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Old 12-12-2006, 07:49 PM #22
fuhrer325 (Banned)
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Originally Posted by Kellster View Post
It will be? So if I kill someone should I not also be responsible for killing the children he would have had? By your logic I should. Does it matter if it will be? No. If you have no heartbeat or brain activity then you are not alive. A fetus is no different. After the fetus' heart begins to start I can understand why you wouldn't abort it.
If the person is pregnant, yes, you should, and you are by American laws (I believe?)

Otherwise... That "example" bears no relevance to my example.

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huh? what do you mean? like stealing an egg from a farmer? because thats property, and those eggs arent fertilized.
Yep, that's exactly what I was talking about.

No, say I take a turtle egg from the beach... I can be arrested and have charges against me. (That was more of the example I was talking about)
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:51 PM #23
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Abortion is murder, 100% of the time.
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:53 PM #24
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Originally Posted by fuhrer325 View Post
Yep, that's exactly what I was talking about.

No, say I take a turtle egg from the beach... I can be arrested and have charges against me. (That was more of the example I was talking about)
sorry, i didnt know what the hell you meant
like it was said before, turtles are endangered, and therefore are protected. humans are overpopulated. either way, now its your example that bears no relevance
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:55 PM #25
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Here's something that isn't shared when you talk about pro life or pro choice. The emotional consequences and damage that happens to many mothers after an abortion is horrible. Its not an easy road to follow. Many don't deal with it and try to ignore it. There are many, many side affects mentally.

Can a woman do it? Yes. Is it beneficial for her? From an emotional stand point, no. Convenience? Possibly.

All things are permissable, but not all things are beneficial. People get stuck on the debate that they don't see it at all angles. Do I agree with it? No. Its a lose/lose for everyone. Yes, they may gain some freedom that the mother was about to lose, but at a great cost.
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:55 PM #26
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You can get in trouble for stealing the egg of a protected or endangered species, yes. Humans are not endangered. It's not like we don't already have enough unwanted children.
AH! but see, you are acknowledging that that particular egg WILL be a future animal... How is this any different?
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:57 PM #27
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Originally Posted by fuhrer325 View Post
If the person is pregnant, yes, you should, and you are by American laws (I believe?)

Otherwise... That "example" bears no relevance to my example.



Yep, that's exactly what I was talking about.

No, say I take a turtle egg from the beach... I can be arrested and have charges against me. (That was more of the example I was talking about)
The person doesn't have to be pregnant, it can be a man or a woman as they would eventually have children.
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:57 PM #28
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In my opinion, if we are going to keep abortion legal, then you have to pardon every person who has ever gotten a manslaughter charge for killing an unborn child. I hear every few weeks of a drunk driver or some murderer who killed a pregnant mom and got 2 manslaughter charges. Aren't we being hypocritical in doing this?
yes, we are. if a pregnant mother is killed in a car accident by a drunk cdriver, there should only be one charge. period.
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Basing someone elses life on conjecture seems asinine/arbitrary.
but what if not conjecture can we base the consciousness of an embryo on? the bible? what is the bible if not conjecture? and dont tell me its the unabridged word of god, cuz thats not gonna cut it
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Abortion is murder, 100% of the time.
u gonna back that up or just sit there and act smug?
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Old 12-12-2006, 07:59 PM #29
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AH! but see, you are acknowledging that that particular egg WILL be a future animal... How is this any different?
There was never any denying that an embryo at whatever stage will be a future human. Stealing and ruining an egg of an endangered animal and getting an abortion after you have been raped or even just made a bad decision are not even close to the same thing. In my opinion, people who say abortion is murder should take care of the unwanted children themselves.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:00 PM #30
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sorry, i didnt know what the hell you meant
like it was said before, turtles are endangered, and therefore are protected. humans are overpopulated. either way, now its your example that bears no relevance

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AH! but see, you are acknowledging that that particular egg WILL be a future animal... How is this any different?
.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:01 PM #31
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Originally Posted by forgettable View Post
There was never any denying that an embryo at whatever stage will be a future human. Stealing and ruining an egg of an endangered animal and getting an abortion after you have been raped or even just made a bad decision are not even close to the same thing. In my opinion, people who say abortion is murder should take care of the unwanted children themselves.
Who's to say they are unwanted? That's rediculous. Possibly I find that you are unwanted. Should I "take care" of you?
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:04 PM #32
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Who's to say they are unwanted? That's rediculous. Possibly I find that you are unwanted. Should I "take care" of you?
The mother that wants to abort the child is the one to say that it's unwanted...
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:05 PM #33
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Who's to say they are unwanted? That's rediculous. Possibly I find that you are unwanted. Should I "take care" of you?
if they were wanted, they wouldnt be aborted. if she wanted the child she would do everythin she could to raise it, that what ends up happening sometimes.
and your egg reference has already been explained, so i'll not waste my breath
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:16 PM #34
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You're still deciding that a life is unwanted. You don't "own" the person.

(The government does )
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:18 PM #35
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It's easy, don't have sex with someone your not going to have a future with. Even though our world population would be alot bigger without all the sexual transmited dieseases.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:19 PM #36
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You're still deciding that a life is unwanted. You don't "own" the person.

(The government does )
Yes, you are. Do you want the child product of a rape?

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It's easy, don't have sex with someone your not going to have a future with. Even though our world population would be alot bigger without all the sexual transmited dieseases.
Kek...I think if meaningless sex were outlawed, several people in my high school alone would probably kill themselves.
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Last edited by forgettable : 12-12-2006 at 08:22 PM.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:20 PM #37
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Originally Posted by fuhrer325 View Post
You're still deciding that a life is unwanted. You don't "own" the person.

(The government does )
your still deciding its a life. until the heart beats and it no longer needs a nutrient supply from the mother's body, its not a life that can be killed. therefore, its still a part of the mother's body, and she certainly owns her body
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:22 PM #38
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Yes, you are. Do you want the child product of a rape?
Rape is a difficult subject... I understand that it wasn't the persons fault, and they were the victim... However, in that situation, I'd say have the kid.

Just put him up for addoption.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:23 PM #39
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your still deciding its a life. until the heart beats and it no longer needs a nutrient supply from the mother's body, its not a life that can be killed. therefore, its still a part of the mother's body, and she certainly owns her body
Ok, even though you think it is rediculous... Do you believe that those turtle eggs are a life? Yes or no will do here.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:24 PM #40
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Rape is a difficult subject... I understand that it wasn't the persons fault, and they were the victim... However, in that situation, I'd say have the kid.

Just put him up for addoption.
what if nobody wants him? he lives his whole life in and out of orphanages and government homes, never knowing a real family. id say never knowing that life, never even being conscious enough to care, would be the merciful thing to give him
EDIT: and no.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:26 PM #41
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what if nobody wants him? he lives his whole life in and out of orphanages and government homes, never knowing a real family. id say never knowing that life, never even being conscious enough to care, would be the merciful thing to give him
EDIT: and no.
See, that's just basless conjecture again. I have known two people that were addopted. They grew up in great homes and had/are currently having a good life.
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Old 12-12-2006, 08:29 PM #42
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See, that's just basless conjecture again. I have known two people that were addopted. They grew up in great homes and had/are currently having a good life.
i know several people who were adopted. the kid in my sig was adopted. he lived a great life. that doesnt meant he didnt stand the chance of not getting adopted, i've seen/heard about plenty of cases where the unwanted child gets put up for adoption and spends his entire childhood in miserable government homes, when he could have been spared the very consciousness that makes it miserable
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