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Old 09-07-2001, 01:11 AM #64
HuMMaN
 
 
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I have my angel set up properly and I am able to hold a ROF of 15-16 bps, I have yet to chop a ball since I got my new loader. I dont have shoot down and my LPR stays the same all through out the day, in fact the last time my LPR was serviced it was still set at the setting that I had it at before which was about a 3 month span of time, seems like the stock set up will do just as well as any other set up. Thats the nice thing about the stock LPR once you set it you dont have to worry about some one messing around with the knob or screw that is external/ or have a screw back out on me.

This mod can only mean more head aches down the road, it is just another gimmick but you dont have to take my word on it.
Go ahead and waste your cash and think that you are gaining something.

The HuM
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Old 09-07-2001, 02:26 AM #65
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Exactly how are you people getting 12-13 a sec. Or 14-15 a sec.
Viewloader claims it only can feed 12 a sec, and that is in perfect conditions. It also is only for a very short period of time.
9-10 a sec is more real for the feed rate.

I outshoot the loader everytime I shoot a string longer then 5-6 balls. This is both with and without an intellifeed hopper. Yes, both are 2 9-volt hoppers. The LCD read out usually say's 8-10 at the end of the game on my angel.

I think we have people just making up how fast that they are shooting. If you aren't out shooting the loader then you aren't shooting very fast or always shooting short burts. If you are shooting over 12 then chopping will happen often. Reason most places will set the max ROF to 12.

I do think many people call every ball break a chop. Many times I've broken balls in the breech with my battle swap cleaning out the barrel, or the ball broke from the air burst. Some people are so bad they call barrel breaks as a chop.


No mod is going to make you play better. Better players do not have better guns, so the post about the avalance players gun was stupid. They are stock dark angels. This mod should decrease chopping at the expense of looks, and maybe reliabilty.

I don't like the 20,000 14-way clean. I've shot 60,000+ though my angel, and the 14-way has never been cleaned. Actually, angeluser would know if it has more then me.
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Old 09-07-2001, 03:23 AM #66
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Buy a new loader. My VL Revolutions, both "pre-brass eagle" work just fine. I am sorry you have a slow trigger finger.
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Old 09-07-2001, 04:26 AM #67
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I have a new motor with the old style board in my Rev, it spins crazy fast and turns with every shot. I have quite a few people that I can round up that will tell you I have and can still hit a 15 bps string with no gaps or chops. You just gotta have you gun in tune and a good loader. With a couplemagical farries.

The HuM
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Last edited by HuMMaN : 09-07-2001 at 06:01 AM.
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Old 09-07-2001, 05:22 AM #68
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A revy will not feed above 12-14 rps for anything more than short bursts. Period. I also have a pre-be board along with a new motor. It does indeed spin quite fast. However, it is not forcing the balls into the feed tube, merely agitating them to clear jams. At a certain point, spinning the blades faster actually hinders feeding because it pushes the paint away. The RPS counter on the LCD also rounds up and counts bounces. We are not basing our opinions soley on the manufacturers claims, many many people have done this to their angels years ago. They still work fine. I suspect that if you turn the rock pressure back up to 85-90 (reccomended stock pressure) you will not have to clean the 14way as often, however you will chop any paint that gets in the way. Properly maintained, a stock angel will not shoot down until ~18 bps. Currently no loader other than a overdriven warp will feed that fast, so you don't run into it. Once the HALO comes out, you will be able to feed that fast, if not stock, a little voltage added in series will up its feed rate. Unlike agitator hoppers, the faster the HALO spins, the faster it feeds. If you don't believe me, the patent office has some great technical drawings of it, dated late 1999.

Coolangeltech, I thought it was just me having double feed problems with hellfire. I was double feeding like mad at MMG, the hellfire was rolling right past the detente which was screwed in all the way. Luckily it wasn't breaking and fouling up my barrel.

Since it looks like i'll have plenty of free time this weekend (no computer) and I need to test out the ricochet to find out exactly how fast it feeds before it skips, i'll also do the same test to both an intellifeed rev, a pre-be rev and a BE rev. I will be performing all tests on FA and precisely measuring the ROF with a microphone and a computer program that dispays the audio waveform so I can count the peaks. I already dumped an entire hopper thru the rico at 10bps with no skips or chops.
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Old 09-07-2001, 05:26 AM #69
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The speed of the motor does little to nothing to help increase ROF, it's all about the paddle design and the way the paint goes into the gun. When you have a Revo running w/ little paint you see what happens, the paint just get kicked around the hopper and doesn't go into the gun...obviously you guys don't know what you're talking about with your "crazy super fast" hoppers.

