would shoot the same amount of balls, in the same amount of time, going about the same speed. See what im getting at here?

I am a player and a ref. and in both cases ill never be able to catch everyone from cheating in one form or another.....hot gun, wipe, continue to play after being hit... i would stop everyone from cheating if i could but im not superman(even though i play like it some times lol). Just a side note on that, in airsoft they play with plastic bb's instead of paintballs. If they get hit they call them selves out and there is no mark that is left. But, what makes that sport work is the honesty! if they feel that someone isn't being 100% honest they kick them out. im not say kick some one out for certain things like playing on with a hit on there pack or w/e but maybe that concept will slow down cheating in the paintball world

shooting newbies are fun...for like the first game but if they quit the sport bc they got shot out but someone who practiced most of the weekends for most of the year. Someone who put blood, sweat and tears into this sport and that newbie is just going to quit..... they aren't made for this sport. yes, i know, we need to help them out. I'm willing to do that and trust me i have! But its hard to train someone who gets rocked by a "pro" and then they wanna quit. When i shoot someone at Action packed (woodsball in Waterloo) i like to go up to them and give them hints on how they can improve and what they did to allow me to shot them. Most time they listen and sometime during the day they will shoot me out and ill go up to them and tell them good job, and other stuff like that.

I guess what im trying to say is that newbie that quit after losing are no better than the "pros" that wipe or cheat to win. I'm willing to help out new players if they are willing to listen and continue with the sport. Those are the players i want to play this AMAZING sport. I love this sport, i work all week and look forward to Playing or Reffing. Regardless of how many times i get shot.
b_dazzle912 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2008, 05:23 PM #1098
KmasterLog
Industrial Revolution
 
KmasterLog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Oconomowoc
I disagree with that statement. A newbie that is chewed apart and is disenchanted with the game is very different than a "pro" who cheats. I have seen countless amounts of people come out to a field to and get blasted by people who think they are BA.

Congratulations, you can shoot someone who has never held a paintball gun before. At the end of the day, I suppose it's just what you are trying to get out of the sport. Some play for recreation, some for fun and others to be super stars.

Why is it fun to shoot noobies? I'd rather let myself get shot by one to increase their sense of pride and accomplishment on the field. As a paintball player we should dedicate ourselves to furthering our sport which includes taking new players under our more experienced wings and teaching them how to fly.

I owe a lot to the people I have played with over the years, they lead me in all the right directions and let me learn what they couldn't teach me. FURTHER THE SPORT. Don't be a DICK.

Also, with the whole "ramping" thing. Everyone shooting at the same speed means nothing. Who cares if someone with an ion is playing against someone with a dm8? If you care that bad about bps difference go play stock class. I hate ramping, I think it's dumb.

Some of us are able to rock out semi auto faster than our loaders and boards can keep up with. *cough micah* If your fingers can't keep up, maybe you shouldn't be trying to shoot so fast.

BPS means nothing. Accuracy by volume is a joke. One shot, one kill. It's called aiming and you would be amazed at how easy it is to win games when you shoot specifically at something instead of holding your finger down and pointing your gun in a general direction.

Cheating is weak and I get pissed when people do it. I'm the angry one.
__________________
Meow Meow Meow

Want Some Kitty Stuff?!?

Does he look like a *****?
KmasterLog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-02-2008, 10:07 PM #1099
junglecat
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Hey BD
Don’t get much time to play here so I’m a little late.
JCP tourneys are unlimited semi-auto, no coaching,- exception being June Carry on Paint tourney [Chicago Like]. Oh - I must note that my insurance guy is telling me that ramping, full auto, grenade launchers, nerf missiles etc., may be deemed hazardous since they are an ASTM violation for “field operation” and allowing such may void my coverage. He is getting back to me this week. Kurt is going to be POed.
Which brings me into some more questions.
How dangerous is a small nerf football flying across the field?
How about water balloon launcher?
How about a catapult pitching pumpkins 150 yds? [guess we won’t be holding the annual pumpkin toss]
Would you guys be interested in a limited paint format game, say everyone gets a hopper? How about ramping and limited paint?
Do you guys think that the lack of a NPPL major in Chicago has tainted the local players’ perception and has by default promoted the PSP format as the it in WI, because it’s the only big show they are likely to go to?
Can anyone tell me who started the adage- “PSP is like playing checkers; the NPPL is like playing chess.”? My sales rep keeps saying it and I’d like to get some dirt on him. I know he was a pro but can there really be that much difference?
Did anyone read Craig’s [miller] interview in Faceful? He and I have almost always seen eye to eye.
Hope you guys enjoy the football game, I've got a truck load of sand I'm putting in bags tommorow.

