Bible Errancy - Page 2 - PbNation
Find fields & stores near you!
Find fields and stores
Zipcode
PbNation News
PbNation News
Community Focus
Community Focus

 
Archived Thread - Cannot Edit  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:14 AM #22
X_Paint
Once dead, now alive.
 
X_Paint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mps2216 View Post
" 'It is not good for man to be alone. I will make a helper who is like him.' So the Lord God formed out of the ground each wild animal and each bird of the sky "

Sounds to me like the animals were made specifically for Adam, which leads to my previous point.
Syntx - sentence structure - read it again -

18 And the LORD God said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him.” 19 Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them. And whatever Adam called each living creature, that was its name. 20 So Adam gave names to all cattle, to the birds of the air, and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper comparable to him.
21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall on Adam, and he slept; and He took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh in its place. 22 Then the rib which the LORD God had taken from man He made into a woman, and He brought her to the man.
23 And Adam said:
“This is now bone of my bones
And flesh of my flesh;
She shall be called Woman,
Because she was taken out of Man.”


make him a helper comparable to him.

Out of the ground - that's how every animal was made -

not found a helper comparable to him. nothing comparable -

Then the rib which the LORD God had taken from man He made into a woman, Woman not made from ground - but part of Adam. The two being one - something comparable.

Where does it say anything about animals being comparable or a sex toy for Adam. Wouldn't that be conjecture?
__________________
Ego is the opiate that dulls the pain of being obviously stupid.
X_Paint is offline  
Old Sponsored Links Remove Advertisement
Advertisement
Old 12-07-2006, 12:15 AM #23
X_Paint
Once dead, now alive.
 
X_Paint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mps2216 View Post
This implies to me that the animals were made specifically for Adam's satisfaction.
No - it doesn't say that anywhere - the plants and insect came from the ground to - do you think God thought Adam might like to hump a daisey?
__________________
Ego is the opiate that dulls the pain of being obviously stupid.
X_Paint is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:18 AM #24
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by X_Paint View Post
Syntx - sentence structure - read it again -

18 And the LORD God said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him.” 19 Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them. And whatever Adam called each living creature, that was its name. 20 So Adam gave names to all cattle, to the birds of the air, and to every beast of the field. But for Adam there was not found a helper comparable to him.
21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall on Adam, and he slept; and He took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh in its place. 22 Then the rib which the LORD God had taken from man He made into a woman, and He brought her to the man.
23 And Adam said:
“This is now bone of my bones
And flesh of my flesh;
She shall be called Woman,
Because she was taken out of Man.”


make him a helper comparable to him.

Out of the ground - that's how every animal was made -

not found a helper comparable to him. nothing comparable -

Then the rib which the LORD God had taken from man He made into a woman, Woman not made from ground - but part of Adam. The two being one - something comparable.

Where does it say anything about animals being comparable or a sex toy for Adam. Wouldn't that be conjecture?
So you're point is that the statement "I will make him a helper comparable to him." is irrelevant to the sentence that follows which says the animals arose from the ground? In other words the animals were not intended to be helpers comparable to him?
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:19 AM #25
Hirophant0
Historian at large
 
Hirophant0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Hirophant0 is an NCPA player
Hirophant0 plays in the APPA D5 division
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hirophant0 View Post
what does X paint think about the idea that if god is perfect, why did he create us? It seems that a perfect being wouldn't want/need anything....
.
__________________
CONSUMER REPORTS 30+/0-
Hirophant0 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:19 AM #26
graysonp
Me = Awesome
 
graysonp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Southern KY
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mps2216 View Post
This implies to me that the animals were made specifically for Adam's satisfaction.
Even if the animals were made for Adam's satisfaction, why do you assume that it's sexual satisfaction? Can't Adam have a pet?
graysonp is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:20 AM #27
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by X_Paint View Post
No - it doesn't say that anywhere - the plants and insect came from the ground to - do you think God thought Adam might like to hump a daisey?
He only says animal and birds. And it appears to me that he is unaware of what will satisfy Adam. "And no helper was found comparable to him" The animals were presented to him in a search of which would be comparable to him. None of which were found. So Eve was made.
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:25 AM #28
X_Paint
Once dead, now alive.
 