Also, if you're judging your ROF on bursts then sure it can be that high, but we all know for a fact you aren't hitting 13-15bps sustained, because the current technology for the revolution just isn't there. When HALO's become readily available, maybe I'll start believing it..but as it stands, the Angel is a poor judge of ROF...it takes the the amount of times you pulled and the time in between them and divides that by 1 second.

So say you pull 3 times in 15ms, that means you'ld be pulling 20bps sustained if you could hold it...and that's what the Angel outputs.

So please stop ranting about how educated you are on the subject, when all you are saying is a common misconception. Maybe when you present us with some facts we can begin to believe you, but as it stands, they're unsubstantiated claims.

Don't like what I just said because it isn't what you wanted to hear? Then you know what you have to do...make a sound file of you shooting paint sustained for 13-15bps...not with just air.

Mike
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Old 09-07-2001, 05:42 AM #70
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I love you.
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Old 09-07-2001, 06:08 AM #71
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I see that you are one of those type of people that probably would have stood back and said that flying to the moon was impossible, or breaking the sound barrier would never happen. But it did happen...

What ever you say must be gold, and I see that you are so set in your beliefs that no one else could possibly be right.
But so was that crazy guy in Germany back in the 40's, I guess he wasn't so right...

I didnt say that I can set the gun up and let it shoot F/A and it would feed non stop with absolutly no skips, I can hit burst which means the hopper was able to keep a stream of paint flowing into the feedtube without knocking the paint all around. So I guess I would have to thank gravity on that one. Unless you believe that gravity couldnt help in anyway.

The HuM
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Old 09-07-2001, 06:22 AM #72
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In bursts, the hopper has nothing to do with fast rates of fire. Gravity does. In fact, thats the only thing acting on them. In a straight vertical stack high rates of fire have been achieved for short durations of time.

I am a great supporter of the space program and believe we are currently not trying hard enough to achieve our place among the stars. We should be to Mars by now, or at least have gone back to the moon a few times. However public interest is not what it was in the 60s when propaganda and the cold war demanded fast rocket production.

Interesting that you mention being set in your ways. At least my eyes are open to new possiblities. YOU are the one writing it off without ever having seen one shoot. Where is YOUR faith that the sound barrier can be broken. Where is YOUR faith that the moon is attainable.

Edit: spelling

Last edited by Skyssx : 09-07-2001 at 06:28 AM.
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Old 09-07-2001, 11:12 AM #73
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Sounds right Bob

Bob,

That's exactly how my gun performs. At the last tourney I was at I had a double feed due to small paint and a stuck detente and I had a chop, shell was caught in the bolt and I didn't know enough to just jam the bolt back. As a result I missed my first snap shot on their last guy and since he shot out our (second to) last guy before I had my gun cleared it could have cost us the game. Luckily it didn't, but if I could do anything to make the bolt bounce off a ball and not chop it I would be all for it. Other than feeding problems I also have no chops, but even one can be too many
Hence my interest in this product.

Thanks for the info,

Matt

Last edited by FlyingBalls : 09-07-2001 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 09-07-2001, 11:23 AM #74
Malice
Quote:
Originally posted by HuMMaN
I see that you are one of those type of people that probably would have stood back and said that flying to the moon was impossible, or breaking the sound barrier would never happen. But it did happen...

What ever you say must be gold, and I see that you are so set in your beliefs that no one else could possibly be right.
But so was that crazy guy in Germany back in the 40's, I guess he wasn't so right...

I didnt say that I can set the gun up and let it shoot F/A and it would feed non stop with absolutly no skips, I can hit burst which means the hopper was able to keep a stream of paint flowing into the feedtube without knocking the paint all around. So I guess I would have to thank gravity on that one. Unless you believe that gravity couldnt help in anyway.

The HuM
O my god where do these people come from? You sound like a newbie. Maybe you have the magic elves that make your hopper feed at 16 balls per second.

