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Old 12-07-2006, 06:11 PM #22
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Just curious as to what people's views are on hell. Some christians believe it is a physical place of eternal torment.
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Old 12-07-2006, 06:34 PM #23
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If hell is anywhere as bad as they say it is, God cannot truly love us. It doesn't make sense-we are given the free will to do whatever we want and we are given secular desires but if we don't do things God's way we burn for all eternity? Yeah, no.
It's justice. He gave us laws, we broke them. What should He do with lawbreakers (murderers, adulterers, liars, thieves, etc)? Look the other way? How would you feel about a judge who said to a killer "Well, I love you so I won't send you to prison. You're free to go"? He wouldn't be a judge for long because that isn't justice.
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Old 12-07-2006, 06:49 PM #24
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I believe there is no hell
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Old 12-07-2006, 07:06 PM #25
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Old 12-07-2006, 07:10 PM #26
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Well there is really no such thing as heaven or hell so I guess no one can give a real answer.
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Old 12-07-2006, 07:39 PM #27
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Old 12-07-2006, 07:57 PM #28
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Ok so my stance on it is I believe there is no hell, why?
Well because I feel the church invented it sometime in the past, to gain power from people who normally would not go to church, so all in all hell was invented as a form of power
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Old 12-08-2006, 08:30 AM #29
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It's justice. He gave us laws, we broke them. What should He do with lawbreakers (murderers, adulterers, liars, thieves, etc)? Look the other way? How would you feel about a judge who said to a killer "Well, I love you so I won't send you to prison. You're free to go"? He wouldn't be a judge for long because that isn't justice.

It's not just lawbreakers. The bible clearly says you can't get to heaven unless you accept Jesus into your heart. You could be the best human on earth, but without Jesus, you are doomed.

I personally don't believe in that, but many do, and it's scary.
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Old 12-08-2006, 08:36 AM #30
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It's justice. He gave us laws, we broke them. What should He do with lawbreakers (murderers, adulterers, liars, thieves, etc)? Look the other way? How would you feel about a judge who said to a killer "Well, I love you so I won't send you to prison. You're free to go"? He wouldn't be a judge for long because that isn't justice.
He gave us laws and he also gave us the desire to break them. That would be like giving someone a bowl of cereal who hasn't eaten in weeks, and telling them not to eat it. And why should I follow his laws? I go out of my way to not hurt people, including myself, but I am not going to listen to everything God says just because there might be a hell.

And still, if hell is as bad as they say it is, just for breaking a few menial rules...I don't buy it. One of the many reasons I know there is no God.
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Old 12-08-2006, 08:38 AM #31
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It's not just lawbreakers. The bible clearly says you can't get to heaven unless you accept Jesus into your heart. You could be the best human on earth, but without Jesus, you are doomed.
Yes, it's just lawbreakers. Can you show me a single person who has never broken any of the 10 Commandments for example? Who has never lied, stolen something, or blasphemed God?

And where does the Bible say you have to accept Jesus into your heart? I hear lots of Christians say that but I'll give you $9 if you can find it in the Bible.

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He gave us laws and he also gave us the desire to break them. That would be like giving someone a bowl of cereal who hasn't eaten in weeks, and telling them not to eat it. And why should I follow his laws? I go out of my way to not hurt people, including myself, but I am not going to listen to everything God says just because there might be a hell.
Then you don't understand justice. God made the universe, He owns it and and He's in charge. Breaking His rules (no matter how trivial you think they are) is a serious offence and He can't overlook broken laws.
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Old 12-08-2006, 08:51 AM #32
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Then you don't understand justice. God made the universe, He owns it and and He's in charge. Breaking His rules (no matter how trivial you think they are) is a serious offence and He can't overlook broken laws.
No I understand "justice". He gives us no reason to follow them and also encourages us to break them by our natural desires, then he sends us to some horrible place-FOR ALL ETERNITY. How is that punishment? You can't learn your lesson, you are ****ed down there forever. It's just a BS tactic to increase conversion.
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Old 12-08-2006, 09:25 AM #33
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Yes, it's just lawbreakers. Can you show me a single person who has never broken any of the 10 Commandments for example? Who has never lied, stolen something, or blasphemed God?

And where does the Bible say you have to accept Jesus into your heart? I hear lots of Christians say that but I'll give you $9 if you can find it in the Bible.
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Just lawbreakers huh? What about Moses and David? They both were murderers and went to heaven.
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Old 12-08-2006, 09:28 AM #34
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Just lawbreakers huh? What about Moses and David? They both were murderers and went to heaven.
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No I understand "justice". He gives us no reason to follow them and also encourages us to break them by our natural desires, then he sends us to some horrible place-FOR ALL ETERNITY. How is that punishment? You can't learn your lesson, you are ****ed down there forever. It's just a BS tactic to increase conversion.
Do you blame God for things you've done?
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Old 12-08-2006, 09:36 AM #35
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Do you blame God for things you've done?
No, I blame him for making me want to do bad things.
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Old 12-08-2006, 09:38 AM #36
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No, I blame him for making me want to do bad things.
Ok, so who do you feel is ultimately responsible for what you do? Maybe you would have never stolen if you didn't want to but a desire is not the same as a compulsion. So whose fault is it?
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Old 12-08-2006, 09:47 AM #37
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God loving us is a theory, not really a fact.
Then I hope you find that theory out for yourself someday.
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Old 12-08-2006, 02:14 PM #38
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I'm with chodeyg. I think the whole hell thing is crazy, it's one of the reasons I don't agree with Christianity. God is supposedly perfect, loving, and holy in all ways. He creates an inherently sinful being, then if we don;t act right we burn forever? It simply doesn't make any sense. The only thing we have to go on as far as how we're supposed to live is a book that was written a long time ago.

EDIT - And why am I supposed to be sorry for sinning if I was created a sinner? (But I am sorry for straying off topic.)
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Old 12-08-2006, 02:21 PM #39
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EDIT - And why am I supposed to be sorry for sinning if I was created a sinner? (But I am sorry for straying off topic.)

You weren't created as a sinner. You were created perfect.
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Old 12-08-2006, 02:28 PM #40
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You weren't created as a sinner. You were created perfect.
Tell that to the guy born with half a brain and no legs.
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Old 12-08-2006, 02:32 PM #41
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Tell that to the guy born with half a brain and no legs.
My idea of perfect is different from yours. What is to say that person isn't the model of perfection and we are all actually imperfect?
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Old 12-08-2006, 02:34 PM #42
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You weren't created as a sinner. You were created perfect.
Isn't one of the fundamental ideas of Christianity that we are created inherently sinful/evil?
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