Thanks
John
__________________
Live honorably, and honor will be bestowed upon you.
Paintball is honor in practice.
www.junglecatpaintball.com
junglecat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2008, 10:38 AM #1100
mules
 
 
Join Date: May 2007
limited paint wouldnt be a bad idea
mules is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-2008, 02:49 PM #1101
b_dazzle912
.....
 
b_dazzle912's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wisconsin
well there is a tourny in MN that is an old school 10 man and 10 ball macth. There is no rule that states what type of gun you need(like a pump or stock class) they do pretty good up there with getting teams but i dont know id it would work down here. If you put it on, i'm not sure if yo would get the same kind of turn out.

i dont see the danger in like throwing a nerf football. People do it all the time in there yards and stuff. Paint grenades do hurt if they are thrown like a base ball. i know i was un the receiving end of one. But, i think if you put in a underhand only or a lob rule that it is less harmful than a paintball.

The NPPL Super 7 i think would be like chess. Its bigger and more people so you cant move as easy as psp. The fact that PSP comes so close to us defintately helps promote them around here. There are many local teams that are going to Chicago to play in it. Also, the Chitown series is little know to us around here. if i was closer to Milwaukee i would do it but what can you do

Well, Enjoy the Super bowl, which ever one you are enjoying jk
b_dazzle912 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2008, 08:55 AM #1102
drjeckel
 
 
drjeckel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky...ish
I do see the point of ramping. I understand how it may appear to make everyone equal in the shooting department. But that only applies to people who own electronic guns.......What about the mechanical guns? For all those people who own old school autocockers, mags, or even the "new" school tippman 98s (Probably one of the highest selling guns in history). For new people that must rent a 98 (Or Black Maxx) at the local field to play with, it can be devistating for them to go against someone who is rainning paint a 13 to 15 BPS consistently when the best return fire they can give is an unconsistent 8 to 10 BPS. In this case ramping is unfair. Besides, ramping takes away from developing skills for accuracy, people just seem to spray and pray. I've seen kmasterlog shoot some people out, who were using some pretty fast guns, and all he had was a pump! And I don't mean he got lucky, he simply got the angles and "one balled" them out. In short ramping isn't fair to new players who don't have the money for guns that supports the technology for ramping, it takes away from the skill of shooting accurately, and it cost people tons of money on paint that is wasted.
__________________
Dr jeckel
drjeckel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2008, 01:23 PM #1103
KmasterLog
Industrial Revolution
 
KmasterLog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Oconomowoc
And I was all like PEW PEW
__________________
Meow Meow Meow

Want Some Kitty Stuff?!?

Does he look like a *****?
KmasterLog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2008, 01:55 PM #1104
drjeckel
 
 
drjeckel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky...ish
Quote:
Originally Posted by KmasterLog View Post
And I was all like PEW PEW
Perhaps I should have used a different example.............
__________________
Dr jeckel
drjeckel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2008, 09:23 PM #1105
junglecat
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
You guys make me laugh like hi how are you!
It's interesting to see old school verses new school. Dr Jeckel when you first showed I considered you new school. Shot fast, latest/greatest, weren't afraid to buy paint. Boy did I have you figured wrong!
Of course I remember KmasterLog running minnions, egos, dms, laying paint out like crazy at one time too- and he can absolutely afford to rip, and now what do you get?

Later
John
__________________
Live honorably, and honor will be bestowed upon you.
Paintball is honor in practice.
www.junglecatpaintball.com
junglecat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2008, 10:25 PM #1106
b_dazzle912
.....
 
b_dazzle912's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wisconsin
maybe im wrong but i like it when i buy something expensive and see results. But i can only really think of 2 major or mid-major sports that you can drop 100 bucks and be in the flow of things.... Basketball and tennis... You cant just jump in and be on par with everyone else. In this day and age it takes practice and money.