X_Paint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hirophant0 View Post
. what does X paint think about the idea that if god is perfect, why did he create us? It seems that a perfect being wouldn't want/need anything....

Why would a perfect being not want fellowship?
__________________
Ego is the opiate that dulls the pain of being obviously stupid.
X_Paint is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:25 AM #29
X_Paint
Once dead, now alive.
 
X_Paint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mps2216 View Post
He only says animal and birds. And it appears to me that he is unaware of what will satisfy Adam. "And no helper was found comparable to him" The animals were presented to him in a search of which would be comparable to him. None of which were found. So Eve was made.
Just because you assume it to be so, does not make it an error.
__________________
Ego is the opiate that dulls the pain of being obviously stupid.
X_Paint is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:27 AM #30
Hirophant0
Historian at large
 
Hirophant0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Hirophant0 is an NCPA player
Hirophant0 plays in the APPA D5 division
Quote:
Originally Posted by X_Paint View Post
Why would a perfect being not want fellowship?
To me it doesn't seem to fit with the idea of perfect, to want something
__________________
CONSUMER REPORTS 30+/0-
Hirophant0 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:29 AM #31
visionimpulse2k3
S.N.A.F.U
 
visionimpulse2k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Paintball Daves
 has been a member for 10 years
Think about this...

God is perfect, yet wants to give us eternal life with Him!

He just lets us choose what we want!
__________________
SNAFU
Feedback

St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle...

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...0#post18848880
visionimpulse2k3 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:30 AM #32
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by X_Paint View Post
Just because you assume it to be so, does not make it an error.
I didn't assume anything in that respect. I'm going by the scripture. The only thing I might be assuming is that the animals were meant to pleasure him sexually. But again, I can only think of one reason why Eve would be satisfying to Adam whereas all other animals are not.
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:31 AM #33
Hirophant0
Historian at large
 
Hirophant0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Hirophant0 is an NCPA player
Hirophant0 plays in the APPA D5 division
Quote:
Originally Posted by visionimpulse2k3 View Post
Think about this...

God is perfect, yet wants to give us eternal life with Him!

He just lets us choose what we want!
I see what you are saying, but would a perfect being have wants and needs?
__________________
CONSUMER REPORTS 30+/0-
Hirophant0 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:33 AM #34
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by X_Paint View Post
Why would a perfect being not want fellowship?
Why would a perfect being want fellowship from vastly imperfect beings? Why would a perfect being want fellowship period? With perfection, there is no emotion, no needs, no desires. To claim that God is essentially "lonely" is only a testament to his imperfection.
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:34 AM #35
visionimpulse2k3
S.N.A.F.U
 
visionimpulse2k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Paintball Daves
 has been a member for 10 years
not needs...not at all...but maybe wants.

Just like prayer...

When we praise and glorify God, he is not gaining anything from it...not at all. How could He gain anything? He is already the best thing possible...right?

This means that when we pray and do other things, it is not for God, but for us....

Yet, God still instructed us to pray and pay Him homage...

So...in conclusion, I think God wants to help us out, meaning he wants eternal salvation for us..
__________________
SNAFU
Feedback

St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle...

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...0#post18848880
visionimpulse2k3 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:36 AM #36
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by visionimpulse2k3 View Post
not needs...not at all...but maybe wants.

Just like prayer...

When we praise and glorify God, he is not gaining anything from it...not at all. How could He gain anything? He is already the best thing possible...right?

This means that when we pray and do other things, it is not for God, but for us....

Yet, God still instructed us to pray and pay Him homage...

So...in conclusion, I think God wants to help us out, meaning he wants eternal salvation for us..
A perfect God wouldn't want anything. This is because he has everything. If he didn't he wouldn't be perfect.
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:39 AM #37
Hirophant0
Historian at large
 
Hirophant0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Hirophant0 is an NCPA player
Hirophant0 plays in the APPA D5 division
Quote:
Originally Posted by visionimpulse2k3 View Post
not needs...not at all...but maybe wants.

Just like prayer...

When we praise and glorify God, he is not gaining anything from it...not at all. How could He gain anything? He is already the best thing possible...right?

This means that when we pray and do other things, it is not for God, but for us....