Malice
 
Old 09-07-2001, 12:52 PM #75
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I must start by saying that being of the cocker faithful for quite some time and this being my first Angel that I believe that Palmer makes extremely high quality regs. That being said, there is a pretty good reason that the Angel has zero field adjustable parts. Just take a look in the staging area at the gaggle of people trying to just get there guns to fire and cycle properly, adjusting this and that until it's just wacked! I'm sure that this mod is of the highest quality parts and design, is it really something that will improve the function of your marker is the question. just remember that manufactures spend millions engineering and tooling to make a functioning product, you would be hard pressed to spend $100 and improve upon it much.. The rock is probably a better reg than the WDP, does an Angel *really* need a better one??
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Old 09-07-2001, 01:42 PM #76
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<<I have a new motor with the old style board in my Rev, it spins crazy fast and turns with every shot. I have quite a few people that I can round up that will tell you I have and can still hit a 15 bps string with no gaps or chops. You just gotta have you gun in tune and a good loader. With a couplemagical farries. >>

Care to tell me what shot counter you used? Shooting in your house is not the same as on the field. If you aren't using a shot counter then you are just making up numbers.

Care to tell me why you brought a shot counter on to the field if you claim to have used one.

I have the old style rev as well. Plus I have an intellifeed one, which feeds faster.

You people do not have magic hoppers. They don't feed faster then the rest of the people here.

If you don't ever chop then 1, you don't play much. 2, you shoot slow.

There is no other option.
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Old 09-07-2001, 01:45 PM #77
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What I hear is rhetoric and the splitting of hairs. Some of you may want to work on your comprehension skills. "Easily hit 13-14 balls a second". Nowhere does this imply a sustained or prolonged rate of fire. In my opinion this new mod is really not needed on a properly tuned Angel. You should not always believe what you read. The HALO is very nice. Do not need to go to any patent office since I have known Tex for over ten years and was the guy who introduced him to his wife. You wonder why my loaders work well?

Theory helps us bear our ignorance of the facts.

~Robert
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Old 09-07-2001, 01:58 PM #78
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I don't see why there is soo much tention between all you guys... if the product works it works. One of the biggest reasons that i didn't get and angel was because of the fact that it dose chop on occasion. I've seen the way some chopp like madd and thats not something I would want. This is hte biggest reason i want for a matrix. The trinity ofr hte matrix dose the same thing that thie free flow mod dose for the angel. Let them prove there product to you before you say it's not worthy or dosen't work. If a mod works adn helps i see no reason for not giving it a chance.
Out Jay
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Old 09-07-2001, 02:03 PM #79
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CoolAngelTech, when you say you did 13-15bps, you say that you hit THIRTEEN TO FIFTEEN BALLS PER SECOND, now pardon my poor English skills, but doesn't that mean that you shot 13-15 balls? Yes. So why don't YOU try and reword your statements to reflect the truth instead of the misconceptions.

Jeezus I didn't believe people could be so dumb...it's not even funny anymore, I try to take things in stride, but this is beyond me...you and your friend HuMMaN talk about your 15bps Angel's over and over and over, Skyssx and I present the facts and then you turn back on your statements...why?

Answer that please.

Mike
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Old 09-07-2001, 02:14 PM #80
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You're funny. Again, for the last time "A properly tuned and maintained Angel does not have shoot down nor does it chop paint unless there is a problem with other variables i.e. bad loader or airsystem". If you do not subscribe to this theory then so be it. Get over yourself.

~Robert
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Old 09-07-2001, 02:42 PM #81
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A properly tuned Angel moves the ram at 90 psi, yes that is enough to chop a ball...no a Revolution will not feed fast enough for it not to chop so maybe YOU have the slow fingers...again you dodge the question...give us some specs, stop beating around the bush with your properly tuned this, and bad loader that.

Mike
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Old 09-07-2001, 02:49 PM #82
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lol.......... you said "Beating around the Bush"



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Old 09-07-2001, 02:54 PM #83
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To those who have this mod, or to Ethan

Is the lower pressure enough to always pinch? 65 psi on the ram? Can you stick your finger in there to stop the bolt or not? I was able to do this with my old autococker and am curious as to what extent this mod will relieve the chopping ability of a stock Angel.

Matt
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Old 09-07-2001, 03:04 PM #84
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<<Theory helps us bear our ignorance of the facts. >>

Is this you claiming to shoot 13-15 a sec, but not use a shot counter to actually know?

Or is this you claiming to have a hopper that feeds faster then the rest of us.


Anyone that claims there stuff is better then everyone elses isn't the most informed person
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