Too be fair i shoot a 98, ion, and a ul'd PM7... so i see where you are coming from. One balled sucks. Yes, i have one balled many ppl with all three guns. I won't lie... i like it. but if you take one or two shots at me and miss and i take 10-12 shots and hit you one maybe two times... I believe that you would be out... I will play you any day, you with a 98, old cocker,or whatever all mechanical gun and ill pick up my ion or pm7(in ramp or semi)... speedball, tourny, woodsball, Jungle cat, action packed, apoc. ill let you pick....

i'm not trying to be a dick, im just trying to prove a point...
b_dazzle912 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 10:13 AM #1107
drjeckel
 
 
drjeckel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky...ish
Quote:
Originally Posted by b_dazzle912 View Post
maybe im wrong but i like it when i buy something expensive and see results. But i can only really think of 2 major or mid-major sports that you can drop 100 bucks and be in the flow of things.... Basketball and tennis... You cant just jump in and be on par with everyone else. In this day and age it takes practice and money.

Too be fair i shoot a 98, ion, and a ul'd PM7... so i see where you are coming from. One balled sucks. Yes, i have one balled many ppl with all three guns. I won't lie... i like it. but if you take one or two shots at me and miss and i take 10-12 shots and hit you one maybe two times... I believe that you would be out... I will play you any day, you with a 98, old cocker,or whatever all mechanical gun and ill pick up my ion or pm7(in ramp or semi)... speedball, tourny, woodsball, Jungle cat, action packed, apoc. ill let you pick....

i'm not trying to be a dick, im just trying to prove a point...
What point are you trying to make?.....
I don't mind if someone disagrees with me, I kind of expected it. But lets try to keep the disagreements civil. Don't challenge someone on the field just because you think your right. Lets try to seperate aggression from paintball if we can.
It has been along time since someone made a challenge like that to me, and rest assured they tasted paint. Don't think your going to just walk out on the field and show me something that I haven't see before. I was playing well before guns needed batteries. I'm not sure how good you are, but if your like what I have seen from the new players here lately you may want to refrain from making any points in this manner. Sorry if I offended you, I didn't mean to sound like I am attacking your person. I just got a little defensive. (It must be the MR HYDE in me)
__________________
Dr jeckel
drjeckel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 07:53 PM #1108
KmasterLog
Industrial Revolution
 
KmasterLog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Oconomowoc
Quote:
Originally Posted by b_dazzle912 View Post
maybe im wrong but i like it when i buy something expensive and see results. But i can only really think of 2 major or mid-major sports that you can drop 100 bucks and be in the flow of things.... Basketball and tennis... You cant just jump in and be on par with everyone else. In this day and age it takes practice and money.

Too be fair i shoot a 98, ion, and a ul'd PM7... so i see where you are coming from. One balled sucks. Yes, i have one balled many ppl with all three guns. I won't lie... i like it. but if you take one or two shots at me and miss and i take 10-12 shots and hit you one maybe two times... I believe that you would be out... I will play you any day, you with a 98, old cocker,or whatever all mechanical gun and ill pick up my ion or pm7(in ramp or semi)... speedball, tourny, woodsball, Jungle cat, action packed, apoc. ill let you pick....

i'm not trying to be a dick, im just trying to prove a point...
Deal, anytime you want to go down. I'll play you with your fast gun and i'll use a pump or a slingshot.

/edit
no to sound concieted but there have been plenty of people that have made fun of me for playing pump on a airball field. I have made money betting people that i would bunker them or one ball them with my pump

I'm calling you out.
__________________
Meow Meow Meow

Want Some Kitty Stuff?!?

Does he look like a *****?

Last edited by KmasterLog : 02-06-2008 at 07:57 PM.
KmasterLog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 09:42 PM #1109
b_dazzle912
.....
 
b_dazzle912's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wisconsin
ok you pick the day and ill pick the place
b_dazzle912 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 10:43 PM #1110
KmasterLog
Industrial Revolution
 
KmasterLog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Oconomowoc
Any given sunday at jcp, bring any gun and i'll use a field pump.
__________________
Meow Meow Meow

Want Some Kitty Stuff?!?

Does he look like a *****?
KmasterLog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2008, 11:40 PM #1111
junglecat
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Calm down everyone.
We all love paintball and the game. I am sure bd has a good heart, his passion reflects our own. What we have here is the decade plus old ramp/no ramp debate.
BD you talking to players that have been in the sport for 10-20 yrs. Maybe longer than you have been alive. They were the players that put the work in to build the sport to where others could rape the customer and push the game back to the camo ages.