Yet, God still instructed us to pray and pay Him homage...

So...in conclusion, I think God wants to help us out, meaning he wants eternal salvation for us..
I understand that God does want things, but I don't understand why a perfect being wants things in general, a perfect being would not want anything. At least in my view it violates the idea of being perfect.......agree to disagree.

Some times you just got to say: "When in Rome"
__________________
CONSUMER REPORTS 30+/0-
Hirophant0 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:40 AM #38
visionimpulse2k3
S.N.A.F.U
 
visionimpulse2k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Paintball Daves
 has been a member for 10 years
But if God is perfect...he must have perfect love correct????

He may not gain anything by us getting into heaven...but his LOVE is so PERFECT that he wants us to be happy, even though it may not affect him...


I am kinda just babbling...but also remember...Human minds are not able to wrap around this kinda stuff.....This is God we are talking about, we know nothing compared to Him..
__________________
SNAFU
Feedback

St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle...

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...0#post18848880
visionimpulse2k3 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:43 AM #39
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by visionimpulse2k3 View Post
But if God is perfect...he must have perfect love correct????

He may not gain anything by us getting into heaven...but his LOVE is so PERFECT that he wants us to be happy, even though it may not affect him...


I am kinda just babbling...but also remember...Human minds are not able to wrap around this kinda stuff.....This is God we are talking about, we know nothing compared to Him..
Love is an emotion of an imperfect being. It is the need and attachment to another being. Essentially God would be in "love" with himself. (If he was truly perfect)

Which is the problem I have with Christianity, Islam, Judaism, etc... I don't think it's possible to have all the answers, which they claim they do.
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:45 AM #40
visionimpulse2k3
S.N.A.F.U
 
visionimpulse2k3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Paintball Daves
 has been a member for 10 years
Oh they dont believe they have the answers...They just use human terms to allow others to understand the concepts..

The Divine cannot be totally understood...but men will always keep trying
__________________
SNAFU
Feedback

St. Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle...

http://www.pbnation.com/showthread.p...0#post18848880
visionimpulse2k3 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 12:51 AM #41
Mps2216
Control Yourself
 
Mps2216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: London
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by visionimpulse2k3 View Post
Oh they dont believe they have the answers...They just use human terms to allow others to understand the concepts..

The Divine cannot be totally understood...but men will always keep trying
Claiming that there is a Hell and Heaven (Asserting the afterlife). Claiming that God was able to present himself on Earth as a human (How does a perfect god epitomize himself in an imperfect entity?). Claiming that God created the earth and the universe. Asserting the purpose of life. These are all the existential questions that particularly Christianity lays claim to. (Sorry to only refer to Christianity, but I am less familiar with Judaism and Islam)

Wow this thread has already gotten off topic.
__________________
WashU '12
SC Rage RKPB
Mps2216 is offline  
Old 12-07-2006, 08:44 AM #42
RamboPreacher
Player not a Pro.
 
RamboPreacher's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Central Iowa
RamboPreacher is a founding member
 has been a member for 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mps2216 View Post
Claiming that there is a Hell and Heaven (Asserting the afterlife). Claiming that God was able to present himself on Earth as a human (How does a perfect god epitomize himself in an imperfect entity?). Claiming that God created the earth and the universe. Asserting the purpose of life. These are all the existential questions that particularly Christianity lays claim to. (Sorry to only refer to Christianity, but I am less familiar with Judaism and Islam)

Wow this thread has already gotten off topic.
jumping in at the end, sorry...
The issue of Jesus' dual-nature and hypostatic union is an interesting topic. since this thread is about bible errancy/inerrancy, do you have a particular reference to discuss (yes, I know you said it was off topic, but this is my post in attempt to swing it back around).
__________________
Brent "RamboPreacher" Hoefling
Founder of the CPPA - Christian Paintball Players Association
Member of: † Christ † Krew † #82

"I believe, in order to understand" or "I understand in order to believe": Augustine/Anselm (paraphrase)
"Science, and especially physics is not about 'truths' - It's about forming beliefs that are less false"; Dr. S. James Gates, Jr.
RamboPreacher is offline  
 




Posting Rules
Forum Jump