KM helped referee the first national tournament in WI [what was km 97-98?]. For years he was there at public parks putting up safety netting around baseball diamonds, bunkers in the infields, safety nets in the fairsgrounds, refereeing tournaments all for free; to build awareness for the tournament game. He would go to public events and speak about how the sport wasn't a bunch of wacked out para-military nuts planning to take over the world. Half the public thought that back then. I can't tell you how many times people stopped him [even on the freeway] to ask him about the game because he was a walking ambassador for the game.
I can give even more credits to MadE and DrJ. All these people gave seminars after seminars, year after year, decade after decade to "bring the sport out of the woods" and in the last 8 yrs or so have lobbied against the profit driven co.s that are riding it to death and back into the woods.
Companies that ignore approved established safety standards, based on the equipments own performance tests, just to get a marketing edge. These standards are important because it gives the insurance co. guidelines they can use to establish risk, premiums and availablity of insurance so we can promote the sport as safe and responsible. These are the guys that lobbied for them. A few years back some insurance co.s stopped underwriting policies because of uncertain risks. How can you have a legit sport without legit fields?

WE ALL have the tendency to approach things from our own perspective. Judging from your posts [please forgive me if I am wrong] you are considerably newer to the sport than they, and I understand that you love the sport as much as they. If that is true, you have an less experienced point of view.

Please consider that your perception is the product of marketing. I would guess you perceive that PSP is a strong prosperous league because it is not much different than it was when you first notice them. These guys see tournament ball as a whole and from years ago when it was not uncommon to have 100s teams at an event. They perceive ramping as a gimmick ["that players can only get here"] to attract customers to their league. For years these guys have sat around observed and discussed the similarities in this marketing ploy with others, came up with hypotheses and have seen them coming true.
PSP [their special selling point is ramping] is struggling big time and may even colapse without significant changes. Last year's west coast event when Stinger's D4 team won; only had 13 or 15 teams. That is the largest tournament paintball market in the US! This year they started to change by lowering the BPS limits. Why; because it drops costs for the players by 20% without hurting PSP's margins. So they can get more teams, how long will it take to build up to the mega tourneys we used to go to?

In contrast the NPPL is holding it's own and some contend it is expanding. They have vowed to improve the image of the NPPL, which they are. They operate under the concept that competition breeds competition, and they are working to make sure people perceive it as fair. [I love your idea of kicking Ashats out of competitions- I now decree at JCP I will DQ cheaters!]

Competitors want something to practice to the get the edge on the next guy. If you adopt ramping you remove an area where practice can pay off for a competitor. The costs of paint is the real cost in a tourney- ramping costs all year round not just your initial marker purchase.

Now judging from your earlier comments
Quote:
but if they quit the sport bc they got shot out but someone who practiced most of the weekends for most of the year
and
Quote:
Someone who put blood, sweat and tears into this sport and that newbie is just going to quit..... they aren't made for this sport.
you understand the benefits of practice and the merits of experience; but you have to understand these guys will never say
Quote:
they aren't made for this sport
.

You should come out meet these honorable people learn from them and be part of the rejuvination of tourney ball- just don't tell them who you are!!!


Quote:
i'm not trying to be a dick, im just trying to prove a point...
Later
John
__________________
Live honorably, and honor will be bestowed upon you.
Paintball is honor in practice.
www.junglecatpaintball.com
junglecat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2008, 06:54 AM #1112
mad-engineer
Sand Cat
 
mad-engineer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Wisconsin
 has been a member for 10 years
Exactly the point, Too shay!

I feel the sport is being ruined because of irresponsible selfish corporations; I will not name here thatís not the point. There are things called ethics which is the gray area of business. Yes, corporations are out there to make money there is no problem with that, it is call Capitalism, but the industry as a whole also has a social responsibility to uphold and set standards within. Without self regulation by Company and or Field operation you fall into the scenario we see today, which eventually derogates the sport.

Over twenty years ago you could see the progression of the industry as it strived to induce safer standards. Now there is a total disregard and lack of responsibility of the industry, fields and the players. Who is at fault, I would have to say those who were in business before the paintball explosion of the mid to late 90ís who virtually had a monopoly in the business. Instead of pushing newly established companies to the side they should have embraced them.

Education will always be the forefront to learning the reality of this sport. Until you grasp this knowledge you are not going to grasp its qualities. I challenge those who have been around for a while to take up the lead and nurture those who are just beginning.
mad-engineer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2008, 09:34 AM #1113
drjeckel
 
 
drjeckel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Kentucky...ish
WOW! Look what I started!
__________________
Dr jeckel
drjeckel is offline   Reply With Quote
ReplyRegional Ups


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
Forum Jump